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jorge
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Reged: 13/07/05
Posts: 88
Loc: Orange Park, Florida
VERNEY-CARRON SAFARI STD 450NE 3 1/4"
      #204208 - 02/03/12 03:21 AM

Howdy gents, haven't posted here in a while but I figured you gents would appreciate this. Had it fitted at the Dallas Safari Club Convention in January 2010, ordered it in April and delivered in September. Twenty-Five inch barrels, ejector and I just had to have it in Color Case Hardened. The rifle fits me very well and she shoots!







Factory and my targets with factory Hornady DGX/DGX:



Edited by CptCurl (02/03/12 10:02 PM)


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CptCurlAdministrator
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Reged: 01/05/04
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Re: VERNEY-CARRON SAFARI STD 450NE 3 1/4" [Re: jorge]
      #204211 - 02/03/12 03:26 AM

jorge,

That certainly is a beauty and in a very practical caliber. It should be useful for most purposes and a joy to shoot.

Thanks for posting, and please come back often.

Curl

--------------------
RoscoeStephenson.com

YOUR DOUBLE RIFLE IS YOUR BEST FRIEND.



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tinker
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Re: VERNEY-CARRON SAFARI STD 450NE 3 1/4" [Re: jorge]
      #204212 - 02/03/12 03:27 AM

Great looking rifle.
Have you been making handloads for it yet?




Cheers
Tinker

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...


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jorge
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Reged: 13/07/05
Posts: 88
Loc: Orange Park, Florida
Re: VERNEY-CARRON SAFARI STD 450NE 3 1/4" [Re: tinker]
      #204218 - 02/03/12 03:54 AM

Thanks Cpt, I'll make it a point to come back and be a regular again. Tinker, boy have I ever! I had no problems duplicating accuracy with both Hornady and Woodleighs. I used 98gr of H-4831 for the Hornadys to achieve around 2120 fps and 100grs with the Woodleighs for the same velocity.





Edited by CptCurl (02/03/12 10:02 PM)


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tinker
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Re: VERNEY-CARRON SAFARI STD 450NE 3 1/4" [Re: jorge]
      #204223 - 02/03/12 04:52 AM

Sweet.

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...


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Matt_Graham
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Reged: 26/02/04
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Re: VERNEY-CARRON SAFARI STD 450NE 3 1/4" [Re: tinker]
      #204260 - 02/03/12 01:22 PM

Wow that is a beauty!!!

--------------------
www.huntaust.com.au


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Sville
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Re: VERNEY-CARRON SAFARI STD 450NE 3 1/4" [Re: Matt_Graham]
      #204279 - 03/03/12 12:13 AM

Practical and nice looking rifle, will serve you well!!!

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EricD
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Re: VERNEY-CARRON SAFARI STD 450NE 3 1/4" [Re: Sville]
      #204298 - 03/03/12 07:21 AM

Congratulations with your new rifle Jorge! Good to see you back by the way!

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jorge
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Reged: 13/07/05
Posts: 88
Loc: Orange Park, Florida
Re: VERNEY-CARRON SAFARI STD 450NE 3 1/4" [Re: EricD]
      #204310 - 03/03/12 10:09 AM

Thanks, Eric. I should have never left in the first place!

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AkMike
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Re: VERNEY-CARRON SAFARI STD 450NE 3 1/4" [Re: jorge]
      #204335 - 03/03/12 02:20 PM

That is a fine looking rifle Jorge!

Let us know how the CEB's work out for you this weekend!

--------------------
"When you see that in order to produce, you need to obtain permission from men who produce nothing; when you see that money is flowing to those who deal not in goods, but in favors; you may know that your society is doomed." Ayn Rand


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jorge
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Reged: 13/07/05
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Re: VERNEY-CARRON SAFARI STD 450NE 3 1/4" [Re: AkMike]
      #204410 - 04/03/12 12:12 PM

Hi guys, went to the range today. I just loaded four rounds, two each with 97 and 98 gr of H-4831 respectively. That is the same load I use with my DGX loads. While I achieved passable hunting accuracy, (4"@ 50) that's over twice what I am getting with DGXs and Woodleighs. Bullet hole geometry was almost identical to what I get with the aforementioned bullets so that is a good indicator in my view. I just need to figure out a way to bump up the speed but like I mentioned before, I'm running out of case capacity and I do not want to change powders (H-4831). I can cheat a bit I suppose by seating them out farther, but I am loathe to run into pressure issues with the bullets too close to the lands. Too bad there isn't anybody that has experimented with the 450NE and the CEBs so I could use that as a starting point. I think I can get away with 99-101 gr and still seat to factory OAL. jorge

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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: VERNEY-CARRON SAFARI STD 450NE 3 1/4" [Re: jorge]
      #204417 - 04/03/12 12:49 PM

Why bother with CEB's then. Just use the Woodleighs. The beasties will never know the difference.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
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jorge
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Re: VERNEY-CARRON SAFARI STD 450NE 3 1/4" [Re: NitroX]
      #204422 - 04/03/12 01:07 PM

Just something else to experiment with, especially given what has been published about barrel strain, penetration, etc, particualry with both Woodleigh and DGS'. Right now all I've experimented with have been DGS/Xs and Woodleigh softs. As you can see from the target above, I'm good to go with any of those, but I do think the CEB to be a superior bullet to them. jorge

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jorge
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Re: VERNEY-CARRON SAFARI STD 450NE 3 1/4" [Re: jorge]
      #205291 - 17/03/12 12:30 AM

BBW #13 480 grain solids with 100gr H-4831 @ 50 yards 2130 MV (geometry is my fault as I tend to cant the rifle):




And at 25 yards, not bad!



Edited by CptCurl (17/03/12 03:18 AM)


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HogPilot
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Re: VERNEY-CARRON SAFARI STD 450NE 3 1/4" [Re: jorge]
      #205301 - 17/03/12 05:12 AM

Probably because the Woodleigh FMJ consistently produces the highest barrel strain numbers across the board for all calibers tested. The Hornady DGS and DGX being right behind it with the second and third highest barrel strain values. Are they safe in your rifle? Only you can make that determination. After all, most manufacturers use the Hornady ammo to regulate with. But, if there is a bullet on the market with arguably better performance (FN vs RN) and Objectively Provable lower stress to your barrels, why not at least explore it. This statement about the Woodleigh only relates to the FMJ. The Woodleigh Soft bullets produced a barrel strain value that pretty much fell right in the middle of the data. The Woodleigh Soft was considered to be the benchmark bullet as being "Safe" for use in doubles. My experience with the CEBs so far is that they are more accurate than the other bullets I've used in the past (had to change powders on one caliber) and I'm actually getting a bit more velocity with the same load.

I haven't shot any game with them yet, but have a pretty aggressive hunting schedule over the next 13 months where I'll be using the CEB BBW#13 Solid and Non-Con exclusively on animals ranging from Black Bear to Cape Buff and a couple of Elephant, (Tuskless and Trophy Bull). So far, all the field reports of the CEBs have been nothing short of a quantum leap in performance.

Jorge, with my Chapuis 9.3X74R, I found that the CEB's were spread a bit more than my previous load with the Barnes Banded Solid. But the velocity was down about 200fps with the same powder charge. Once I brought the charge up (within the listed maximum data) to get the velocity back to 2425fps, the CEB's actually tightened a bit over the Barnes. I ended up having to switch powders however to get the rifle to regulate with the scope on, but this occurred with all bullets tested, not a CEB issue. If I remember correctly from your AR post, you didn't shoot the CEBs over a Chrony? In order to get the most out of them, I think you'll need to get an accurate measure of velocity.

In my 500NE, I found the load I was using with the Barnes bullets to significantly tighten with the CEBs. I also got an increase of about 75fps with the CEBs out of my 24" barrel.

At this point, I totally sold on them. Good luck with your rifle! It's a beaut!!

570gr CEB BBW#13 in my 500NE at 50 yards. The bullets are just touching now. With the Barnes Banded, they were about 2" apart with the same load. 2127 fps avg.


255gr CEB BBW#13 Non-Con 9.3X74R at 50 yards. Two lefts, two rights, with the scope on, no crossing. 2425 fps avg.


Edited by CptCurl (18/03/12 10:42 PM)


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jorge
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Reged: 13/07/05
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Re: VERNEY-CARRON SAFARI STD 450NE 3 1/4" [Re: HogPilot]
      #205315 - 17/03/12 10:44 AM

I absolutely shot them and everything else I loaded over a chrony and I posted the velocities. VCs arguably have the strongest actions out there so I'm not too concerned with Hornadys having a deleterious effect on my rifle. I've managed to get the CEB solids to shoot to the same POI as DGXs, DGS (both factory and my handloads) and Woodleigh softs with varying loads of H-4831. I have not nor do I plan to load DGS or Woodleigh solids.

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4seventy
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Re: VERNEY-CARRON SAFARI STD 450NE 3 1/4" [Re: jorge]
      #205322 - 17/03/12 11:56 AM

A very nice double jorge! The colour case is nicely done and really looks good.
You are shooting it very well too.
Thanks for showing us!


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HogPilot
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Reged: 26/05/09
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Re: VERNEY-CARRON SAFARI STD 450NE 3 1/4" [Re: 4seventy]
      #205323 - 17/03/12 12:47 PM

My mistake Jorge. For some reason, I thought I remembered you stating that you didn't have a chrony that day. Anyway, did you find the CEB's to be low on velocity initially? I did with the 9.3 but not the 500. I think part of that has something to do with the fact that the 500's from Barnes were undersized (.508 vs .510) and the greater "gas check" of the CEB's didn't result in as much of a pressure loss as happened in the 9.3. I don't know. Pure speculation on my part at this point. But the CEBs sure do shoot well once you get the load fine tuned, eh?

I agree with you about the strength of the VC. I have a 500NE on order from Ken at this time. But talking about the Hornady's effect on your rifle, it is not the effects of pressure on the action that is the potential issue, but rather the amount of strain imparted to the individual barrels as the bullet travels through them. Pressure and barrel strain are 2 different items of concern.

So when are you taking that VC across the pond?!


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jorge
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Re: VERNEY-CARRON SAFARI STD 450NE 3 1/4" [Re: HogPilot]
      #205401 - 18/03/12 01:47 PM

Hi, I did not notice a significant velocity loss with the CEBs when compared to the Woodleigh softs. In fact, I use the same amount of powder, 100grains for both. With the Hornadys I have to drop to 98gr however, but my rifle definitively likes the DGXs best. I had another range session today with the CEBs and with that 100gr load, 2" groups@50 is about as good as I can get them and that is plenty good for me. More importantly, that first shot out of the right barrel is dead on. As far as barrel strain, I'm just not going to worry about it and carry on with DGXs, Woodleigh softs and CEB solids. Working on a 2013 hunt to the Selous that I hope to book at the next DSC convention. jorge

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jorge
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Reged: 13/07/05
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Re: VERNEY-CARRON SAFARI STD 450NE 3 1/4" [Re: HogPilot]
      #205402 - 18/03/12 01:49 PM

Glad you liked it 4seventy. I wanted to replicate an English double in looks as much as possible. thanks! jorge

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jorge
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Reged: 13/07/05
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Re: VERNEY-CARRON SAFARI STD 450NE 3 1/4" [Re: jorge]
      #206350 - 02/04/12 10:33 AM

Just tried the BBW Non-Cons with the same load charge as Woodeighs and BBW solids (100gr H-4831)and I think I have a winner



Edited by CptCurl (04/04/12 08:31 PM)


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Rockdoc
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Re: VERNEY-CARRON SAFARI STD 450NE 3 1/4" [Re: jorge]
      #206450 - 03/04/12 06:50 PM

That's a lovely looking rifle jorge. And shoots well.

What does it weigh?

Cheers, Chris


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jorge
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Reged: 13/07/05
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Re: VERNEY-CARRON SAFARI STD 450NE 3 1/4" [Re: Rockdoc]
      #206457 - 03/04/12 10:19 PM

10.25lb. Thanks!

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mehulkamdar
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Re: VERNEY-CARRON SAFARI STD 450NE 3 1/4" [Re: jorge]
      #206590 - 06/04/12 09:12 AM

Welcome, Jorge! And do share your experiences here whenever you find time. We have an E-zine for members' hunt reports as well if you feel like writing one for us.

Good hunting and do keep visiting!

--------------------
The Ark was made by amateurs. Experts built the Titanic.

Mehul Kamdar


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jorge
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Reged: 13/07/05
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Re: VERNEY-CARRON SAFARI STD 450NE 3 1/4" [Re: mehulkamdar]
      #206684 - 07/04/12 10:28 AM

Thank you very much. I haven't been able to return to Africa for a few years now so I have no recent hunt reports to tell, but I'm working on a 2013-14 hunt as we speak. Unfortunately my time is very budgeted right now.

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