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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Paradox and Bore Guns

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lancaster
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Reged: 06/05/08
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28 bore pinfire combination gun
      #202979 - 20/02/12 05:08 AM

a very tasteful combination gun from B. EBBEKE in HERZBERG probably made in the 1860-1870 time frame.
unusual because it have a 28 bore rifled barrel and a 28 bore smooth barrel. such Büchsflinten have allmost ever a bigger shotgun barrel like 16 bore.















http://www.egun.de/market/item.php?id=3718346

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians

Edited by CptCurl (11/03/12 11:56 PM)


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tinkerModerator
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Reged: 12/03/05
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Re: 28 bore pinfire combination gun [Re: lancaster]
      #202989 - 20/02/12 06:54 AM

Got my attention!


Very elegant.
Thanks Lancaster!




Cheers
Tinker

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...


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tinkerModerator
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Re: 28 bore pinfire combination gun [Re: tinker]
      #202997 - 20/02/12 08:44 AM

Is that current bid 89 euros..?





Cheers
Tinker

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...


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Daryl_S
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Re: 28 bore pinfire combination gun [Re: tinker]
      #202998 - 20/02/12 09:01 AM

Looks like 89Euro's to me. Is there a reserve bid?

That's a nice gun. .54 cal as well. I suggest it is too early for elongated bullets, but it's hard to say.

They appear to be barely longer than one calibre, but of course much heavier, with 2 large, black powder-lube grooves. Perhaps they are right- however I am not up to date on when elongatedbullets became popular in Europe & when the switch was made to flat based, from the minnie designs.

28 bore makes for a nice upland gun, and .54 in a short pin fire case would work very well on deer-sized game.

--------------------
Daryl


"a rifle without hammers, is like a Spaniel without ears" Edward VII


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tinkerModerator
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Re: 28 bore pinfire combination gun [Re: Daryl_S]
      #203006 - 20/02/12 12:59 PM

Looks like I have 13 days to figure out how I can get a bid put on that little combination gun...


Lancaster, can Americans participate in eGun auctions?





Cheers
Tinker

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...


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lancaster
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Re: 28 bore pinfire combination gun [Re: tinker]
      #203022 - 20/02/12 06:07 PM

yes there is no problem, you have to register here
http://www.egun.de/market/register.php?PHPSESSID=1c48372950c373727e35fa1e0204049c

thats a good translator if you need
http://www.dict.cc/?s=the
works in both directions

I will send the seller a pm asking if he is willing to ship into the united staates, accept payment with credit cards and correspondent in english.
the gun needs a licence here so he could not send just like a muzzle loader. he needs a paper from you local police that allow you to import the gun into the united staates. the seller have to apply for a german export licence.
needs time and a little money but is not ther biggest problem.

have asked a gun export firm that make shipment inside of europe if they would do it.



the büchsflinte would accept Magtech brass after sizing rim thickness and diameter. 65 mm for the shotgun barrel and 40 mm long for the rifle barrel. in this time spitzer bullets were in vogue like here on the right side.






the later 1906 RWS bullet catalog gives a 14,55mm (.572) diameter for the 28 bore cats head bullet but his early one here may differ a little bit.
you can easy load 70 grain BP into the case and this is the 577 snider load.



its possible that the rifle chamber is only made for a 30-33mm long case. sometimes older bore rifles are made this way like this very early center fire





--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians

Edited by CptCurl (11/03/12 11:56 PM)


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Daryl_S
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Re: 28 bore pinfire combination gun [Re: lancaster]
      #203061 - 21/02/12 03:18 AM

What I'm finding confusing is in true sizing, 28 bore is actually .55 calibre, while 24 bore is .578/8.
Is this gun being called a 28 bore becasue it's using 28 bore brass, even though it is a 24 bore by calibre?

The 4 bullet designs on the left were not even remotely duplicated (flat based) in the US for sporting use until the very late 60's early 70's seems to me - and minimally then as they were quite new for military breechloading rifles presented for testing in the 60's.


--------------------
Daryl


"a rifle without hammers, is like a Spaniel without ears" Edward VII

Edited by CptCurl (11/03/12 11:57 PM)


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lancaster
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Re: 28 bore pinfire combination gun [Re: Daryl_S]
      #203064 - 21/02/12 03:48 AM

daryl, there is a fundamental distinction between british and german bore rifles. you know that the diameter of a shotgun calibers is not fix but fluctuate. for example in the 28 bore a barrel can go from 13,80mm up to 14,30mm and be in CIP measurments. a german made bore rifle barrel will be with the lands in this range when a british made barrel will have the bore diameter as the grooves diameter.
so a german barrel maker was taken a shotgun barrel and rifled this when his british colleague was drilling the barrel blank much smaller and match the shotgun diameter when ready.

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians


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poprivit
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Re: 28 bore pinfire combination gun [Re: lancaster]
      #203076 - 21/02/12 05:58 AM

Tinker - are you going to bid on this pinfire? If not, I might jump in. Not looking for a shooter, just a display pinfire. PM me if you wish.

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tinkerModerator
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Re: 28 bore pinfire combination gun [Re: poprivit]
      #203125 - 21/02/12 03:12 PM

Poprivit-


I might bid if I can qualify for the seller, and if I can arrange shipping without going through too much beaurocracy nightmares.



Lancaster-

If you can ask the seller if he would sell to me here in the USA, I would greatly appreciate the gesture.
Can you also ask for a view of the bores?




Cheers
Tinker

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...


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lancaster
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Re: 28 bore pinfire combination gun [Re: tinker]
      #203134 - 21/02/12 05:44 PM

tinker, so long as you have registered no one can hinder you to bid on this gun. have send the seller a pm yesterday with the questions. no answer till now for whatever reasons. both barrels are describe as "rough" but only a pic would tell the truth and I will ask for.
if the seller dont want to go into the export procedure I can storage the gun for you here with my local dealer till the paper work is ready. have done this several times for guns inside europe but have the ask how it goes outside. I think if you had someone on a american military base in germany it would be very easy.

ok, wasn't realy a problem to find him its a gunmaker and monday is closed.
http://www.will-apel.de/home.html

having the email address now and go again with the questions

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians

Edited by lancaster (21/02/12 05:51 PM)


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tinkerModerator
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Re: 28 bore pinfire combination gun [Re: lancaster]
      #203893 - 27/02/12 09:11 AM

I will attempt to register on the site.

Lancaster I appreciate all your efforts.
If it's possible I will likely bid.




Cheers
Tinker

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...


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tinkerModerator
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Re: 28 bore pinfire combination gun [Re: tinker]
      #203916 - 27/02/12 04:06 PM

Nochmals vielen Dank Lancaster.

Ich habe eGun beigetreten

Ich werde versuchen, dieses Gewehr zu bekommen.


Cheers
Tinker

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...


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lancaster
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Reged: 06/05/08
Posts: 5529
Loc: There's a lighthouse in the mi...
Re: 28 bore pinfire combination gun [Re: tinker]
      #204020 - 28/02/12 09:47 PM

Tinker

got this pics today

























of course not the best but better than nothing

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians

Edited by CptCurl (11/03/12 11:57 PM)


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tinkerModerator
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Reged: 12/03/05
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Re: 28 bore pinfire combination gun [Re: lancaster]
      #204023 - 29/02/12 01:09 AM

Thanks again Lancaster!

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...


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