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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Mannlicher Discussion forum & Archive
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mbogo3
.275 member


Reged: 26/03/10
Posts: 54
Loc: Alberta Canada
MS 6.5x54 bore size?
      #201234 - 31/01/12 11:43 AM

I've read they can vary all over the map depending on model and year of manufacture? From .264" -.268" Any validity to this or models to look for ? I would prefer .264 for reloading naturally......Harold

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500Nitro
.450 member


Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: MS 6.5x54 bore size? [Re: mbogo3]
      #201235 - 31/01/12 11:45 AM



Like English calibres and old guns in general,
I would slug the bore to be sure.

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Kiwi_bloke
.333 member


Reged: 03/09/09
Posts: 256
Loc: New Zealand
Re: MS 6.5x54 bore size? [Re: 500Nitro]
      #201277 - 31/01/12 08:41 PM

According to Rifle magazine, Sept-Oct 2011 edition, and the article therein by John Barsness titled 'Mannlicher-Schoenauer 6,5x54 Carbine'; "Many older older 6,5x54 Mannlicher-Schoenauers... have oversized bores ranging from .266 to .269". The post-war rifles normally have .264" bores".

These above measurements are generalities, and slugging the bore of your rifle is the smart thing to do to be sure. The Hornady .264" 160-grain bullet gives good accuracy in my early carbine. My 1928 6,5x54 M.-Sch. carbine bore slugs at .268".

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500Nitro
.450 member


Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: MS 6.5x54 bore size? [Re: Kiwi_bloke]
      #201279 - 31/01/12 08:48 PM


Kiwi

I had read that before, it may have been on here.

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Mike_Bailey
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Reged: 26/02/07
Posts: 2289
Loc: GB
Re: MS 6.5x54 bore size? [Re: 500Nitro]
      #201288 - 31/01/12 11:03 PM

yep, they are all over the place, as I said here earlier I cannot have my "new" mannlicher proofed in England since its´new Douglas USA barrel does not conform to UK proof house 6.5x54 MS specs !! best, Mike

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darwinmauser
.300 member


Reged: 07/05/07
Posts: 217
Loc: Darwin NT
Re: MS 6.5x54 bore size? [Re: Mike_Bailey]
      #201331 - 01/02/12 05:05 PM

Quote:

yep, they are all over the place, as I said here earlier I cannot have my "new" mannlicher proofed in England since its´new Douglas USA barrel does not conform to UK proof house 6.5x54 MS specs !! best, Mike




Is this a major problem Mike ? could it be proofed in Europe ?

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500Nitro
.450 member


Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: MS 6.5x54 bore size? [Re: Mike_Bailey]
      #201332 - 01/02/12 05:10 PM

Quote:

yep, they are all over the place, as I said here earlier I cannot have my "new" mannlicher proofed in England since its´new Douglas USA barrel does not conform to UK proof house 6.5x54 MS specs !! best, Mike



Wow, that is interesting - and bad.

The US does have a tendency to do it's own thing sometimes
which causes problems.

Are you going to be able to rectify it ?

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Mike_Bailey
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Reged: 26/02/07
Posts: 2289
Loc: GB
Re: MS 6.5x54 bore size? [Re: 500Nitro]
      #201337 - 01/02/12 07:12 PM

It maybe possible to proof it in Italy or Spain, they might not be so tight on barrel specs, it doesn´t relly bother me, I´ll look into it if I want to sell it, best

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Kiwi_bloke
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Reged: 03/09/09
Posts: 256
Loc: New Zealand
Re: MS 6.5x54 bore size? [Re: Mike_Bailey]
      #201342 - 01/02/12 07:59 PM

If you can find a copy of Handloader's Digest 1996, there's an article by Ray Ordorica about his 6,5x54 Mannlicher-Schoenauer. He slugged his pre-war Mannlicher and discovered it to be .269" (which I think he acknowledges some of which might be wear). Most 6,5mm bullets of modern manufacture are .264". However Ray points out that, in Greener's "The Gun and it's Development", the bore of the 6,5x54 M. Sch., (which the English call the .256" Mannlicher-Schoenauer), has a groove depth shown as .0059" for an approximate total groove diameter of .268". Frank de Haas in Bolt Action Rifles also indicates the groove diameter of 6,5 Mannlicher's is .266 to .268". In other words, these (presumably all pre-war rifles) were all within original specs.

After the war, the Austrians began manufacture of this rifle in 1950 with the American market primarily in mind and made a number of changes to better suit the American taste, such as the swept-back bolt handle, side safety etc. My guess is that their change to .264" occured then to better suit their new market. Because this was an adaptive thing, with there being a Model 1950, Model 1952 and also intermediate types, as well as Model GK for the home market, then later types still such as Model MCA, you really cannot assume anything without slugging the bore.

I'm able to use .268" Hornady "Carcano" bullets for very good accuracy and velocity without pressure factors, because I've done my homework and slugged the bore - twice! If I loaded to SAAMI overall cartridge length specs, for instance, I'd get into all sorts of trouble with this large diameter bullet, which is probably why Hornady advise, "Carcano only". That's why I recommended to the forum instead the Hornady .264" 160-grain bullet which is much safer if you have no way of measuring distance to lands and/or also don't want to slug the bore.

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Brithunter
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Reged: 17/03/10
Posts: 184
Loc: Lincolnshire, England
Re: MS 6.5x54 bore size? [Re: Kiwi_bloke]
      #201372 - 02/02/12 12:21 AM

As I believe I have mentioned before a few years ago a brand new Steyr made barrel in 6.5x54MS was fitted to my Model 1903 to replace the bad re-lined barrel. The goove diameter at the muzzle best i can tell using a digital caliper is 0.268" which funnily enough is the same measurement obtained from my 1893 dated mdl 1892 in 6.5x53R. The 1903 with it's new barrel which is scoped shoots the Speer 120 grain 6.5mm (0.264") bullet quite happily despite reading articles in Gun Digest on the need for over sized bullets to get any sort of grouping in my own experience this is a non issue and actually makes me wonder at the competence of some of these writers.

--------------------
Don't let the bastards grind you down!

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Mike_Bailey
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Reged: 26/02/07
Posts: 2289
Loc: GB
Re: MS 6.5x54 bore size? [Re: Brithunter]
      #201373 - 02/02/12 12:24 AM

Brithunter, mine shoots fine, 5/8" at 100 yds with 160 grainers (handloads and not me shooting) and shoots RWS factory 159 grainers into an inch at 100 yds (me shooting) but they won´t proof it ! best

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DarylS
.700 member


Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26516
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: MS 6.5x54 bore size? [Re: Mike_Bailey]
      #201377 - 02/02/12 12:58 AM

Technically speaking, the bore should be .257" or therabouts. The groove diameter is the large measurement that can be from .263" to .268" or whatever depending on manufacturer.

I know it's nitpicking, & this is not meant as a put-down, merely as a nomenclature correction. We should use the proper names for the parts of our firearms or we will lose them over time. When I first saw the title in the list of threads, I instantly thought .257", but found the thread wasn't about the bore size at all.

Best wishes

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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mbogo3
.275 member


Reged: 26/03/10
Posts: 54
Loc: Alberta Canada
Re: MS 6.5x54 bore size? [Re: DarylS]
      #201387 - 02/02/12 01:56 AM

Hornady is dropping their 160gr in .264.......I wonder about the same in .268 Then other than custom bullets we,re SOL...........Harold

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DarylS
.700 member


Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26516
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: MS 6.5x54 bore size? [Re: mbogo3]
      #201405 - 02/02/12 04:03 AM

Lyman, I think, makes a .268" mould, seems to me, in fairly heavy bullet weight. I don't know if it's 160gr. though.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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Brithunter
.300 member


Reged: 17/03/10
Posts: 184
Loc: Lincolnshire, England
Re: MS 6.5x54 bore size? [Re: DarylS]
      #201716 - 05/02/12 10:11 AM

Ahhh Daryl you correct. I made up a brass stepped gauge to check the bores of my 6.5mm's goes up in 0.001" steps from 0.255" and mine all gauge at 0.256"

--------------------
Don't let the bastards grind you down!

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