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NitroXAdministrator
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Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39249
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: mickey]
      #18564 - 28/08/04 02:25 PM

A couple of Holland & Holland Paradox's

A 16 bore





And a 12-bore







--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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ALAN_MCKENZIE
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Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: 500grains]
      #18569 - 28/08/04 11:03 PM

Well golly gosh 500grns,as I recall the last elephant I shot was quiet a few years ago however I remember it very vividly.
It went something like this:-
We set up an ambush and included a heap of claymores in the surprise package.
Within minutes of clearing the no go area all hell broke loose.
A belt of 50 cal BMG later the dust settled.
On inspection a very large and very dead elephant was found.
Yes I've shot an elephant,not with a parodox and no I dont have a photo of it to remind me of what I did to that poor bastard of an elephant.
I've also hunted the most dangerous animal in the world and survived to tell about it...

The PARODOX,is there a modern place for it?????
" YES"


--------------------
"Dogs always bark at their master"
Sir Seretse Khama.25th June 1949

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seroadglide
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Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: NitroX]
      #18599 - 29/08/04 05:24 PM

NitroX,
Thanks for the photos that include the accesories. I understand the nice crimp.

When casting for such a gun, does one use an alloy or pure lead?

Douglas R. Mays

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Gadge
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Reged: 02/05/04
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Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: ALAN_MCKENZIE]
      #18614 - 29/08/04 09:42 PM

Well, just to stir the pot: came across one that's coming up for auction in NSW soon [couple of weeks]. What looks to be a very nice Army & Navy 12 bore, cased, but looks like no mould. Auctioneeers estimate AU$4.5-5k plus etceteras.

It's with Aust. Antique Arms Auctions; you can download the catalogue here PDF, ca 1.2 Mb; this link will work, unlike that from their webpage.
Lot 320, p. 19; pic is top of p.14.

--------------------
Cheers,
Doug

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chrispie
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Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: Gadge]
      #18626 - 30/08/04 12:58 AM

nice gun, also look at lot#322 the 500 holland hammer gun, to bad i won't be their. cause i'd through in a bid

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Marrakai
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Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: 500grains]
      #18672 - 31/08/04 12:39 AM

500grains said:
"But not for the big stuff like elephant, hippo, rhino and cape buffalo."

..so, is it worth attempting a further contribution to his meagre education?
The 10-bore Paradoxes WERE specifically designed and marketed by Holland & Holland for use against pachyderms!







500grains also said:
"Paradox guns were not too effective when they were used in the old days..."
"If you read some of the older works on DG hunting in AFrica, you will read of the ineffectiveness of paradox guns..."

Care to enlighten us with a few references, 500brains?


Meanwhile, here's one of my favourites: an observation by R.C.F. Maugham, His Majesty's Consul-General at Beira, Portugese East Africa (and inveterate big game hunter), writing just after the turn of the century.

"....no hunter in his right senses should place his blind trust in such a weapon as even the .450 cordite rifle to extricate him from the thousand and one dangers by which he is liable from day to day to be confronted in Africa. I therefore unhesitatingly advocate, in addition to the most perfected type of modern high-velocity weapon which we are ever likely to see, the inclusion of a sound, heavy rifle intended for use at close range, the shock of whose bullet, even if it should not instantly kill, will assuredly be sufficiently great to disable or turn a charging beast. For those who do not possess the strength to use a heavy eight-bore, which I look upon as the ideal weapon par excellance for this purpose, I would suggest the adoption of a 10 or at least of a 12-bore Paradox throwing a 1 3/4 ounce bullet, driven by a charge of five drams of black powder. This, in capable hands, should be sufficiently powerful to produce the desired stopping effect."




--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

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vigillinus
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Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: mickey]
      #19093 - 09/09/04 12:47 PM

Good many decades back I had a 20 guage Evans sidelock Paradox, plain finish no engraving at all but Best Quality, obviously made for a crank, it was cased about mint, and we tried our darndest but Dick Vogt and I never could get a load that would shoot decently. We probably gave up too early.

As to a 20 guage Westley Richards Fauneta, I would consider that a super desirable item.

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470Rigby
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Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: NitroX]
      #19604 - 04/10/04 04:31 PM

There has been very little published on Paradox's, but that is about to change with the forthcoming publication of the 5th Volume in Wal Winfer's series on "British Single Shot Rifle", which devoted to Holland and Holland rifles.

During his research on that firm, Wal has unearthed a wealth of hitherto unknown material on Paradox's, and has included it in the new book.

Afficionados should get their order in now!

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seroadglide
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Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: NitroX]
      #19735 - 13/10/04 01:04 PM

The Autumn 2004 The Double Gun Journal has an article titled "An Unmatched Pair". It is by Ross Seyfried. One of the pair is a 20 bore Fauneta.

I would be very happy to have a hunting arm like either of the ones in the above mentioned article. The Fauneta would especially be nice as we have feral hogs here in Tennessee (not my part though). We also have plenty of birds, squirrels, etc. that could be dispatched with shot.

Douglas Mays

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Honey_badger
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Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: seroadglide]
      #19784 - 16/10/04 02:09 AM

My understanding was that Paradoxes and the like were mainly designed for use on cats. However, I had not seen that advertisment for the 10 bore! They were still being used well into the 1960s. John Kingsley-Heath had one made by Purdey.

This is just an educated guess, but part of the reason that they went out of use may be down to British firearms law. Here, there is one licence for a shotgun and another for a 'firearm' (rifles and pistols, until the latter were banned). As a paradox is a bit of both, this may have caused much scratching of official heads when the British laws began to become more restrictive in the 1960s. For the same reason, drillings are uncommon here.

I do have a 12 bore paradox round in my colection and it is huge!

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NitroXAdministrator
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Reged: 25/12/02
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Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: Honey_badger]
      #20444 - 04/11/04 01:09 PM

Here is an interesting Paradox I saw elsewhere on the net. It is a Paradox Drilling in 12 bore/12 bore/9.3x70mm.

I hae featured it on the Single Shot and Combination rifle forum on NE.com

Drilling Paradox



--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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