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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Rifles

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458Shooter
.224 member

Reged: 14/09/09
Posts: 47
Loc: Canada

Almost forgotten cartridges ....
#184953 - 01/07/11 05:25 AM

The 8x57 Mauser and the 358 Winchester have been forgotten in the hunting camps, I guess the times have changed and shooters want the latest laser with the biggest scope.
The original military condition Brno 8x57 Mauser I picked up recently shoots 220 grain bullets right around 2400 fps. The 358 Winchester shoots the 225 grain Barnes X bullets at just over 2500 fps, I can't believe these cartridges have been overlooked for so long.
I will continue to hunt and target shoot with the 8x57, although most of the time people will look at my Mauser at the gun range and wonder what planet it fell to earth from.
I baffle them further when I show them the 30-06 brass I used to make 8x57 Mauser.

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Mike_Bailey
.400 member

Reged: 26/02/07
Posts: 2289
Loc: GB

Re: Almost forgotten cartridges .... [Re: 458Shooter]
#184960 - 01/07/11 08:27 AM

Just use a 30-06 with 220 grainers ! easier ? best, Mike

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458Shooter
.224 member

Reged: 14/09/09
Posts: 47
Loc: Canada

Re: Almost forgotten cartridges .... [Re: Mike_Bailey]
#184962 - 01/07/11 08:41 AM

Quote:

Just use a 30-06 with 220 grainers ! easier ? best, Mike

Although the 06 is a world class cartridge, I find it kinda boring because every dog and his owner has one. Just as I prefer the 7x57 over the 7 mag because the Mauser has more elegance and about a 70 year head start on the 7mm Rem mag. It's not always about light warp speed....

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tophet1
.400 member

Reged: 15/09/07
Posts: 1873
Loc: NSW, Australia

Re: Almost forgotten cartridges .... [Re: 458Shooter]
#184963 - 01/07/11 08:52 AM

I agree 458Shooter.

My son recently took a number of camels on foot with an ex-mil VZ-24 open sighted 8x57 and 170 RNSP Hornadys. No scopes, no 'wonder' bullets. He just hunted them close with a round that works, like all the other rounds that work when put in the right place.

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Ben
.400 member

Reged: 22/08/08
Posts: 1917
Loc: Northern Territory, Australia

Re: Almost forgotten cartridges .... [Re: tophet1]
#184964 - 01/07/11 09:17 AM

Recently I bought a Ruger No.1 in .300H&H. There are more sensible options, especially in terms of ammunition / component availability, but there is just something special, to my mind, about it.

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500Nitro
.450 member

Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia

Re: Almost forgotten cartridges .... [Re: Ben]
#184965 - 01/07/11 09:25 AM

Yes, the 30.06 is kind of boring and everyone has one but partly as a result of ammo being readily available world wide.

I like different calibres but sometimes for non reloaders practicality has to take over.

.

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458Shooter
.224 member

Reged: 14/09/09
Posts: 47
Loc: Canada

Re: Almost forgotten cartridges .... [Re: 500Nitro]
#184966 - 01/07/11 10:51 AM

I wasn't knocking the venerable 06, just having a look at something different from the everyday stuff. I have many 06 rifles over the years, they work very well for most game that will be encountered by the everyday hunter.
After 35 years of hunting and shooting, it's nice to try something new.
The 7x57 Mauser, 8x57 Mauser, 358 Winchester , 35 Whelen, and the 375 H&H are some of my favorites.

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500Nitro
.450 member

Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia

Re: Almost forgotten cartridges .... [Re: 458Shooter]
#184968 - 01/07/11 11:24 AM

Quote:

I wasn't knocking the venerable 06, just having a look at something different from the everyday stuff. I have many 06 rifles over the years, they work very well for most game that will be encountered by the everyday hunter.
After 35 years of hunting and shooting, it's nice to try something new.
The 7x57 Mauser, 8x57 Mauser, 358 Winchester , 35 Whelen, and the 375 H&H are some of my favorites.

No, I realise that, I had no problem with your post and in fact I am similar to some extent, I like 275Rigby (have 2), 300H&H (will get one one day).

I have used other people's guns, mainly in the NT in 8mm, 6.5mm just not a fan myself. 35 Whelan is a popular Sambar cartridge down here.

.

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gryphon
.450 member

Reged: 01/01/03
Posts: 5487
Loc: Sambar ground/Victoria/Austral...

Re: Almost forgotten cartridges .... [Re: 458Shooter]
#184970 - 01/07/11 12:08 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Just use a 30-06 with 220 grainers ! easier ? best, Mike

Just as I prefer the 7x57 over the 7 mag because the Mauser has more elegance and about a 70 year head start on the 7mm Rem mag.

Sort of same reason I have 308 and 358 cals

but for me both are Norma Magnums on a world scale they dont rate in huge numbers!

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mauserand9mm
.400 member

Reged: 03/09/09
Posts: 1040
Loc: Queensland, Australia

Re: Almost forgotten cartridges .... [Re: gryphon]
#184973 - 01/07/11 01:13 PM

I shoot "Combined Services" match which is basically ex-military rifles in original military configuration and mostly bolt actions, and 8mm isn't a popular cartridge there either. I guess this is because the ex-mil ammo has dried up (although 6.5x55 is the most popular and there's no ex-mil ammo for those).

I have two ex-mil 8mm bolt actions myself (a 1903 Turk and a 1904/39 Portuguese) and have been wanting to try them out hunting but they are not a high priority so haven't done this yet. I've used a 308 Israeli Mauser in original military config out hunting and it performs well. It has been my "spare" backup rifle in case my usual rifle (Remington in the same calibre/cartridge) breaks - it never has (I used the Israeli to try it out and it was handy at the time).

Edited by mauserand9mm (01/07/11 01:15 PM)

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lancaster
.470 member

Reged: 06/05/08
Posts: 9038
Loc: There's a lighthouse in the mi...

Re: Almost forgotten cartridges .... [Re: mauserand9mm]
#184976 - 01/07/11 02:02 PM

time and fashion change over the years. twenty years ago the 8x57 was very dead as a hunting round in the Reich and very few new sporting rifles were offer in this caliber.
the 7x64 was ruling the scene. but when wild bore population becoming a problem the 8x57 as the better pig killer was coming back again and now every new rifle is also made in 8x57.

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians

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450_Ackley
.375 member

Reged: 06/02/03
Posts: 583
Loc: Darling Downs, Qld Australia

Re: Almost forgotten cartridges .... [Re: lancaster]
#184978 - 01/07/11 03:39 PM

I've got a few of the old timers as well in the safes.
such calibres as 7x57, 300 H&H, 35 Whelen and of course a 450 Ackley, liked it better than a 458 Lott.
I'd always have a 222 over a 223 anyday as well.
I also shoot a 225 Winchester and a 219 Donaldson Wasp as well, just to be different.
And of course, there's the lever action 22 Savage Hi-power, 25-20, 30-30 and 45-70.
And I'm in the process of having a 30-30 Wesson built on a Martini as well, just because I can!

Nothing a new cartridge can do that an older cartidge hasn't already done.

DC

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Dr_Deer
.300 member

Reged: 23/02/09
Posts: 212
Loc: Australia

Re: Almost forgotten cartridges .... [Re: lancaster]
#184981 - 01/07/11 03:51 PM

Quote:

time and fashion change over the years. twenty years ago the 8x57 was very dead as a hunting round in the Reich and very few new sporting rifles were offer in this caliber.
the 7x64 was ruling the scene. but when wild bore population becoming a problem the 8x57 as the better pig killer was coming back again and now every new rifle is also made in 8x57.

I find the fickel fashions and fates of the 8mms interesting.

I recall reading Bill Morkel's Hunting in Africa where he sang the praises of the 8x60S as a plains game rifle par excellence. Yet at this juncture no one chambers new rifles and ammo is only available from S&B & RWS.

Also in the "Where are they now" category are the 8mm Brennekes, the 8x64 & 8x65R. The latter would be ideal in light double for stalking reds or driven game I'd imagine yet Blaser & Kreighoff ressurected the 8x75RS instead in recent decades, and have now it seems even dropped that rounds from their line up.

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Rolf
.333 member

Reged: 26/02/07
Posts: 402
Loc: Germany, Bavaria

Re: Almost forgotten cartridges .... [Re: Dr_Deer]
#185001 - 01/07/11 09:15 PM

Amendment to the comment of Dr. Deer:

Heym offers his rifles SR21 and SR30 in 8x64S in the standard price caliber category.

best regards
Rolf

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Dr_Deer
.300 member

Reged: 23/02/09
Posts: 212
Loc: Australia

Re: Almost forgotten cartridges .... [Re: Rolf]
#185003 - 01/07/11 09:56 PM

Thanks Rolf, does anyone other than Brenneke currently make ammo?

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NitroX
.700 member

Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39893
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...

Re: Almost forgotten cartridges .... [Re: Dr_Deer]
#185013 - 02/07/11 01:14 AM

Well if you have almost forgotten cartridges, this is the place for it ...

Visited a gun shop again today and asked about eight different die sets and not one was in stock ... even the common .223 Remington AND .303 British!

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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hunter_angler
.300 member

Reged: 24/03/10
Posts: 104
Loc: Grand Marais, Michigan (home i...

Re: Almost forgotten cartridges .... [Re: NitroX]
#185025 - 02/07/11 04:32 AM

.348 WIN my favorite. Only ever chambered by factory in one rifle. But a good one, IMHO.

Maybe you can't really call it forgotten, because so few folks knew about it in the first place.

--------------------
Semper Paratus

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Yochanan
.375 member

Reged: 26/01/03
Posts: 912
Loc: Volksdiktatur Schweden

Re: Almost forgotten cartridges .... [Re: Dr_Deer]
#185026 - 02/07/11 04:37 AM

Quote:

Thanks Rolf, does anyone other than Brenneke currently make ammo?

I used S&B ammo in my 8x46S, surprisingly good ammo for the price.

--------------------
© "I have never been able to appreciate 'shock' as applied to killing big game. It seems to me that you cannot kill an elephant weighing six tons by ´shock´unless you advocate the use of a field gun." - W.D.M. Bell: Wanderings of an Elephant Hunter.

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458Shooter
.224 member

Reged: 14/09/09
Posts: 47
Loc: Canada

Re: Almost forgotten cartridges .... [Re: hunter_angler]
#185028 - 02/07/11 05:55 AM

Quote:

.348 WIN my favorite. Only ever chambered by factory in one rifle. But a good one, IMHO.

Maybe you can't really call it forgotten, because so few folks knew about it in the first place.

Isn't the 348 the fore runner of the 358 Winchester?

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NitroX
.700 member

Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39893
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...

Re: Almost forgotten cartridges .... [Re: 458Shooter]
#185082 - 02/07/11 09:23 PM

Quote:

Quote:

.348 WIN my favorite. Only ever chambered by factory in one rifle. But a good one, IMHO.

Maybe you can't really call it forgotten, because so few folks knew about it in the first place.

Isn't the 348 the fore runner of the 358 Winchester?

BTW does the .358 Win do anything more than a .348 Win did?

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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Tatume
.400 member

Reged: 09/06/07
Posts: 1091
Loc: Gloucester, Va USA

Re: Almost forgotten cartridges .... [Re: NitroX]
#185083 - 02/07/11 09:37 PM

Quote:

BTW does the .358 Win do anything more than a .348 Win did?

Some actions work well with rimless cartridges, and the 358 satisfies that need. The rimmed 348 works better in other actions. Ballistically, they are not too far apart.

--------------------
Take care, Tom
NRA Life Member

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GK
.300 member

Reged: 29/10/09
Posts: 161
Loc: Adelaide

Re: Almost forgotten cartridges .... [Re: Tatume]
#185085 - 02/07/11 10:49 PM

And the germans had the 9x57 before the .348Win.

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GG375
.333 member

Reged: 27/02/04
Posts: 347
Loc: Brisbane

Re: Almost forgotten cartridges .... [Re: GK]
#185100 - 03/07/11 06:20 AM

I've been using my 8mm Mauser for years up here on the Cape for pigs and brumbies. It's worked well on everything I've pointed it at! My young bloke has sort of "claimed" it now tho.

How's this for an awsome set of tusks?

Cheers.

GG

Edited by CptCurl (04/07/11 09:51 PM)

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pablo_mauser_66
.275 member

Reged: 01/03/07
Posts: 80
Loc: Australia, Sydney

Re: Almost forgotten cartridges .... [Re: GG375]
#185105 - 03/07/11 09:35 AM

Well I'll put my hand up for the 10.75x68 Mauser (423 Mauser). Almost forgotten thou not quite an obselete catridge. Brass and Dies are still available, just !. I've recently did my bit for this classy old round and have just converted an old 1915 Oberndorf mauser to this chambering. Yesterday was my first day at the range and to say I'm pleased with the result is an understatement. Recoil whilst stout, felt only marginal worse than a hot 9.3x62 load and some subsonic Trail Boss loads were a hoot to shoot, loved hearing the 347gr Woodleigh smack into the back wall at the indoor range.

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NitroX
.700 member

Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39893
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...

Re: Almost forgotten cartridges .... [Re: pablo_mauser_66]
#185119 - 03/07/11 03:47 PM

The 8x57 I thought is still quite popular in Germany? Certainly I remember cheaper sort of customised M98's available in the Frankonia catalogues being available in 8x57.

I think it is a great cartridge on par with the .303, .308, .30-06 and a little bit more unique outside of Central Europe.

The 10.75x68 is a true big bore classic. Had a terrible reputation in its earlier days due to the projectiles being too soft, but with the good well constructed bullets available today, a pretty useful cartridge.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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