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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Double Rifles
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Lilguy
.224 member


Reged: 21/06/11
Posts: 11
Loc: Illinois
First Gun
      #184569 - 25/06/11 10:12 AM

I have negotiated a trade in deal at Cabelas.A Merkel 140A for 8300.00 or a Sabatti,clean rifling/no grinding for 4400.00.Both 470 NE.These include 9.5% SALES TAX.

I have contacted suggested dealers but I can't go over 10 grand at this point.As first double guns

will either suffice?

Thank you all.

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500Nitro
.450 member


Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: First Gun [Re: Lilguy]
      #184571 - 25/06/11 10:19 AM


Yes.

BUT, IF you buy the Sabatti, make sure you get the option of being able to return it for a FULL REFUND if the gun doesn't shoot etc etc.

And make sure the one you buy doesn't have ground out muzzles.


If you go for the Merkel, you'll be fine.

.

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bwanabobftw
.375 member


Reged: 29/12/04
Posts: 676
Loc: Texas
Re: First Gun [Re: 500Nitro]
      #184578 - 25/06/11 01:33 PM

Go with the Merkel !!!!!!! A little more up front , but you will get it back if you ever need to sell it !!!!!! Have fun , that is a great first cal. !!!!! Lots of load info on the .470.
Robert

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CHAPUISARMES
.416 member


Reged: 16/01/08
Posts: 2908
Loc: DUBBO, NSW, AUSTRALIA
Re: First Gun [Re: bwanabobftw]
      #184580 - 25/06/11 01:55 PM

Quote:

Go with the Merkel !!!!!!! A little more up front , but you will get it back if you ever need to sell it !!!!!! Have fun , that is a great first cal. !!!!! Lots of load info on the .470.
Robert



As Robert said.: +1

Cheers,

Jeff Gray

.

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NitroXAdministrator
.700 member


Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39896
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...
Re: First Gun [Re: Lilguy]
      #184750 - 28/06/11 04:18 AM

Quote:

I have negotiated a trade in deal at Cabelas.A Merkel 140A for 8300.00 or a Sabatti,clean rifling/no grinding for 4400.00.Both 470 NE.These include 9.5% SALES TAX.

I have contacted suggested dealers but I can't go over 10 grand at this point.As first double guns

will either suffice?

Thank you all.



If it was me I'd buy the Merkel if I could afford it.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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Tatume
.400 member


Reged: 09/06/07
Posts: 1091
Loc: Gloucester, Va USA
Re: First Gun [Re: NitroX]
      #184752 - 28/06/11 04:49 AM

Merkel certainly makes a pretty gun, and they have a good reputation.

--------------------
Take care, Tom
NRA Life Member

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Mike_Bailey
.400 member


Reged: 26/02/07
Posts: 2289
Loc: GB
Re: First Gun [Re: Tatume]
      #184765 - 28/06/11 07:35 AM

The Merkel no question, best

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CptCurlAdministrator
.450 member


Reged: 01/05/04
Posts: 5284
Loc: Fincastle, Botetourt County, V...
Re: First Gun [Re: Mike_Bailey]
      #184781 - 28/06/11 10:56 AM

The Merkel.

I bought the third .500NE made by Merkel - SN A500003 in April 2004. At that time I was told by the Merkel importer (GSI) that only 4 such rifles were in existence and they were having some trouble getting the .500 doubles into the U.S. because of some nonsense about it being .50 caliber and possibly a weapon of war.

I was skeptical when I bought it. I figured it would be poorly made. Word on the street was that the Merkels would come off face in only a hundred or so rounds. I thought the stock would likely crack or break under recoil. After some long conversations with my contact at GSI I was assured that their "bumper to bumper" warranty would be faithfully honored. The warranty period was 1 year, and I set out to put as many rounds as I could through that rifle within the year. I wanted to see if it would hold up; and if I could break it under use, I intended to do it in the warranty period. I fired hundreds of rounds. At first I was keeping a log of when and how many rounds I fired. Then I lost track but kept shooting the rifle. It's fun, you know! My limit is about 16 rounds per session; sometimes 20. Then I need a few days before shooting it again.

Long story short, the Merkel performed quite well with only a couple of very minor glitches, easily corrected. The action is still very tight and on face. It has to be closed smartly to make the lever come sufficiently toward center. The stock is not broken or cracked. It's ready for many years of hard use. I don't know how many hundreds of rounds I have put through it, but I'm still at it to this day. In the game field it has taken a white tail deer and a groundhog (headshot on the groundhog).

If you search the DR forum here you will run across my reports of this rifle back in those years. I still have my Merkel and plan to keep it. I own many doubles much finer, but I consider the Merkel a fine rifle in its own right. Merkel has been making fine double rifles and shotguns for well over 100 years.

I will not buy a Sabatti.

By the way, the old internet gab about Merkels having soft actions that would spring loose was silenced many years ago. You don't even hear that suggestion any more. Simply wasn't true.

Curl

--------------------
RoscoeStephenson.com

YOUR DOUBLE RIFLE IS YOUR BEST FRIEND.



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HendrikNZ
.275 member


Reged: 20/12/10
Posts: 94
Loc: New Zealand
Re: First Gun [Re: CptCurl]
      #184807 - 28/06/11 07:27 PM

+1 for the Merkel, it was also my 1st double.

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Lilguy
.224 member


Reged: 21/06/11
Posts: 11
Loc: Illinois
Re: First Gun [Re: HendrikNZ]
      #184850 - 30/06/11 12:55 AM

When I was discussing Sabatti regulation issues with the Gun Library Mgr near me he said that he read on the net how completely happy most owners were. I asked him if he was on NitroExpress or Accurate Reloading and the conversation took an abrupt detour. I am trying to hook up with other dbl gun shooters in my area(Chicago)to see if I can shoot one.Thank you all very much for all input.

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bwanabobftw
.375 member


Reged: 29/12/04
Posts: 676
Loc: Texas
Re: First Gun [Re: Lilguy]
      #184878 - 30/06/11 08:15 AM

I was at the local Cabela's yesterday buying some reloading supplies . I always enjoy going into the "Fine Gun Room" and looking at their doubles. I have never really looked at the Sabatti. They had maybe 5 or so in their case , out of the 2 or 3 they had laying down so I could see the end of the bbl's it appeared to me that all of them had their crowns polished to some degree or another. Looks like they would get 1 bbl shooting on the paper then "Grind" the other one to get it to "regulate". I don't know if you could cut the bbl's back and get someone who knew what they were doing to re-regulate it or not. I doubt you could get someone "who knew what he was doing" to touch a Sabatti (just my 2 cents). The actions look OK , and like someone else said earlier "they are probably stronger than some of the shotgun conversions". It's too bad they don't spend the extra money and regulate them in a more traditional manner and take a little more time on the internal finish . And, cut back on that cheap rolled engraving they put on them . In my humble opinion the plain case colored 9.3X74R was the best looking one of the bunch ( I could not see the bbl ends on that one). I guess if you wanted a project gun to play with, but you don't want to build from scratch they might not be too bad. But, if you want a gun to shoot and hunt with right out of the box ? I would stay away, I know some guys have had good luck with them but the odds are not in your favor. As I have said before , stick with the Merkel or Chapuis.
Robert
PS they had Chapuis and Merkel there for under 10K. Champlins in Enid, Ok. is the only dealer I know that will let you shoot their guns before you buy (just pay for ammo).

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Alberta
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Reged: 03/12/07
Posts: 66
Loc: Canada
Re: First Gun [Re: bwanabobftw]
      #184894 - 30/06/11 10:44 AM

Lilguy, for what it is worth I have a small bore Sabatti, I really like it.


HOWEVER!!!


It has come time to buy a "serious" double in 470 and I chose a Merkel.

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Lilguy
.224 member


Reged: 21/06/11
Posts: 11
Loc: Illinois
Re: First Gun [Re: Alberta]
      #184907 - 30/06/11 12:52 PM

The Merkel is new and sells for $9853.90 OTD. Is that as good a price as one is going to find on such a gun?
Alberta, did you buy a new Merkel, which mdl and if I may ask what did you pay?

Thanks.

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Alberta
.275 member


Reged: 03/12/07
Posts: 66
Loc: Canada
Re: First Gun [Re: Lilguy]
      #184909 - 30/06/11 01:44 PM

Mine is a 140 AE and I got it new, I bought it today in fact. I am in Canada so the price I got it for cannot be compared directly to what you are looking at. There are at least two smaller retailers up here that are both selling the Merkels at $8,500 Canadian dollars new. Other stores are asking up to $10,000 or more.


I have not looked at or shouldered a Merkel for about 10 years, but from what I remember of them I would be foolish not to have one sent out to me for the current asking price!



Also one thing about the Sabatti. You may not be able to see the grind marks in the muzzles. It is not only on the crown they are ground. They also remove/thin down some of the rifling back in the bore a little ways. It is very hard to see in a clean bore, but can be seen in a bore with a bit of fouling.

Edited by Alberta (30/06/11 01:50 PM)

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Lilguy
.224 member


Reged: 21/06/11
Posts: 11
Loc: Illinois
Re: First Gun [Re: Alberta]
      #184910 - 30/06/11 01:48 PM

Griffin and Howe has Blazers at 8800.00 right now.Anyone own one?

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CptCurlAdministrator
.450 member


Reged: 01/05/04
Posts: 5284
Loc: Fincastle, Botetourt County, V...
Re: First Gun [Re: Lilguy]
      #184935 - 30/06/11 09:28 PM

Quote:

Griffin and Howe has Blazers at 8800.00 right now.Anyone own one?



I don't think anybody would admit it if he did own one! Have you seen and handled one?

Curl

--------------------
RoscoeStephenson.com

YOUR DOUBLE RIFLE IS YOUR BEST FRIEND.



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bwanabobftw
.375 member


Reged: 29/12/04
Posts: 676
Loc: Texas
Re: First Gun [Re: CptCurl]
      #184942 - 30/06/11 11:29 PM

I think I would rather have the Sabatti , at least it feels like a double !!!

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Mike_Bailey
.400 member


Reged: 26/02/07
Posts: 2289
Loc: GB
Re: First Gun [Re: bwanabobftw]
      #184943 - 30/06/11 11:41 PM

Blazers!!?? Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo , donīt think about it, give your money to charity and join the vegans while selling your children into slavery rather than buy one of those, not an option, best, Mike (ps. just my opinion but believe it)

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Lilguy
.224 member


Reged: 21/06/11
Posts: 11
Loc: Illinois
Re: First Gun [Re: Mike_Bailey]
      #185092 - 03/07/11 12:51 AM

I believe we can not discuss dealers here. Is there anyone willing to answer a PM from me about the reputation of various dealers?

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NitroXAdministrator
.700 member


Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39896
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...
Re: First Gun [Re: Lilguy]
      #185120 - 03/07/11 03:52 PM

Quote:

I believe we can not discuss dealers here. Is there anyone willing to answer a PM from me about the reputation of various dealers?



Feel free to discuss the dealers but keep comments factual please.

Preferably direct experiences or close to it, not what some mates, mates third cousin has heard about them. Unlike some forums, no kangaroo courts here.


What we don't like is other right or blatant advertising of dealers, as such activity is expected to be accompanied by a sponsorship package.

But feel free here on this thread. Especially with regard to the reported problems with the Sabattis I hope dealers and sellers are backing up the 'quality' of the product, and if it does not regulate, is a brand new DR, I think it is useful if any that screw the buyers and won't take them back are outed.

BTW talking about Blaser's a previous member of NE bought one, it also could not be got to regulate, and eventually returned it. They do have self regulating screws I believe but allegedly this one couldn't be got to shoot, so it went back. Just one example of the Blaser DR. A number of years ago however.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

Edited by NitroX (03/07/11 03:55 PM)

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CHAPUISARMES
.416 member


Reged: 16/01/08
Posts: 2908
Loc: DUBBO, NSW, AUSTRALIA
Re: First Gun [Re: CptCurl]
      #185122 - 03/07/11 04:19 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Griffin and Howe has Blazers at 8800.00 right now.Anyone own one?



I don't think anybody would admit it if he did own one! Have you seen and handled one?

Curl



Only with gloves so that when I go home I can take off the gloves and not contaminate my rifles..

.

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Lilguy
.224 member


Reged: 21/06/11
Posts: 11
Loc: Illinois
Re: First Gun [Re: CHAPUISARMES]
      #185138 - 03/07/11 10:00 PM

Westley Richards & Co. Ltd.

Anyone have experience with this dealer?

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JabaliHunter
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Reged: 16/05/07
Posts: 1958
Loc: England
Re: First Gun [Re: Lilguy]
      #185142 - 03/07/11 11:16 PM

Quote:

When I was discussing Sabatti regulation issues with the Gun Library Mgr near me he said that he read on the net how completely happy most owners were. I asked him if he was on NitroExpress or Accurate Reloading and the conversation took an abrupt detour.


That says quite a lot!

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