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NitroX
.700 member

Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39594
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...

The BEST African plains game calibre
#16601 - 12/07/04 11:32 AM

Time for some mass debate. All of us who head over to Africa for some hunting do some plains game hunting and it is great value and fun. Others dream about it or plan for it and have their own ideas.

Tell us what you think and why.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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NitroX
.700 member

Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39594
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...

Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: NitroX]
#16602 - 12/07/04 11:34 AM

I throw in a wildcard to get it started ....

the 8mm Remington Magnum

or given my continental bent, the 8x68S.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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Ingwe
.275 member

Reged: 08/07/04
Posts: 70
Loc: Texas

Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: NitroX]
#16603 - 12/07/04 12:14 PM

Boy Nitrox, that would certainly be a very VERY good cartidge, but I would just have to take a 30.06. I suppose that isn't a very imaginative choice, and I can already hear people lining up to say that it is underpowered for the big stuff, but to me it would simply be the best for the huge range of game sizes. And I do not share the opinion at all that it is underpowered for the larger animals. Now, that would be if it were srictly plains game. In your question, I am not sure if you want us to also take into consideration the possibility of bumping into something dangerous while we are hunting our plains game, but if I had to take that into account, then I would go with you and the 8 Rem Mag. Not quite as suitable for the smaller game, not quite as pleasant to shoot, but some extra muscle for the beasties.

--------------------

_________________________________________________

Learn from other people's mistakes - you can't live long enough to make them all yourself.

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mickey
.416 member

Reged: 05/01/03
Posts: 4647
Loc: Pend Oreille Valley, Idaho

Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: NitroX]
#16604 - 12/07/04 12:22 PM

An African Plainsgame Rifle should be an African Cartridge. It should also be from before the last War, for tradition.

Nothing with the name Remington on the end qualifies.

I vote for the 318 WR.

--------------------
Lovu Zdar
Mick

A Man of Pleasure, Enterprise, Wit and Spirit Rare Books, Big Game Hunting, English Rifles, Fishing, Explosives, Chauvinism, Insensitivity, Public Drunkenness and Sloth, Champion of Lost and Unpopular Causes.

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Ingwe
.275 member

Reged: 08/07/04
Posts: 70
Loc: Texas

Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: mickey]
#16605 - 12/07/04 01:07 PM

Umm, with all due respect, and someone please correct me if I am wrong, but I think that the .318 WR was developed in England, and England is not an African country, it is a European country. That, I believe, would make the .318 a European cartridge, not an African cartridge. In fact, I cannot think of a single cartridge that was ever developed by the Africans. I read a story of an African shooting a piece of steel reinforcing bar out of a muzzle loader once.. I guess that would maybe be classified as a true African cartridge.

--------------------

_________________________________________________

Learn from other people's mistakes - you can't live long enough to make them all yourself.

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mikeh416Rigby
.450 member

Reged: 24/02/03
Posts: 6051
Loc: The beautiful Oley Valley, PA....

Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: NitroX]
#16606 - 12/07/04 01:23 PM

Boy, that's a tough order to narrow it down to one caliber

. My personal favorite is the tried and proven 375 H&H but blown out to the Ackley Improved version:). The reason I went up to the 375 is because plains game encompasses such a variety of animals from the smallest Duikers up to the large Eland. I like 2 large holes in any game I shoot, and with a good bullet, the 375 is up to the task.

There are, of course, many excellent calibers available that will take care of 95% of plains game with no trouble at all. It comes down to putting a good bullet in the right spot with the first shot.

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Gibbs505
.333 member

Reged: 09/08/03
Posts: 442
Loc: BC, Canada

Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: mikeh416Rigby]
#16612 - 12/07/04 03:18 PM

For some real nostalga, how about the tried and ture 303 British. You could even get it in a double rifle!

--------------------
So I can't spell, so what?

Those who beat their swords into ploughshares, will plough for those who don't!

Those who fail to learn from history will be doomed to repeat it

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mickey
.416 member

Reged: 05/01/03
Posts: 4647
Loc: Pend Oreille Valley, Idaho

Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: Ingwe]
#16615 - 12/07/04 04:05 PM

Ingwe

The 318 was developed for Africa and India. The 8mm Remington was developed for....for....for no good reason I can tell.

If it's not in John Taylors book,"African Rifles and Cartridges", then it can't be an African Cartridge. Pretty simple, what? Would you commit Heresy and question the Prophet?

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cr500
.300 member

Reged: 11/10/03
Posts: 213
Loc: Singleton ,Australia

Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: NitroX]
#16616 - 12/07/04 04:55 PM

How about the 300 Weatherby.
It has the velocity to handle Namibias long shots without being too hard on bullets.
With 220 gn round noses or 180-200gn Barnes X or Failsafes ,it is good for the biggest of plains game without being excessive for Duikers and other small stuff.
Flat trajectory ,good power and not TOO much recoil.
Ammo shouldnt be too hard to come by in an emergency.
Thats why I bought one. Just gotta get myself over to Africa for my first hunt.

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Will
.333 member

Reged: 04/02/03
Posts: 303
Loc: Kansas

Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: NitroX]
#16618 - 12/07/04 09:39 PM

On my first trip to Africa, I was caught up in the hype of needing a .375 H&H, though it was and is over-kill 95% of the time. And a .375 is no powder puff in recoil, and would cut me with the scope if I was not careful.

But I have used a .375 H&H fairly confidently on every critter I have hunted with it in Africa. I have used it on everything except jumbo. And the 95% over-kill means that I have had something in hand when paying up trophy fess, even if my shot was off a bit.

The original purpose of the .375 H&H was for African hunting, and does a pretty good job of it.

The best single cartridge for Africa, even for plainsgame, was and still is the .375 Belted Rimless Magnum Nitro-Express.

--------------------
_________________________________________________
Bill Stewart

Once you have been amongst them, there is no such thing as too much gun.

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NitroX
.700 member

Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39594
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...

Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: mickey]
#16620 - 12/07/04 11:09 PM

Mick

The 8mm Rem Mag was developed to add a belt and a brandname to the otherwise ideal 8x68S.

Now Remington can probably remove the belt, base in ona .404 rather than a .375 H&H, and call it the 8mm Ultra Clean Magnum, quaranteed to get whites whiter than white.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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TerryR
.224 member

Reged: 13/07/04
Posts: 42
Loc: Greensburg, Pa.

Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: NitroX]
#16624 - 13/07/04 01:51 AM

For the first trip, the one that you shoot the best.
Most of us don't go to Africa every year, so when we go it is something special. A strange place, animals that you've never hunted before, a PH at your side and trackers watching over your shoulder. It all adds up to a new unsettling experience, having "old Faithful" in your hands makes that first shot a lot easier.

The second time you'll use a 375 H&H because it's what old time Africa hunters like you always use.

The third time you will use a big double rifle because that's what the PH's use.

The fourth time you'll take the rifle that you shoot the best.

For me it was:

#1 30-06 and 375 H&H ( I was hunting Buffalo in addition to plains game) in M-70's.

#2 375 H&H - Krieghof double

#3 next year - I'm not sure maybe a 7X57

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mikeh416Rigby
.450 member

Reged: 24/02/03
Posts: 6051
Loc: The beautiful Oley Valley, PA....

Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: TerryR]
#16630 - 13/07/04 02:41 AM

I saw a German hunter take a Texas heart shot on a big Eland bull using the 7x57 with a 175 grain X bullet. The bullet entered the ham and ended up in the brisket! Over 6' of penetration! That was my first introduction to the importance of sectional density when it comes to penetration.

Two years ago a friend went with me to RSA for his first Safari. He bought a Win. Model 70, classic stainless in 375 H&H 2 months before the trip. He was terrified of it, and shot it very poorly. The first morning we sighted in our rifles, and he was shooting 10-11 inch patterns. The P.H. tried the rifle and put 2 consecutive shots in the same hole. He then told my friend that it was aparent that he was afraid of the gun and couldn't let him shoot it. The P.H. gave my friend a 7x57 loaded with 160 grain Nosler Partitions. My friend ended up taking 11 animals from Steenbok up to Gemsbok and Zebra, with 1 shot each.

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ovis
.300 member

Reged: 26/01/03
Posts: 216
Loc: Homer, Alaska

Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: NitroX]
#16631 - 13/07/04 03:44 AM

Mass Debate,

In spite of Mickey's no Remington remarks, I think the 8mm Rem.Mag. is a very under rated cartridge. I think one should handload to get the most out of any cartridge and that's why I would choose a .375RUM. Load it down and you have the H&H with less pressure and it's easy to shoot albeit not a classic. Load it up and kill anything you want. If I were to choose a "classic", it would be a .303(a friend of mine has killed his moose every year for a long time with one)or a 7MM Mauser(.275 Rigby) just because it kills like a seven mm. A classic to me would also be one that has delivered something to hand when it's time to pay up as Will stated.................it all really comes down to what you can shoot well..............

Joe

--------------------
"Where there's a hobble, there's hope."

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DPhillips
.375 member

Reged: 09/10/03
Posts: 819
Loc: Alaska

Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: ovis]
#16640 - 13/07/04 10:12 AM

Okay, here's a deal for you fellas. If NitroExpress.com will supply the rifles, cartridges, daily rates, trophy fees, etc... and a small stipend per year (negotiable of course) I will go to Africa test each of these rifles and their ammunition on all matters of plainsgame. Testing shall run for 20 years or till I'm run out of country (or continent as the case may be).

I will procure the appropriate attaire consisting of knee high patent leather boots, flouncy pants

, shooting jacket, monocule, and pith helmet.

Please send your negotiable offer in the form of a PM to me.

Thank you, good day sir.

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mickey
.416 member

Reged: 05/01/03
Posts: 4647
Loc: Pend Oreille Valley, Idaho

Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: DPhillips]
#16644 - 13/07/04 11:03 AM

DPhillips

Your check is in the Mail.

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mickey
.416 member

Reged: 05/01/03
Posts: 4647
Loc: Pend Oreille Valley, Idaho

Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: ovis]
#16645 - 13/07/04 11:04 AM

In reply to:

ovis;

In spite of Mickey's no Remington remarks, .......

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DPhillips
.375 member

Reged: 09/10/03
Posts: 819
Loc: Alaska

Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: mickey]
#16649 - 13/07/04 12:19 PM

Mick,
To streamline the process, and of course to save a coins for NitroExpress.com, I'll limit my testing to the following:
256
7x57 (275 Rigby)
275 H&H Mag
280 Ross
30-06
300 H&H
300 Weatherby
303 British
8x57
318 WR
333 Jeff
338 Win
350 Rigby Mag
9.3x62
9x57
375 H&H

As you will notice, Mick, no Remington cartridges!!!

Should I include the 45/70 Govt (in a Marlin lever action of course). Oh yeah, that's just for Dangerous Game.

Edited by DPhillips (14/07/04 03:22 AM)

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mickey
.416 member

Reged: 05/01/03
Posts: 4647
Loc: Pend Oreille Valley, Idaho

Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: DPhillips]
#16655 - 13/07/04 01:20 PM

That is fine but you may not use any of my money on any new fangled cartridges. One should never hunt with a cartridge younger than they are.

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NitroX
.700 member

Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39594
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...

Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: TerryR]
#16656 - 13/07/04 01:29 PM

In reply to:

For the first trip, the one that you shoot the best.
Most of us don't go to Africa every year, so when we go it is something special. A strange place, animals that you've never hunted before, a PH at your side and trackers watching over your shoulder. It all adds up to a new unsettling experience, having "old Faithful" in your hands makes that first shot a lot easier.

The second time you'll use a 375 H&H because it's what old time Africa hunters like you always use.

The third time you will use a big double rifle because that's what the PH's use.

The fourth time you'll take the rifle that you shoot the best.

Terry you must be a prophet.

I am only on the third trip, take a big double stage. But will my .22 Magnum do for the fourth stage ......

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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NitroX
.700 member

Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39594
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...

Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: DPhillips]
#16657 - 13/07/04 01:34 PM

Oy!!!

Who is spending my non-existant money!

I can supply you with an all expenses trip to Aussie (you need to get here under your own steam though) on a big game rabbit hunt. Lots of bullet testing can be done. I have "herds" of the buggers and damned dangerous too (if you put your foot in a herd burrow unexpectantly). Need some doubles too in case the herd runs the wrong way after the first shot.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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ovis
.300 member

Reged: 26/01/03
Posts: 216
Loc: Homer, Alaska

Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: mickey]
#16658 - 13/07/04 02:20 PM

Mickey,

Did you say you were one of the partners in the gold & copper mine across Cook Inlet by Lake Iliamna?

If so, you could keep some of the excess change here and DPhillips and I both will be happy to test any of the rounds you wish anywhere you wish.......even sans Remingtons.(Sorry to horn in on your offer there D).

By the way Mickey, I did recently acquire an old .350 Rigby Magnum........so you see, there's hope!

Joe

--------------------
"Where there's a hobble, there's hope."

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4seventy
Sponsor

Reged: 07/05/03
Posts: 2210
Loc: Queensland Australia

Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: ovis]
#16666 - 13/07/04 08:55 PM

In reply to:

By the way Mickey, I did recently acquire an old .350 Rigby Magnum........so you see, there's hope!

Ah yes, the 350 Rigby mag.
I've never been to Africa but if I do ever get there I'd be quite happy to use that cartridge for plains game I think!

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Gibbs505
.333 member

Reged: 09/08/03
Posts: 442
Loc: BC, Canada

Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: DPhillips]
#16683 - 14/07/04 03:19 AM

DPhillips
You missed out on the 303British. It has proberly taken more game in africa then all those you listed combined!!

--------------------
So I can't spell, so what?

Those who beat their swords into ploughshares, will plough for those who don't!

Those who fail to learn from history will be doomed to repeat it

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DPhillips
.375 member

Reged: 09/10/03
Posts: 819
Loc: Alaska

Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: Gibbs505]
#16684 - 14/07/04 03:21 AM

Oops, I did miss the 303 Brit and the 8x57. Got in a hurry while typing I guess. My apologies, no offense intended. I'll go back and edit the original post so that NitroX won't miss the purchase order for firearms and ammunition!

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