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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Double Rifles
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westaussie
.224 member


Reged: 12/06/04
Posts: 5
Loc: west australia
Regulating a double rifle
      #15760 - 12/06/04 11:21 PM

does anyone know the technique for regulating a double rifle? I cant find a book or article on it anywhere---any suggestions?

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bonanza
.400 member


Reged: 17/05/04
Posts: 2335
Loc: South Carolina
Re: Regulating a double rifle [Re: westaussie]
      #15762 - 13/06/04 12:25 AM

Here is the technique I’m going to try .

Start with 1 bullet weight/type at a time. Chose a powder (temperature insensitive types are what I use), start with charge at least 10% below max listed, load three of four sets of 10 rounds one grain of powder at a time. For example, one set at N grains, next set N+1 grains, …, etc. For set one, put up three targets in a triangle, shoot two rounds (right / left ) in one target to get an idea where the point of impact is and to "foul" the barrel. Now, shoot a right / left combo in a right / left target arrangement, let gun cool a bit, repeat twice more, retrieve targets, clean bores. Now you should have shot 10 rounds. This method allows you to see how you barrels/loads group and there point of impact. Repeat this process for the other sets. Eventually you will find one load for each barrel that prints the closets to your point of aim. This is very time consuming, but is the best method I can think of that is scientific.


--------------------


"Speak Precisely" G. Gordon Liddy.

"Life is absurd, chaotic and we must define its purpose with our actions" Abert Camus

"I''m the dude playing a dude disguised as another dude."

"Yo! Mr. White"

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475Guy
.400 member


Reged: 22/08/03
Posts: 1088
Loc: Kali, US
Re: Regulating a double rifle [Re: westaussie]
      #15764 - 13/06/04 12:42 AM

If you go into the older posts, I think this has been covered somewhere. You probably have to do the time consuming search for that particular bit of info unless somebody can chime in and point you to right post.

--------------------
Lo do they call to me,
They bid me take my place among
them in the Halls of Valhalla,
Where the brave may live forever.

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ALAN_MCKENZIE
.400 member


Reged: 24/03/04
Posts: 1214
Loc: Western Australia
Re: Regulating a double rifle [Re: 475Guy]
      #15766 - 13/06/04 01:07 AM

Send me a private email and I will put you intouch with a couple of locals who can help you.
Include your ph # or ring me on 95823182
Al

--------------------
"Dogs always bark at their master"
Sir Seretse Khama.25th June 1949

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Geronimo
.275 member


Reged: 14/04/04
Posts: 83
Loc: Michigan,USA
Re: Regulating a double rifle [Re: westaussie]
      #15772 - 13/06/04 05:52 AM

I just posted an answer over on AR.

Geronimo

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4seventy
Sponsor


Reged: 07/05/03
Posts: 2210
Loc: Queensland Australia
Re: Regulating a double rifle [Re: westaussie]
      #15776 - 13/06/04 11:25 AM

Hi westaussie and welcome.

If it is the actual barrel regulation that you are interested in you could try to get a copy of Alexander Gray's book "The Hammerless Double Rifle" as it gives some details.
You could give Peter Moncrieff Books in Victoria a call on (03)98986684.

Are you wanting to regulate or re-regulate a double or are you just wanting to know how it is done?

I've done a bit of regulating and re-regulating and may be able to help you out regarding the how to (and how not to) of the process.



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westaussie
.224 member


Reged: 12/06/04
Posts: 5
Loc: west australia
Re: Regulating a double rifle [Re: 4seventy]
      #15841 - 16/06/04 12:20 AM

thanks 4seventy I have ordered the book

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DUGABOY1
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Reged: 02/02/03
Posts: 1340
Loc: TEXAS USA
Re: Regulating a double rifle [Re: westaussie]
      #15878 - 17/06/04 05:53 AM

Are you wanting the process of regulating a double rifle, or are you asking about the working up a load to shoot to the regulation of a double rifle? They are two intirely different things,though most have a bad habit of useing the word regulateing for both.

I suspect you are asking about the physical act of regulation of a barrel set, with wedges, and and solder! The Alexander Gray Book "The Hammerless Double Rifle" is a good start, but will tell you only the H&H method, which is my way as well, but there are others that work as well! If you are asking about working up a load to shoot to the regulation of a double rifle, then Graeme Wright's book "Shooting The British Double Rifle" is the book to buy! Both, however are MUST READs for anyone interested in double rifles

--------------------
..........Mac >>>===(x)===>
DUGABOY1, and MacD37 founding member of DRSS www.doublerifleshooterssociety.com
"If I die today, I have had a life well spent, for I've been to see the Elephant, and smelled the smoke of Africa!"

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4seventy
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Reged: 07/05/03
Posts: 2210
Loc: Queensland Australia
Re: Regulating a double rifle [Re: DUGABOY1]
      #15892 - 17/06/04 10:29 AM

In reply to:

The Alexander Gray Book "The Hammerless Double Rifle" is a good start, but will tell you only the H&H method



Mac,
It is true that much of this book is based on the design and building of Holland doubles, however Chapter 4 which is titled "Regulating the Double Rifle" covers the basics of regulating and is applicable to any SxS double barrel rifle, not just those made by Holland and Holland.

The Holland wedge components are far more complex than the basic horizontal wedge found in the majority of doubles IMO.

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DUGABOY1
.400 member


Reged: 02/02/03
Posts: 1340
Loc: TEXAS USA
Re: Regulating a double rifle [Re: 4seventy]
      #15922 - 18/06/04 02:24 AM

4seventy ,you are quite correct, the method is applicable to any double rifle. The differences in the H&H system from most is their use of heated IRONS placed in the barrels, turning the barrels themselves into soldering irons. This is better, IMO, because it give a more uniform heating around the diameter of the barrel, and doesn't heat one side of the barrel hotter than the other, as useing a torch does. Less potentual for warpage! Additional is the use of stainless wire wrap to hold the convergance, while tweeking the barrels so they both shoot to the same elevation, is something not many use. Most use elaborate fixtures. The wedge design is also better in the H&H than others, as you say, but requires more work to do.

All I was saying, or trying to say is, there is more than one way to skin a cat, and this book only shows one, but I consider it to be the best system!

--------------------
..........Mac >>>===(x)===>
DUGABOY1, and MacD37 founding member of DRSS www.doublerifleshooterssociety.com
"If I die today, I have had a life well spent, for I've been to see the Elephant, and smelled the smoke of Africa!"

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bonanza
.400 member


Reged: 17/05/04
Posts: 2335
Loc: South Carolina
Re: Regulating a double rifle [Re: DUGABOY1]
      #15924 - 18/06/04 03:42 AM

Can the barrels become un-regulated over time?

--------------------


"Speak Precisely" G. Gordon Liddy.

"Life is absurd, chaotic and we must define its purpose with our actions" Abert Camus

"I''m the dude playing a dude disguised as another dude."

"Yo! Mr. White"

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4seventy
Sponsor


Reged: 07/05/03
Posts: 2210
Loc: Queensland Australia
Re: Regulating a double rifle [Re: DUGABOY1]
      #15929 - 18/06/04 08:11 AM

In reply to:

The differences in the H&H system from most is their use of heated IRONS placed in the barrels, turning the barrels themselves into soldering irons.



Mac,
I would guess that these days many regulators would use gas torches but surely "back in the good old days" many other quality makers also used the hot iron method of heating, not just H&H?

How did Westley Richards, Webley, Rigby etc heat their barrels during regulation on guns built in the pre war era?

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4seventy
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Reged: 07/05/03
Posts: 2210
Loc: Queensland Australia
Re: Regulating a double rifle [Re: bonanza]
      #15930 - 18/06/04 08:42 AM

In reply to:

Can the barrels become un-regulated over time?



There are things that can affect regulation with use over time, like...

Throat erosion serious enough to reduce velocity in one barrel more than the other.

Muzzel crown damage or wear.

Loose or detached rib sections where the solder is no longer intact for the entire length of the rib to barrel and wedge to barrel joints.

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atkinson6
.375 member


Reged: 26/01/04
Posts: 678
Loc: Idaho
Re: Regulating a double rifle [Re: 4seventy]
      #16076 - 22/06/04 01:51 AM

You regulate a double with solder, a torch, and wedges..regulation is done at the factory...

You adjust it by firing different loads until they come together as a group that equals the 4 shot group of the "worst" barrel and this gives you the accuracy potential of your particular rifle, it will shoot no better than the "worst" barrel...(group both barrels seperately to start with)

Then you sight the rifle in by movement of the front and/or rear sights....

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