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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Double Rifles
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4biga1
.224 member


Reged: 27/02/04
Posts: 2
bolt action double rifle ?
      #13362 - 12/04/04 10:35 AM

There was a post a few months ago which was talking about a bolt action double rifle. By the pictures it look like a Blaser bolt action.Can anyone tell me who made it?

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DUGABOY1
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Reged: 02/02/03
Posts: 1340
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Re: bolt action double rifle ? [Re: 4biga1]
      #13448 - 13/04/04 10:24 PM

In reply to:

There was a post a few months ago which was talking about a bolt action double rifle. By the pictures it look like a Blaser bolt action.Can anyone tell me who made it?



It was made by someone who has no idea what a double rifle is supposed to be, or do! It is an over engenered, pushfeed, heavy as lead, expencive as a fine Purdey, and with the ballance of an anvil, abortion, IMO! Someone in Canada made it, 20 years ago! The price is not the only reason you never see them!

If pressed, I'll tell you how I really feel about them!

--------------------
..........Mac >>>===(x)===>
DUGABOY1, and MacD37 founding member of DRSS www.doublerifleshooterssociety.com
"If I die today, I have had a life well spent, for I've been to see the Elephant, and smelled the smoke of Africa!"

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NitroXAdministrator
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Reged: 25/12/02
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Re: bolt action double rifle ? [Re: 4biga1]
      #13454 - 14/04/04 01:23 AM

The bolt action double was probably a Fuchs.

Don't worry about Mac. He secretly wants one really bad.



--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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4seventy
Sponsor


Reged: 07/05/03
Posts: 2210
Loc: Queensland Australia
Re: bolt action double rifle ? [Re: NitroX]
      #13465 - 14/04/04 08:48 AM

In reply to:

Don't worry about Mac. He secretly wants one really bad.




Hey now, who's the one that features a piccy of the muzzels of this very same rifle in their banner logo? Huh?
We all know who really covets this double monstosity!


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NitroXAdministrator
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Reged: 25/12/02
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Re: bolt action double rifle ? [Re: 4seventy]
      #13473 - 14/04/04 09:41 AM

It's called expediency, until I do a photograph of a different double.



--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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hubel458
.375 member


Reged: 13/02/04
Posts: 649
Loc: Brinton,MI-USA
Re: bolt action double rifle ? [Re: NitroX]
      #13494 - 14/04/04 04:35 PM

They were engineered by Josef Szecsei of Windsor,
Ontario, CAN. He had both SxS and O/U. Made prototypes about 10 years ago and then had a EU company make some.
I have an old brochure with info and pics.Ed.

--------------------
Ed Hubel

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Tom_Bigbore
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Reged: 16/01/04
Posts: 44
Loc: Germany
Re: bolt action double rifle ? [Re: 4biga1]
      #13498 - 14/04/04 08:48 PM

It´s probably a Fuchs - Szecsei. See http://www.jagdwaffe.com/english/index_e.html

Fuchs built double bolt action rifles up 700 cal.

IMO they know what they are doing.

Tom

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4seventy
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Reged: 07/05/03
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Re: bolt action double rifle ? [Re: NitroX]
      #13515 - 15/04/04 08:14 AM

In reply to:

It's called expediency, until I do a photograph of a different double.




Yes, we all know that you eventually intend to feature the muzzels of a "proper" double in your banner, ie an over/under, but, will you still also feature the second best double style which is of course the side by side?

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vigillinus
.300 member


Reged: 11/12/03
Posts: 115
Re: bolt action double rifle ? [Re: 4seventy]
      #13528 - 15/04/04 02:07 PM

Have seen them at the Las Vegas gun show. Beautifully made monstrosity.

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Gibbs505
.333 member


Reged: 09/08/03
Posts: 442
Loc: BC, Canada
Re: bolt action double rifle ? [Re: vigillinus]
      #13553 - 16/04/04 09:07 AM

Now that is a oxymoron!!

--------------------
So I can't spell, so what?

Those who beat their swords into ploughshares, will plough for those who don't!

Those who fail to learn from history will be doomed to repeat it

Edited by Gibbs505 (16/04/04 09:08 AM)

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M82A1Barret50Cal
.275 member


Reged: 12/04/04
Posts: 96
Loc: ACT, Australia
Re: bolt action double rifle ? [Re: Gibbs505]
      #13821 - 22/04/04 11:24 AM

I agree with Mac, it completely destroys the purpose of the double rifle...


M82A1

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Double_Trouble
.375 member


Reged: 27/04/06
Posts: 577
Loc: Canada
Re: bolt action double rifle ? [Re: DUGABOY1]
      #56222 - 03/05/06 01:24 AM

Hello I am a new member and was drawn to this site based on a search I was doing on the DR in this thread....hey Dugaboy1 ....when and where did you handle the Szecsei/Fuchs double bolt? and who quoted you the price?

Double Trouble

--------------------
Double Trouble,
Speak not of what you do not know.
Listen up when it's time to.

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pwm
.300 member


Reged: 15/06/04
Posts: 216
Loc: Banana Republik of Germany
Re: bolt action double rifle ? [Re: Double_Trouble]
      #56249 - 03/05/06 05:08 AM

have had Fuchse double barrel bolt actions in my hand and they are better than you imagine. this means handling, I havnt shot it, hard to do on a gun show.

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Double_Trouble
.375 member


Reged: 27/04/06
Posts: 577
Loc: Canada
Re: bolt action double rifle ? [Re: pwm]
      #56312 - 03/05/06 09:15 PM

I think that that is where you and I differ from dugaboy PWM, we have both handled them and know the difference. I too think that the Szecsei/Fuchs DBR is fantastically made and very well balanced.
the looks of the rifle are decieving as it appears ( visually ) to be heavy but when hefted, you soon learn that the rifle checks in at a respectable wieght at around 11 lbs.
for the calibers we are talking about and the game these firearms are meant to bring down, I wouldnt want to be carrying much less.

Did you handle the Szecsei/Fuchs at an SCI show?


--------------------
Double Trouble,
Speak not of what you do not know.
Listen up when it's time to.

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pwm
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Reged: 15/06/04
Posts: 216
Loc: Banana Republik of Germany
Re: bolt action double rifle ? [Re: Double_Trouble]
      #56419 - 05/05/06 02:19 AM

no, it was on the IWA in Nürnberg, quality of the work is outstanding, if you like it or not is your own opinion.
in any case it will be a highligth in any gun collection in hundred years.

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Double_Trouble
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Reged: 27/04/06
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Re: bolt action double rifle ? [Re: pwm]
      #56437 - 05/05/06 05:42 AM

I agree.... Mr. Fuchs takes a back seat to no maker that i have ever seen and, fortunate for me, i have had both teh honour and pleasure to shoulder a great number of well made guns both at shows such as SCI and IWA as well as on the range from time to time.

IMO Fuchs runs with best that are, or ever have been, in the business.

--------------------
Double Trouble,
Speak not of what you do not know.
Listen up when it's time to.

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mickey
.416 member


Reged: 05/01/03
Posts: 4647
Loc: Pend Oreille Valley, Idaho
Re: bolt action double rifle ? [Re: Double_Trouble]
      #56447 - 05/05/06 12:01 PM

I guess I fall in the middle here, sort of.

The workmanship is very good, the weight , workable. The balance atrocious. Point ability is near zero.

To keep the weight under control the barrels and action use titanium. They are very muzzle light, making them a bugger to get on target.

It points much more like a bolt rifle than a Double. I guess this is as much as could be hoped for as it is neither fish nor fowl. It is an oddity and a curio that happens to be well constructed.

'Cuckoo Clockish'.

--------------------
Lovu Zdar
Mick

A Man of Pleasure, Enterprise, Wit and Spirit Rare Books, Big Game Hunting, English Rifles, Fishing, Explosives, Chauvinism, Insensitivity, Public Drunkenness and Sloth, Champion of Lost and Unpopular Causes.

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mehulkamdar
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Reged: 09/01/04
Posts: 3688
Loc: State of Ill-Annoy USA.
Re: bolt action double rifle ? [Re: mickey]
      #56452 - 05/05/06 12:39 PM

I have never seen one in the wood and metal leave alone shoot one but when Joseph Szecsei patented various designs I got his address through the gunwriter Holt Bodinson (a fine man from my communication with him) and I corresponded with Szecsei until my wife and I came to the USA, shortly before Fuchs started making two of the many variations designed by Szecsei.

There are many variations of the basic design that is being made by Fuchs including straight pull bolt actions to enable faster repeat shots, drillings and some discarded designs like one version that was based on the Mauser 66 short bolt design to make the rifles shorter and more handy. Szecsei was working on a CRF version also though I have no idea what happened since.

I enjoyed communicating with him - as an inventor who was working hard to perfect his designs he had many ideas and he had the means, courtesy his huge factory making the bodies for Ford vehicles to build whatever he wanted for himself. I would think that barring health problems or licensing and production issues he would have many more designs in the years to come, refinements of what is an initial concept for all practical purposes.

And a post script - there IS a Blaser double bolt, a grotesque rifle with two Blaser barreled actions attached together and two bolts, one on each side operating that particular barrel called the Blaser Duo. The company is so ashamed of this monstrosity that they do not even list it on their website.

Cheers!

--------------------
The Ark was made by amateurs. Experts built the Titanic.

Mehul Kamdar

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NE450No2
.375 member


Reged: 10/01/03
Posts: 942
Re: bolt action double rifle ? [Re: mehulkamdar]
      #56459 - 05/05/06 02:06 PM

Mehul
If I had the money I would have to have one of those Blaser R 93 double rifles.

If only for the novelity of it.
A bbl set in 308 and one in 375.

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Double_Trouble
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Reged: 27/04/06
Posts: 577
Loc: Canada
Re: bolt action double rifle ? [Re: mehulkamdar]
      #56470 - 05/05/06 09:54 PM

Szecsei is still hard at it albeit at a slower pace with his hands but not with his mind....... he continues to create new models, assist in the refining of current models, and is anxiously awaiting the delivery of the first O/U model as produced by Fuchs.

From an earlier post: there are only a few Szecsei rifles with Ti barrels and two that come to mind are the brace (O/U & SxS) of Szecsei Safari Seven hundred a wild cat 1000 grain stopper that this gifted inventor came up with.

The rifles produced by Fuchs have Ti components , namely the reciever and the express sights and ramps, and scope base and rings, so I dont see that the rifles are muzzle light at all. perhaps you have handled one of the 700's and these proto types do indeed feel light at the business end but would be extrememly heavy had Szecsei not used Ti barrels

note: I support your comment on Mr. Bodinson a fine and very knowlegable man indeed.
If you have spoken with Szecsei, then you know that he doesnt mince words and what he builds ...... Works and works well!.......I would dearly love to have one of his rifles as produced by Fuchs ......inventive genious married with exquisite craftmanship,,,,, hard to beat that combo!

--------------------
Double Trouble,
Speak not of what you do not know.
Listen up when it's time to.

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Double_Trouble
.375 member


Reged: 27/04/06
Posts: 577
Loc: Canada
Re: bolt action double rifle ? [Re: pwm]
      #56473 - 05/05/06 10:45 PM

PWM...... I also saw it at IWA and at many SCI shows.
IWA was where the first production model was sold. The gun continues to gain a following and there are approx 50 rifles being used in the field, with orders on the books.
I believe it was two years ago at an SCI show in Reno that I saw a 375 SxS with stainless barrels and wood fit for royalty!
I cant get over the workmanship and could only imagine having a speciman such as that in my cabninet......

maybe one fine day.....sigh

--------------------
Double Trouble,
Speak not of what you do not know.
Listen up when it's time to.

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smicha6551
.275 member


Reged: 09/08/05
Posts: 88
Loc: NYC & Kuwait
Re: bolt action double rifle ? [Re: mehulkamdar]
      #56487 - 06/05/06 02:02 AM

Mehul,

When you posted on the Blaser I thought, naa, there can't be - further there's a drilling they make which is called the Duo (upside down of course), maybe he's confused.

I'm sorry I looked:




I like the bolt knob and the wood though.

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Double_Trouble
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Reged: 27/04/06
Posts: 577
Loc: Canada
Re: bolt action double rifle ? [Re: smicha6551]
      #56489 - 06/05/06 03:39 AM

yes Blaser is having a go at copying the Szecsei DBR

Patent thieves !

--------------------
Double Trouble,
Speak not of what you do not know.
Listen up when it's time to.

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500Nitro
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Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: bolt action double rifle ? [Re: Double_Trouble]
      #56497 - 06/05/06 06:55 AM


Double_Trouble

If it was patented I doubt they would be copying it ?

I would say the original DB Bolt Rifle would be patented for
the action used but they couldn't patent the concept of a DB Bolt Gun.

And I think the Blaser action system is well suited to the concept.

Not thatI'd own one but .........


500Nitro

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Double_Trouble
.375 member


Reged: 27/04/06
Posts: 577
Loc: Canada
Re: bolt action double rifle ? [Re: 500Nitro]
      #56498 - 06/05/06 07:05 AM

500N:
there is some debate as to what they have and have not "liberated" from the Szecsei patent but it appears that there is certainly some strong "overlapping".

I will leave it at that except to say that the Szecsei/Fuchs gun is head and shoulders above the Blaser in form, fit, and function.
How are things down your way 500?... winter is fast approaching?

--------------------
Double Trouble,
Speak not of what you do not know.
Listen up when it's time to.

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