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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Double Rifles
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JPK
.375 member


Reged: 31/08/04
Posts: 734
Loc: Chevy Chase, MD
Re: .577 BPE vs 20ga. RBL Professional [Re: Yukon577]
      #131743 - 08/04/09 05:15 AM

Quote:

Hi JPK,
I get to hunt Yukon moose and grizzly and black bears quite a lot, having them in my yard at times. I have shot my share of them with a lot of different guns and watched even more shot. I cannot think of anthing that would have much of an advantage on a .577 BPE for big moose or bears. When I was searching for a double rifle for hunting these animals my choice of calibers was first; a .500 NE., second; a .470 NE., and third a .577 BPE or NE. Of course price and availability was more the deciding factor, but I was sure not feeling like I was settling when I found my .577 BPE. I think a good .450 NE. would be great too and also a .500 BPE and similar rounds. The 20 ga. was never on my list.
My friend has a lovely original Westley Richards 12ga. percussion double rifle. I sure would like to see that used on our big moose or bears some day too. In close it should be quite adequate. I have heard of moose taken with 12ga. slugs but not 20ga. I am sure it could be done but it's not a popular choice. There are more 12ga. carried for bear defense than anything else, I have heard of the odd 20ga. usually for a lady or someone with an injury or similar. When you see grizzles walking around your first thought is not, " I could get by with a small gun". They are likely fine, but why take a chance?



If I lived in Alaska I wouldn't have bought a 20ga, if Tarawa, the fellow asking for thoughts, lived in Alaska, I wouldn't have mentioned the rifled sxs 20ga from CSMC. Tarawa's signiture shows that he lives in Florida, I live in Maryland. No brown bears in Florida, or Maryland.

JPK

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Yukon577
.224 member


Reged: 11/03/08
Posts: 37
Loc: Yukon Territory
Re: .577 BPE vs 20ga. RBL Professional [Re: JPK]
      #131748 - 08/04/09 06:05 AM

JPK,
I was only replying to your comment;
"The only NA critters I can figure where a 577 BPE or 12ga round ball rifle has an advantage over a 500 BPE or 20ga shooting either sabots or Fosberry types is brown bear and Yukon moose. And then, there are much better coices.
JPK"

I don't know of many better choices than the .577 BPE for big moose or bears.
I fully agree that the 20ga. double would be a great deal of fun to shoot and load for. And living in the lower 48 will be more than enough gun for anything in close. The new 20ga. double doesn't have nearly the alure to me of a classic double rifle but it's not nearly the cost either. There is no right or wrong, just a matter of taste and it's your choice.

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JPK
.375 member


Reged: 31/08/04
Posts: 734
Loc: Chevy Chase, MD
Re: .577 BPE vs 20ga. RBL Professional [Re: Yukon577]
      #131753 - 08/04/09 07:26 AM

The appeal of the 20ga rifled sxs is that we can use it here in our shotgun only areas while no rifle may be used - except muzzle loader. I would prefer a 12ga or 20ga Paradox or similar, like the WR Faunnetta, but the high cost for the limited (limited use: breach loader season runs only two weeks) and replacable use (replaceable use: meaning that I can purchase a much, much cheaper weapon for the same utility) keep me wishing and not buying. When the CSMC rifled 20ga sxs came along recently it filled the gap perfectly, legal, not too damned expensive, and a hell of a lot more fun and interesting than my rifled 12ga pump deer gun.

As for brown bear, I would list the 375H&H, 338wm, etc, etc, as better choices. In doubles, a QD scoped 375 FL or even H&H... Moose, even less rifle with more range. But I get your drift, the 577 BPE is a fine double rifle for the purpose if you're looking for the joy of using a double rifle, and less expensive than a 450NE or similar.

Personally, I'm not wedded to double rifles, I love them, but I also love a really good bolt rifle. Where I find them the best choice is where I love a double most, and that would include elephant hunting. Might include big bears too from what I have read (no personal experience), and I have a nice 375H&H double for that, awaiting the instalation of good QD mounts.

JPK

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gatsby
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Reged: 05/09/05
Posts: 862
Loc: inland valley CA USA
Re: .577 BPE vs 20ga. RBL Professional [Re: JPK]
      #131772 - 08/04/09 11:07 AM

Obviously the RBl is not as versatile as a Fauneta or Paradox but do you think you can attain or surpass the ballistics of a Fauneta with a 425gr slug?

--------------------
"Recoil is insignificant when there is a tiger on the head of your elephant" The Maharaja of Cooch Behar



Edited by gatsby (08/04/09 11:09 AM)

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tarawa
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Reged: 21/10/07
Posts: 420
Loc: South Florida
Re: .577 BPE vs 20ga. RBL Professional [Re: tarawa]
      #131806 - 08/04/09 09:33 PM

I was searching the Siace website and when I downloaded the full catalogue, they show fully rifled barrels for several of their double shotguns, in both 12 and 20 gauge. I wonder if they are regulated in any way?

--------------------
Life is for Service

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JPK
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Reged: 31/08/04
Posts: 734
Loc: Chevy Chase, MD
Re: .577 BPE vs 20ga. RBL Professional [Re: tarawa]
      #131823 - 09/04/09 12:45 AM

Gatsby,

I have no doubt that any modern American shotgun can safely accomodate any English load that wouldn't exceed English proof.

Whether it would shoot well, whether the RBL's adjustable regulation provides sufficient range of adjustments, I cannot know.

Tarawa,

I tried several times to order a Siace rifled shotgun and couldn't get it done. I was told at the time - as recently as a year ago - that there was an Italian gun makers' tax charged each gunmaker per calibre, and that Siace would be charged this tax if they offered a rifled barrel shotgun. I was told, "Get an order of ten together and Siace can afford the tax and can to do it." I spoke with Dewing's in West Palm Beach regarding Siace rifled shotguns. Dewing's does a lot of business with Siace and I would recomend them if you wish to inquire further.

BTW, Siace/Dewing's volunteered to regulate with any Federal load that I specified, with Dewing's handling the shipping of the ammo to Siace, which Dewing's apparently does for Siace cartridge doubles it sells, like 45/70's, 444 Marlins, 30-06, etc.

BTW, I understand that Siace was doing the rifled SxS slugguns for Dakota, but these were a disaster. From all I can tell, the disaster resulted from a complete lack of compatibility between business styles and a resulting lack of communications. For example, Siace was regulating with ammo that Dakota couldn't name.

JPK

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tarawa
.333 member


Reged: 21/10/07
Posts: 420
Loc: South Florida
Re: .577 BPE vs 20ga. RBL Professional [Re: JPK]
      #131833 - 09/04/09 01:54 AM

I will stop by Dewings and inquire about the rifled shotguns in addition to the double rifles. I work in West Palm Beach and have never visited their shop. I wonder if the gun tax is the reason of limited calibers of the Siace and Pedersoli DRs?

--------------------
Life is for Service

Edited by tarawa (09/04/09 01:56 AM)

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JPK
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Reged: 31/08/04
Posts: 734
Loc: Chevy Chase, MD
Re: .577 BPE vs 20ga. RBL Professional [Re: tarawa]
      #131868 - 09/04/09 07:23 AM

Maybe on the calibre tax and the limted selections.

Dewing's can be a treat depending on what they happen to have on hand at the time of visit. The range they deal with is WIDE. Maybe a $2k or $3k second hand shotgun or collector rifle and nothing like playing around with a $180k or so rifle or a $90k shotgun!

I bought an A&S Farmars sidelock double rifle from them a couple of years ago while they were at the Vintagers up here in MD and I visit when I'm in Palm Beach visiting my parents (now my mom since my dad passed away in September.)

Nice fellows, and I would buy a gun from them again without hesitation.

JPK

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Huvius
.416 member


Reged: 04/11/07
Posts: 3525
Loc: Colorado
Re: .577 BPE vs 20ga. RBL Professional [Re: JPK]
      #131897 - 09/04/09 12:25 PM

Back to the .577BPE, has anyone been able to get a look at the Greener at BassPro?
Priced too high right now and looks to have led a hard life (bent trigger guard, gouged stock etc. - also, typically, no mention of bore condition.

--------------------
He who lives in the past is doomed to enjoy it.

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