click
.224 member
Reged: 03/01/09
Posts: 8
Loc: Michigan
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Afternoon Everyone...
I will be leaving for Zimbabwe in the next 6 weeks and was just informed by a friend that there are still 4 more Elephant PAC (Problem Animal Control) Permits available in the area. I am taking 2 already but thought I would pass on the info to the board. These Elephants are crop raiders so hunting will be taking place at night when they are in the fields. They are typically all bulls and ranged last year from 30 Pounds to 63 Pounds. They are non exportable trophies as they are classified as problem animals but for these prices you cant complain much.
Prices for 10 Days 1 Elephant $9,500.00 then each additional after that is $7,500.00 per elephant (All Inclusive)
Prices for 7 Days 1 Elephant is $8,500.00 then each additional after that is $7,500.00 per Elephant (All Inclusive)
There will be a film crew there as well for a US Television show.
The outfitter is a VERY highly though of operation so there is NO funny business.
If interested drop me an email and I will fill you in with more details.
jmgworldwide@gmail.com
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Krieghoff Classic .500 NE 3"
Krieghoff Classic .500/470 NE
Merkel SxS .470 NE Model 160A Side Lock w/ Ejectors
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Kalunga
.333 member
Reged: 16/06/06
Posts: 328
Loc: Germany
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The price sounds good at the first glance but I wouldn`t want a film crew of a US tv show in camp. I prefer it peaceful and quiet with no city-people around.
Kalunga
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rscott
.333 member
Reged: 21/03/08
Posts: 328
Loc: wyo., USA
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63lb. PAC elephant huh?
these hunts amount to nothing more than 'gray area' poaching of elephant for profit under the guise of 'PAC', the most abused concept in zimbabwean hunting the last few years.
why do you think they're non-exportable? there is no scientifically based management practice involved in the killing of these numbers, therefore no CITIES permits.
some government minister or general has an appropriated farm or concession with no quota, or the district council of a certain CAMPFIRE area and the districts' minister want a little bigger piece of the action. and there's no shortage of white Zimbabweans, many with only indirect ties to the hunting industry, lining up for a piece either.
some so called PAC is being conducted bordering national park areas within the former 'exclusion' zones, where now there are farms (in name only) ON the park borders. Chizarira NP, Sengwa Research, Charisa Safari Area, Tsholotsho to name just a few that i've seen first hand.
there is some genuine need for PAC, but the abuses of the last few years are way beyond ethical and many border on criminal IMO.
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grandveneur
.400 member
Reged: 21/09/08
Posts: 1356
Loc: France / Germany
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Absolutely right!
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click
.224 member
Reged: 03/01/09
Posts: 8
Loc: Michigan
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Quote:
63lb. PAC elephant huh?
these hunts amount to nothing more than 'gray area' poaching of elephant for profit under the guise of 'PAC', the most abused concept in zimbabwean hunting the last few years.
why do you think they're non-exportable? there is no scientifically based management practice involved in the killing of these numbers, therefore no CITIES permits.
some government minister or general has an appropriated farm or concession with no quota, or the district council of a certain CAMPFIRE area and the districts' minister want a little bigger piece of the action. and there's no shortage of white Zimbabweans, many with only indirect ties to the hunting industry, lining up for a piece either.
some so called PAC is being conducted bordering national park areas within the former 'exclusion' zones, where now there are farms (in name only) ON the park borders. Chizarira NP, Sengwa Research, Charisa Safari Area, Tsholotsho to name just a few that i've seen first hand.
there is some genuine need for PAC, but the abuses of the last few years are way beyond ethical and many border on criminal IMO.
In most instances I believe you are right but not in this case. These animals are only being taken while in farm fields damaging crops. They are not out actively searching for Elephant to shoot. I to had concern but once finding out that the Outfitter arranging the hunts is the past president of SABBA and the next incoming president of PHASA my worries about non compliant hunting went out the window.. 63lds was the largest shot last year where as most were between 30-50lbs.
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Krieghoff Classic .500 NE 3"
Krieghoff Classic .500/470 NE
Merkel SxS .470 NE Model 160A Side Lock w/ Ejectors
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rscott
.333 member
Reged: 21/03/08
Posts: 328
Loc: wyo., USA
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well unless this " past president of SABBA and the next incoming president of PHASA " is a licensed PH in Zimbabwe, then he's still 'bending' the rules to meet his personal needs. or his clients are being charged thousands extra for him to accompany them for a safari outfitted by Zimbabwean companies, which is the normal practice for the 'honest' unlicensed South African outfitters hunting in Zim.
in fairness, some clients are ok with that in the interest of expediency.
either way, the elephants are getting screwed.
Edited by rscott (16/03/09 03:52 AM)
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click
.224 member
Reged: 03/01/09
Posts: 8
Loc: Michigan
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Quote:
well unless this " past president of SABBA and the next incoming president of PHASA " is a licensed PH in Zimbabwe, then he's still 'bending' the rules to meet his personal needs. or his clients are being charged thousands extra for him to accompany them for a safari outfitted by Zimbabwean companies, which is the normal practice for the 'honest' unlicensed South African outfitters hunting in Zim.
in fairness, some clients are ok with that in the interest of expediency.
either way, the elephants are getting screwed.
You can read into it 10 ways from Sunday. If you re Read my last post he is arranging the trip not guiding it. They have partners in Zim that they have been hunting with for many years. There is no funny business here. You know, now that I think about it I'm not sure why I'm arguing with you regarding this trip. I going and am just trying offer an opportunity to other's if they want to tag along. These Elephants are raiding crops thus making them PAC. As you can see plainly in the photos below they are in CORN fields within Villages surrounded by local natives. This is why they are on PAC permits... The offer stands but it looks like they are down to only 2 tags left.
Edited by click (16/03/09 09:50 AM)
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500Nitro
.450 member
Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
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God that elephant looks pregnant in that pose !
Top photos, thanks for sharing.
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thorshammer
.300 member
Reged: 27/12/08
Posts: 150
Loc: USA
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My question is how much are you grtting for promoteing this when in fact you can get a pac hunt cheaper then that 500 a day with between 5,0000 trophy fees for the first bull and 3,500 each additional so your not throwing out any bargins and A true pac hunt takes place at night
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click
.224 member
Reged: 03/01/09
Posts: 8
Loc: Michigan
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If you had read the 1st post it plainly states that it takes place at night. These permits come "All Inclusive" so that includes 10 days of daily rates and 1 tag. Each additional tag after the 1st goes down consistently to as low as $4,500.00 after the 3rd.
Also, I am not getting anything for this. I am going on the hunt myself and the outfitter setting it up mentioned that he had 4 tags left after mine and if I knew anyone that was interested.
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Krieghoff Classic .500 NE 3"
Krieghoff Classic .500/470 NE
Merkel SxS .470 NE Model 160A Side Lock w/ Ejectors
Edited by click (16/03/09 11:00 AM)
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NitroX
.700 member
Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 40645
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...
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Quote:
Prices for 10 Days 1 Elephant $9,500.00 then each additional after that is $7,500.00 per elephant (All Inclusive)
Prices for 7 Days 1 Elephant is $8,500.00 then each additional after that is $7,500.00 per Elephant (All Inclusive)
The additional elephant to me looks very expensive. Usually additional elephant on PAC hunt can be had for a "trophy fee" only.
The elephant in the photo certainly has been shot in a shamba though.  Nice photos.
As for the weight of ivory, shooting bigger ivory can be the case. Shaun Buffee when doing his Zim PH's licence ele hunt shot I think a 73 lb elephant. And could not afford the ivory to keep. Probably the best he will shoot.
PS I left this post for the benefit of members, however if it is a commercial sales post by an agent it does require a sponsorship/advertising fee.
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John aka NitroX
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Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"
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click
.224 member
Reged: 03/01/09
Posts: 8
Loc: Michigan
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Thanks Nitro!!
The 3rd Elephant drops to $4,500.00. These prices are just what I was quoted and am paying. 73 is a good Ellie for sure especially on a PAC trip... I do know that Zim offers an Ivory Auction every couple of years for this ivory but not sure how or where to get in on it.
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Krieghoff Classic .500 NE 3"
Krieghoff Classic .500/470 NE
Merkel SxS .470 NE Model 160A Side Lock w/ Ejectors
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JPK
.375 member
Reged: 31/08/04
Posts: 734
Loc: Chevy Chase, MD
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The one elephant costs do not seem out of the ordinary to me. Taking the other poster's $500/day and $5,000 trophy fee for the first elephant and your at $8,500 for a seven day hunt and $10,000 for a ten day hunt. The prices quoted are equal and less respectively.
Second elephant does look a bit expensive, but not the third.
BTW, not all PAC hunting is night hunting. As the Rhodesian and then Zimbabwean Parks Rangers used to do, you can track them from the fields and catch them mid day to early afternoon resting in the shade. Their dung will confirm their crop raiding. For more on this read Richard Harland or Ron Thomson for example. I have done this as well for two bulls. You won't shoot 60lber non export PAC's in daylight either.
If you want to shoot the 60lber you may come upon, you will need to also have a trophy bull quota for the area, if one is available.
JPK
Edited by JPK (30/03/09 01:09 PM)
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