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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Mauser Discussion Forum
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9.3x57
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Reged: 22/04/07
Posts: 5504
Loc: United States
Re: Westley Richards 318 [Re: ozhunter]
      #119366 - 23/11/08 12:41 PM

Quote:

For fifty pounds you could get Westley Richards to send you copies of the records of that rifle.



Well worth it.

Like the Smith and Wesson letters, very interesting and worthy in their own right. Ya never know what might turn up.

I'm with Peter on this one.

For those who don't know, I am NOT an expert on Brit bolts but know a little about Mausers.

So I have some questions;

Are legit W/R's actions engraved with the maker's name in such a crude fashion? Look at the "8" in the 318. Did the engraver cough or something or did somebody slap him on the back for such a good job right in the middle of whittling the 8?

Obviously the mounts are add-on's and I question the solder finish if W/R.

I am REALLY and truly interested in this, because if it is a legit W/R then I am learning some interesting stuff. I've seen a few {not many} W/R guns and I cannot recall any with such markings.

It is a very interesting gun.

The engraving itself is a dead ringer for the decoration on an old brass tea service a retired India missionary gave my Mom many years ago. That's literally what grabbed my eye when Peter suggested Pak/Afghan. Is it possible it is a legit W/R but engraved after the fact...?

The sweep of the bolt handle {not the knob} looks like a postwar FN Mauser. The knob is not standard of course but is easy to grind to shape. I've altered a few knobs myself. In fact, it looks alot like a Browning "A-Bolt" knob and in answer to the question that configuration is if anything an improvement on the ball or teardrop IMO. Very comfortable to use.

Regardless, if it is a post-War FN action {looks like a 1950's vintage FN} no harm there as long as W/R used such. It is definitely NOT a military action as Marrakai rightly states. That I know. There should be FN markings on it if it is not W/R. Not sure what markings were on W/R actions if they purchased them as actions direct from FN. {???}

As stated, it IS a very interesting gun. If true W/R it is informative. If "tarted up" up in Madras or Islamabad in some ways even more interesting!

At any rate, thanks very much for posting. Guns of unknown providence are always of interest.

--------------------
What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?

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500Nitro
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Reged: 06/01/03
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Re: Westley Richards 318 [Re: 9.3x57]
      #119367 - 23/11/08 12:55 PM


Yes, WR ENgraved the 318 Accel like that.

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9.3x57
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Reged: 22/04/07
Posts: 5504
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Re: Westley Richards 318 [Re: 500Nitro]
      #119368 - 23/11/08 12:58 PM

Quote:


Yes, WR ENgraved the 318 Accel like that.



Thanks 500Nitro.

I've seen gun engraving done, and am interested how W/R engravers did it. It is quite a "freehand" style.

--------------------
What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?

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500Nitro
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Re: Westley Richards 318 [Re: 9.3x57]
      #119371 - 23/11/08 01:12 PM

I'm trying to find photos of my 3 or 4 318's
but for some reason I don't have them.

I'll try and answer the other questions later.

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pjaln
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Reged: 08/06/06
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Loc: massachusetts ,U.S.A.
Re: Westley Richards 318 [Re: 9.3x57]
      #119373 - 23/11/08 01:27 PM

i had a Westley that had the scope which was put on the gun from the factory 1933 lettered out from Simon Clode stating that the engraver made a mistake while numbering the scope , gun number was 42331 scope was engraved 43221 it should say something about who does some ,but not all of there engraving

btw i apologize for overlooking the thumb cut,,,yes its most likely an FN...Paul

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A10ACN
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Reged: 30/01/05
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Re: Westley Richards 318 [Re: pjaln]
      #119420 - 24/11/08 02:09 PM

Sorry, I have to disagree with several of the experts; I fully believe it is a factory W/R. I looks like a 50s/60s FN commercial action (NOT a pre-war Mauser Commercial!) that W/R (or an outsourcer- I've seen other makes done up as such) squarebridged. I've seen other W/Rs (and other Brit makes) with that sparce scroll engraving, too, especially during the post-war era. Contrary to popular belief, not all rifles to come out of London (or B'ham in this case!) were 'best' quality. The bolt knob is a bit unusual but this is a scoped rifle and W/R historically changed the bolt knob on their Mausers. I think the scope mounts are factory, if not original (afterall, they went to the trouble to squarebridge the action). The stock also has a monte carlo style to it which also suggests it was built from the ground up as a scoped rifle. As far as the engraving being crude, I think part of the story is the post-war engravers, post-war cost cutting, poor American taste (!), and it looks like it may have been recut when it was wentover sometime in its recent past.
Just my opinion.
BTW, the W/R letters (like any makers) are cool and often filled with little surprises.
A10ACN

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Huvius
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Reged: 04/11/07
Posts: 3526
Loc: Colorado
Re: Westley Richards 318 [Re: A10ACN]
      #119425 - 24/11/08 04:05 PM

I have no reason to think this isn't a WR made gun - I don't know much about the post-war English stuff.
Recently I was able to inspect a post-war Rigby bolt gun and wasn't impressed. Like all businesses, they make what they can sell.
One thing I caution new collectors on is the common verbage when it comes to identifying a Mauser as a "square bridge". This one isn't. I would call this a scope mount rather than a square bridge.
I prefer them to standard actions, and there have been some pretty good fakes out there recently. So when buying a "restored" gun, be dubious if it doesn't look exactly right.
That said, I am not sure what kind of premium a true square bridge action commands over a standard action these days.
Judging by the wear on the barrel just in front of the front scope mount, I say the bases are not original.
The engraving on the bottom metal and floorplate look to be marginally more well executed than the rest of the gun. I have seen some guns with only the floorplate engraved - perhaps this was such a gun and a past owner had the action done to match - I don't know.
The way I see it, there may be nothing at all to knock about this gun - depends entirely on the price and how it has been represented by the seller.

--------------------
He who lives in the past is doomed to enjoy it.

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Mark_Dube
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Reged: 04/01/06
Posts: 49
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Re: Westley Richards 318 [Re: Huvius]
      #120445 - 06/12/08 04:46 AM

I have received the Letter, Authentication Certificate and ledger copy from Westley Richards.

The documents verify that it was built by them, on a "Mauser 98 - FN" action, fitted with a 24" barrel with one standing plus 2 leaf express sight and a Westley Richards combination foresight. The stock had a full pistol hand and normal roll over cheekpiece. The rifle was completed for our London showroom in 1954.

There were no comments re. the rear "bridge", scope mounts nor engraving, I have sent a seperate request for information on these items.

Again, I look forward to your comments.

--------------------
Mark

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Bramble
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Reged: 29/07/06
Posts: 950
Loc: England
Re: Westley Richards 318 [Re: Mark_Dube]
      #120468 - 06/12/08 09:38 AM

Mark

Did you send Trigger photo's of the gun or just the SNo. ?

Regards

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Mark_Dube
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Reged: 04/01/06
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Loc: Ontario, Canada
Re: Westley Richards 318 [Re: Bramble]
      #120471 - 06/12/08 10:33 AM

Bramble,

I sent photos & a link to this discussion.

--------------------
Mark

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9.3x57
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Reged: 22/04/07
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Re: Westley Richards 318 [Re: Mark_Dube]
      #120476 - 06/12/08 12:59 PM

Mark, thanks for continuing to keep us posted. Very interesting thread.

--------------------
What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?

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Mark_Dube
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Reged: 04/01/06
Posts: 49
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Re: Westley Richards 318 [Re: ozhunter]
      #120519 - 07/12/08 08:05 AM

Hello again Gents, Here is a bit of an update.

I have located some ammo while I await my dies & bullets, the gun is a dream to shoot, surprisingly light recoil for a 250 grain bullet at 2400fps.

I'm currently walking with the aid of crutches (or cane on a good day) so couldn't make it down range to set targets (there is a good foot of accumulated snow on the range), I was only able to bang the gongs, but it was no problem hitting the little one (10" ?) at 100yrds consistenly with the express sights:D





--------------------
Mark

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