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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Big Bore Rifles

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controlled_feed
.300 member

Reged: 23/05/08
Posts: 227
Loc: NSW, Australia

Zero range for 458
#118482 - 07/11/08 02:33 PM

What range should a DG rifle (458 Min Mag )should be zeroed at for Cape Buffalo?

Thanks

controlled_feed

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I was born 100 years too late

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Marrakai
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Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 3591
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia

Re: Zero range for 458 [Re: controlled_feed]
#118487 - 07/11/08 04:27 PM

Right on the money at 100 yds would be perfect. The trajectory will rise less than an inch above the line of sight midway to 100 yds (less than 1/2-inch if scoped!), and drop at 150 will be only ~3 inches.

Keep it simple: just point and shoot!

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Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

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ozhunter
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Reged: 18/08/04
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Loc: Sydney, Australia

Re: Zero range for 458 [Re: Marrakai]
#118492 - 07/11/08 05:14 PM

Dead on at 50m on up to 100m and you shouldn't go wrong.

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szihn
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Reged: 24/06/07
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Loc: United States

Re: Zero range for 458 [Re: ozhunter]
#118520 - 08/11/08 03:21 AM

I used 100 yards for mine. I used only iron sights.
I could not tell any practical difference in holds from the muzzle to 150 yards with a 100 yard zero

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Tatume
.400 member

Reged: 09/06/07
Posts: 1091
Loc: Gloucester, Va USA

Re: Zero range for 458 [Re: szihn]
#118523 - 08/11/08 06:15 AM

With a scope the 500 gr Hornady RN bullet at 2100 fps sighted in one inch high at 100 yards will be about one inch high at fifty yards and one inch low at 150 yards. With the same load and iron sights the bullet will be about the same at 50 and 100 yards, and two inches low at 150 yards.

We had this discussion before, and after everyone's opinions were heard, it seemed that there was not enough difference in the various sightings to be worth arguing about.

Take care, Tom

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bigmaxx
.375 member

Reged: 13/06/07
Posts: 660
Loc: Bowling Green KY U.S.A.

Re: Zero range for 458 [Re: Tatume]
#118556 - 08/11/08 02:47 PM

I zeroed mine an inch high at 50 yards with 500 grainers.

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longfeather
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Reged: 11/11/05
Posts: 33
Loc: Pennsylvania USA

Re: Zero range for 458 [Re: bigmaxx]
#121184 - 14/12/08 11:06 PM

I did my standard sight-in with my Lott....2 inches high @ 100 yds thru the scope and spot on @ 50 yds over the irons.

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grandveneur
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Reged: 21/09/08
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Loc: France / Germany

Re: Zero range for 458 [Re: controlled_feed]
#121185 - 14/12/08 11:13 PM

Zeroed at 50m or yards is better ! Buffalo's, elefant and lion's are very dangerous animals! when you have a problem, you have it at close range !

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Tatume
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Reged: 09/06/07
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Loc: Gloucester, Va USA

Re: Zero range for 458 [Re: grandveneur]
#121187 - 15/12/08 12:10 AM

Quote:

Zeroed at 50m or yards is better ! Buffalo's, elefant and lion's are very dangerous animals! when you have a problem, you have it at close range !

Does one inch make such a big difference?

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grandveneur
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Reged: 21/09/08
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Re: Zero range for 458 [Re: Tatume]
#121199 - 15/12/08 03:02 AM

2 inches too high when you have to shoot on the nose of a buffalo, you have a big problem!

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Ripp
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Reged: 19/02/07
Posts: 16072
Loc: Montana, USA

Re: Zero range for 458 [Re: grandveneur]
#121204 - 15/12/08 03:45 AM

On a Big bore--odds are you are hunting the big nasty's...and your shots will be less than 100 yards..elephant less than 50 --probably more like 25 or less...actually in many cases, your PH probably won't let you take a shot more than 100 yards...

Personally I have mine dead on at 100 yds..and shoot it again at 50 and 25 - just to make sure I know where it is hitting at those distances...

Ripp

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ALL MEN DIE, BUT FEW MEN TRULY LIVE..

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grandveneur
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Re: Zero range for 458 [Re: Ripp]
#121271 - 15/12/08 07:18 PM

When you have a PH !!! In East and South Africa no problem. In another country's the situation is a little bit different and you dont have a "white hunter" for your security!

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JabaliHunter
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Reged: 16/05/07
Posts: 1958
Loc: England

Re: Zero range for 458 [Re: Tatume]
#121291 - 16/12/08 01:11 AM

Quote:

Does one inch make such a big difference?

1cm could be a big difference! You never know!

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Tatume
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Reged: 09/06/07
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Loc: Gloucester, Va USA

Re: Zero range for 458 [Re: JabaliHunter]
#121321 - 16/12/08 08:25 AM

With my gun sighted in plus or minus one inch from zero to over 100 yards, I have confidence I can find my mark.

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DarylS
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Reged: 10/08/05
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Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...

Re: Zero range for 458 [Re: Tatume]
#121360 - 17/12/08 12:27 AM

Whatever the sight-in range, checking the bullet impact in relation to the cross-hairs at all ranges from 10 yards to 50 yards is a good idea. Scope height can screw things up at close range as the bullet is starting 1 1/2" or more below the line of sight and with a 100 yard zero and may not be up to the crosshairs until past 50 yards - depending on rifle, scope and load.

In getting ready for dangerous game hunting, practise fast shouldering,shooting, reloading and shooting again at close range. This is a good idea - never wasted ammo. The biggest problem I've seen with big game hunters is they don't practise enough at home - if at all. Only a few are familiar with their rifles. Only the very rare one is fast at shouldering his rifle - it all comes down to familiarity. Can't find it in the scope is the most common thing I've heard. If you can see it with your eyes, it MUST be in the scope. Practise is the only thing that helps here. Shooting single shot off a bench at 100 yard paper target is not practise.

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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Ripp
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Re: Zero range for 458 [Re: DarylS]
#121363 - 17/12/08 02:01 AM

Quote:

In getting ready for dangerous game hunting, practise fast shouldering,shooting, reloading and shooting again at close range. This is a good idea - never wasted ammo. The biggest problem I've seen with big game hunters is they don't practise enough at home - if at all. Only a few are familiar with their rifles. Only the very rare one is fast at shouldering his rifle - it all comes down to familiarity. Can't find it in the scope is the most common thing I've heard. If you can see it with your eyes, it MUST be in the scope. Practise is the only thing that helps here. Shooting single shot off a bench at 100 yard paper target is not practise.

That is the same thing I hear from PH's when I am in Africa as well...don't really understand how someone can spend that much time and money and not practice for it..but, hey, each to their own..

Ripp

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ALL MEN DIE, BUT FEW MEN TRULY LIVE..

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Marrakai
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Reged: 09/01/03
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Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia

Re: Zero range for 458 [Re: Ripp]
#121398 - 17/12/08 01:47 PM

Quote:

If you can see it with your eyes, it MUST be in the scope. Practise is the only thing that helps here.

Actually, gun fit is probably the secret ingredient here, sadly often placed well down the list on a scope-sighted bolt-gun but in reality just as important as with an express-sighted double.

No fit: no hit!

Not to down-play the importance of practice though. As stated, only a fool would trust his own ability to the point of foregoing familiarity training on firearms for dangerous game.

--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

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JabaliHunter
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Reged: 16/05/07
Posts: 1958
Loc: England

Re: Zero range for 458 [Re: Tatume]
#121438 - 18/12/08 08:01 AM

As posted above, confidence and practice are key. But as Daryl pointed out if you zero for +/-1in to beyond 100 yards with a scoped rifle, you need to be aware that at close range, say muzzle to 15 yards (i.e.when the shit has really hit the fan) your bullet strike will be below the 1 inch low you expect. That WILL make a difference if you are trying to brain something large and unfriendly! I don't have an exterior ballistics program, but at .458 Win velocity with a 500gr bullet, I don't see how you can avoid this if the +/-1in holds true to 100 yds and beyond. Perhaps only with iron sights...

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Tatume
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Re: Zero range for 458 [Re: JabaliHunter]
#121447 - 18/12/08 11:14 AM

It does not matter WHERE you zero a scope, at very close range bullets will impact low. The distance between the center of the scope and the center of the bore is absolute, and adjusting the crosshairs in the scope will not change it. If you have iron sights, the same is true, only the distance between the sights and the center of the bore is less. It does not matter if you are zeroed for 25 yards or 250, at very close range you WILL shoot below the sights.

Interestingly enough, I have found this to be most important when shooting small, rabid animals. Here, a poorly placed shot will often result in a bite, and an unpleasant sequence of shots (as happened recently to my brother). At ranges of less than five feet, shooting has to be instinctive, as it is not possible to zero the sights, and there's insufficient time to use them anyway.

Take care, Tom

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JabaliHunter
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Reged: 16/05/07
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Re: Zero range for 458 [Re: Tatume]
#121512 - 19/12/08 04:35 AM

Agree - that was kind of my point. I was just trying to point out the danger of thinking that you are "+/- 1in to beyond 100yds" when shooting at very close range with a .458 in which case it clearly can´t be true with a scoped rifle.
Anyway I´ll drop it now

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AfricaHunter
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Reged: 27/12/08
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Loc: California

Re: Zero range for 458 [Re: JabaliHunter]
#122546 - 29/12/08 09:59 AM

I zero all my DG rifles at 50 yards with both iron and scope - I use the Leupold 1.5-5x illuminated circle-dot reticle, which is fantastic and quick on dark animals in forest or at first and last light. I then shoot them at both 25 and 100 yards as well. I've been surprised by two Cape Buff at 10 yards or less in heavy thorn bush. I have well over a dozen head of African DG and none were taken over 50 yards. Who shoots DG at 100 yards?? And if you do, why?

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Tatume
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Reged: 09/06/07
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Re: Zero range for 458 [Re: AfricaHunter]
#122550 - 29/12/08 10:14 AM

Not all game taken with a 458 WM is dangerous.

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86thecat
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Reged: 14/07/05
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Loc: Black Hills SD, USA

Re: Zero range for 458 [Re: Tatume]
#122574 - 29/12/08 06:38 PM

Only hunting in the US but with a 1x4 scope I sight in 1-1/2 inches high at 100 yards, with 450 gn TSX at 2300fps (CZ loaded long) I'm an inch high at 50 yards and just about spot on at 25 and 150 yards. No matter how you sight in it's a good idea to check POI up close. Also a good idea to practice with snap caps - cheap trigger time and it reinforces quickly cycling the bolt and getting back on target after firing.

Edited by 86thecat (29/12/08 06:53 PM)

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bonanza
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Reged: 17/05/04
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Re: Zero range for 458 [Re: 86thecat]
#122580 - 30/12/08 12:06 AM

500 grain projectile @ 2150 fps

Max Point blank range is 215 yds when zeroed at 182 yds.

http://www.biggameinfo.com/index.aspx?page=%2fbalcalc.ascx

--------------------

"Speak Precisely" G. Gordon Liddy.

"Life is absurd, chaotic and we must define its purpose with our actions" Abert Camus

"I''m the dude playing a dude disguised as another dude."

"Yo! Mr. White"

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AfricaHunter
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Reged: 27/12/08
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Loc: California

Re: Zero range for 458 [Re: bonanza]
#122634 - 30/12/08 02:41 PM

Tatume-
The OP question was regarding a DGR for Cape Buffalo. Yes?

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