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Yogi000
.333 member

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Posts: 265
Loc: New York, USA

4 Bore ROUND BALL
#117535 - 24/10/08 01:57 AM

I just built a 4 bore flintlock blunderbuss muzzle loader. Does anyone have any idea where I can get lead round balls in the .959" to 1.0" diameter??? I do not want a mold and have to pour these I want to buy them already made. Thank you!

BTW---This four bore is a blast to shoot. I loaded it up with twenty-five 38 calimber round balls over 100 grains of 3F black powder. WOW!

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DarylS
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Yogi000]
#117537 - 24/10/08 02:07 AM

Sounds like a good load, Yogi, but a bit soft for a 4 bore. The powder charge you note is about right for a 10 bore, although your 'shot' load is around 1,700gr. weight.

Sorry, can't help with balls. When Taylor built a 4 bore underhammer gun for a chap, we made the first mould by grinding a spade drill into a heli shape, then bored two pieces of hard maple 1/2 ball depth with it, thus making a mould. It lasted for a dozen balls for testing. 1" Aluminum plate could be bored using the same tool to make a quickie mould. Vice grips can be used clamp it together, aligning up the corners to square the holes.

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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Huvius
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: DarylS]
#117541 - 24/10/08 03:06 AM

I know you don't want to cast yourself, but this fishing mold is reasonabe.
I suspect you could cast them without the brass eyelet and trim them up.
4oz. ball should be 4 bore, right? Anybody out there try this?
http://www.srmo.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=D3185&Store_Code=srmo

--------------------
He who lives in the past is doomed to enjoy it.

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Yogi000
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Huvius]
#117550 - 24/10/08 04:55 AM

Daryl---yea, it might be LIGHT for experienced guys like you! For me it was quite a charge! Hahahaha! Knocked pretty good.

I will try to keep the projectile weight to 4 ounces or less from now on. And yes I will slowly increase the powder charge. I think I will go to 2F powder as well, that 3F is hot for that big-O 4 bore.

I found a fishing store online that has 4 OZ (1 inch Diameter) canon ball sinker weights for 52 cents each, minimum 10 pound order, so it looks like I will need to go that route. $10 for shipping. Reasonable to test.

BTW---Four ounces of #4 shot is about 600 Pellets! Quite a TURKEY LOAD! hahaha

Edited by Yogi000 (24/10/08 05:02 AM)

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Omnivorous_Bob
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Yogi000]
#117693 - 26/10/08 01:01 PM

Yogi, if the sinkers don't work out I've got about 150 1.025" and a few dozen 1.000" balls in the garage (along with about 250 other various 4-bore bullets-you can never be too prepared!). I can throw some in a flat rate postal box if it will help your efforts.

But more importantly, post some pictures! I (and I'm sure most here) would love to see what you've built along with targets, load etc. I think flintlocks are the classiest of guns.

Bob

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DarylS
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Omnivorous_Bob]
#117731 - 27/10/08 12:28 PM

Yes- pictures!

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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Yogi000
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: DarylS]
#117751 - 28/10/08 12:47 AM

I will definitely post pictures as soon as the stain and finish is complete and the blunderbuss is re-assembled. I am pretty happy with the color and need to inspect it one last time carefully, then if all is good I start the tung oil applications: About 14-18 coats so this pahse takes about a week to 10 days. Then pumice and rottenstone to get the right sheen.

Thank you for the 1.0 Round ball offer! If the sinkers do not work out I will contact you.

I pondered a good 2 months trying to decide what caliber and also searhced for gun parts to build my blunderbuss. Although it cost 50% more to build this 4 bore compared to the 11 and 10 bore blunderbuss kits available, I am really glad I went all the way to quarter pound ball thrower. I have already had a ball shooting it and hope to shoot alot of pellets and round balls out of this 4 Bore.

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DarylS
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Yogi000]
#117759 - 28/10/08 03:47 AM

Please think of the 4 bore as being maximum. I can pretty much guarantee you wouldn't like shooting a 2 bore from the shoulder. Do shoot it, but in moderation as well. Francis Selous once said he wished he'd never used the 4 bore singles on elephant. He said they destroyed his 'fine' shooting capability for the rest of his life.

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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Yogi000
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: DarylS]
#117817 - 29/10/08 03:38 AM

Daryl--- As always you provide sound gun advice. I was very concerned the gun may be too much which is why I sought advice from guys who had them and also as soon as I finished the mechanics of the gun (pre stock finishing) I assembled the gun and put some test loads in her. Since there are no Elephants or Rhinos in Upstate Nwew York and since I do not need elephant gun loads, I am keeping this gun primarily as a turkey gun AND for entertaining old men and kids alike. So that means some #4 shot loads and when I do shoot a round ball it is to make a massive hole in a dangerous game paper target. So, I will keep the powder charge at around 80 to 100 Grains. Just no reason to go higher than that. So no reason to punch my shoulders like a "320 to 350 grain 4 BORE Elephant Load" would punch. My 20 inch barreled blunderbuss is, furthermore, too light in weight to handle much above 100 grains of powder with a quarter pound of shot weight. Clearly the only direction to go is---up in powder charge and DOWN in shot weight. It makes no sense to shoot 1500 #4 pellets at a turkey!!! hahahaha. Until I chrono the actual speeds I do not know if I'd ever use this blunderbuss to shoot game with it using a solid round ball, my inclination is "no".

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DarylS
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Yogi000]
#117847 - 29/10/08 10:59 AM

Say - you might be pleasantly surprised to see what a mere 2 ounces of shot will do, pattern wise. At time's less is better than more. I have a friend who has a 6 bore double. He shoots only 1 1/2oz and 2 oz. loads in it and busts clays with monotonous repeatability.

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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Omnivorous_Bob
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: DarylS]
#117859 - 29/10/08 04:16 PM

Yogi, 220 grain of FFg give me just over 1000fps with a 1500gn 1.0" ball in my cartridge gun and is mild, so I imagine +-100 grains will be a blast. Top end is around 1400, but I always load several smokeless roundballs at 700fps when I go to the range in order to do exactly what you said, put big holes in stuff! It kicks no more than a 30-06, kids can shoot it, no one drops the gun, and everyone loves to see big holes in their targets. Fun all the way around.

Bob

--------------------
"If we're not supposed to eat animals, how come they're made out of meat?"

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Yogi000
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Omnivorous_Bob]
#117888 - 30/10/08 01:30 AM

Bob and Daryl and All---Yes, indeed!

First, 1500 #4 pellets or FOUR OUNCES is just ridiculous to go going "A" Turkey with. And I agree I would get a much better pattern with +-2 ounces.

Second, regarding 220 grains of 2F Black Powder pushing a 4 ounce one inch diameter round ball: Wow! I just can't imagine the kick in this short, light weight blunderbuss! But, once I get her back together, I intend to go back to 100 grain 2F BP load pushing 4 ounces of payload and slowly work up to see what my max comfort place is.

However, Mike Lea, the builder I bought the stock and most of the 4 bore hardware from swears that 80 grains of BP is where I want to be with SHOT.

My son is visiting at Thanksgiving. He was away for 2 years in the US Peace Corp... He and I always shot guns at targets together. He is a fantastic shot! I got him his first BB gun at TEN and his mother (whom I had divorced aleady) was livid about those BB guns. I kept that at my house. He is anxious to try the 4 Bore blunderbuss out and I am anxious to have it ready for us to share that day.... Man, I love Father and Son stuff, and for some reason when it might piss the X off, it is somehow even better!!! hahaha

I also intend to have some great "devastation making" shot load and two levels of round ball load levels figured out.

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bigdog
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Yogi000]
#117926 - 30/10/08 10:34 AM

Yogi000'
How much does you 4 bore weigh?? It sounds great, we all certainly want to see pictures as soon as possible. These big boys keep the blood flowing quickly and make the old heart beat a little faster, at least for all of us big bore nuts.

--------------------
Kyle, I love you buddy, Dad

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Yogi000
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: bigdog]
#117958 - 30/10/08 11:54 PM

bigdog---well the gun is in pieces now. All the metal parts are at home and the stock is with me at work so i can get more coats of tung oil on it faster. I will need to weight what I have here and then weigh the metal parts with my new home scale. But my guess is about 9.5 to 10.5 pounds. That Blunderbuss barrel is pretty beefy but it is ONLY 20 inches long. My 50-90 double rifle weighs about 9.5 pounds and I can tell you that the hot loads for that gun with 525 grainer Woodleigh round nosed boolits are quite formidable. I got the first coat of Tung on the stock yesterday but the humidity was up and it is still tacky so I will net get that second coat on this AM as I hoped. But I finally got the deep dark rich red colour I wanted. I am feeling like I am rounding the last corner on this build. But as they say you can't count your blunderbusses until they are 100%. Done. haha

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bigdog
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Yogi000]
#117981 - 31/10/08 04:10 AM

That is really light for a 4 bore! No wonder you want to keep the powder down to 100-130 grains. Are you saying 10.5 lbs total for the whole gun??

--------------------
Kyle, I love you buddy, Dad

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Yogi000
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: bigdog]
#117985 - 31/10/08 05:10 AM

bigdog---well I am guessing right now, since the gun is apart and in two places but yeah, about 10.5 pounds and yes I agree that is why I do not want to shoot real heavy loads in it. The thing is, it is a flintlock blunderbuss...

I will not use this to hunt elephants or rhinos, or even small dinosaurs. I will use it for Turkey. Maybe a hog, (although I think I prefer my double barrel 50-90 better for that fair). And the blunderbuss is to entertain myself and for making people laugh when I shoot it at targets or clays or at rondies. Sure, do I plan on shooting big-o round balls out of it? Yup. But I will not over do the powder charge just so I can approach elephant gun 4 bores.

And yes I am thinking 130 grains of real black powder under a 4 ounce round ball may be my limit with this Blunderbuss... But I will know soon. That I can guarantee!!! and I can't wait to get it back together and do my loading!

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bigdog
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Yogi000]
#117998 - 31/10/08 10:37 AM

Good luck, sounds like fun. Keep us posted.

--------------------
Kyle, I love you buddy, Dad

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jaz
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: bigdog]
#118007 - 31/10/08 01:32 PM

"A four ounce round ball and 130 grains of black????" Very interesting.
JAZ

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Yogi000
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: jaz]
#118035 - 31/10/08 11:57 PM

Jaz--- The recommended load for this 4 bore blunderbuss from the people I bought it from is:

100 Grains Black Powder 1 or 2F
1/8 inch thick 4 bore Wad (very tight fit)
4 Ounces of Shot (#4's or whatever is game appropriate)
Overshot Card

I can tell you that that load is devastating.

If it is #4 shot that corresponds to about 1500 Pellets!

If 38 caliber, as I used, that is about 21 Pellets! (I also loaded it up once with 4.5 ounces of 38 cals, so it was 25 Pellets. Wow! What a HOOT!)

Essentially, though, I am just replacing the recommended SHOT Weight of 4 ounces with a single round ball.

And since this IS a blunderbuss we are talking a short range gun. It is really a 50 feet or less gun. As I think I mentioned I always wanted a Blunderbuss. I know it is NOT an Elephant gun or a dangerous game gun as MUCH as it is entertainment and short range devastation. And yes it is very commanding for the purpose it is intended!

Edited by Yogi000 (01/11/08 12:04 AM)

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DarylS
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Yogi000]
#118061 - 01/11/08 03:33 AM

The shot load would be devestating on game only as long as it was producing at least 800fps at the muzzle, more would be better. Typical 410 shtoguns through to 10 bores produce 1,100fps through 1,350fps with lead shot loads. I wonder what the 4 bore was getting? Chrongraphing might be intersting- protection for the screen holders might be in order.

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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Yogi000
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: DarylS]
#118065 - 01/11/08 04:03 AM

Daryl--- Exactly. I plan to chrono the loads (both shot and round ball) BEFORE I ever thinking of using this Blunderbuss on GAME.

I am also excited about chrono-ing the 2F verses 3F Black Powder Loads to see if all that I read is TRUE or FALSE! hahahaha

I am going for 1100 FPS muzzle minimum.

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rigbymauser
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Yogi000]
#118103 - 01/11/08 10:11 PM

Quote:

Daryl--- Exactly. I plan to chrono the loads (both shot and round ball) BEFORE I ever thinking of using this Blunderbuss on GAME.

I am also excited about chrono-ing the 2F verses 3F Black Powder Loads to see if all that I read is TRUE or FALSE! hahahaha

I am going for 1100 FPS muzzle minimum.

Really no need to... IF you drop ..they will drop too..

Edited by rigbymauser (01/11/08 10:11 PM)

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Yogi000
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: rigbymauser]
#118324 - 05/11/08 03:27 AM

Well I got my quarter pound round balls in. They are a tad too large. My bore measures 1.05" and the pure lead round balls are rough cast and measure 1.05" PLUS.

Anyone have any ideas of how to shave off a little skin evenly on these pure lead round balls??

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450_366
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Yogi000]
#118336 - 05/11/08 09:14 AM

Perhaps some sandingpaper glued inside the walls of a rcbs sidewinder

But seriusly its sound as a lot of fun so some pictures would be mandatory.

--------------------
Andreas

"Yeas it kicks like a mule he said, but always remember that its much worse standing on the other end"

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DarylS
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: 450_366]
#118359 - 06/11/08 03:02 AM

The only method I can think of to reduce the lead balls would to be roll them between 2 steel plates in a single direction. This will turn them into slightly elongated balls. A minimum of 3 proper sized ball bearings will stop the plates once they've reduced the lead balls to the ball bearing's size.

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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Yogi000
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: DarylS]
#118513 - 08/11/08 01:40 AM

I have taken pictures of my FOUR BORE Blunderbuss but I must be challenged because I cannot figure out how to post them here. If someone will send me their email and if THEY could post them that would be terrific! Thanks!

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DarylS
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Yogi000]
#118547 - 08/11/08 12:08 PM

Here are the pictures of Yogi000's 4 bore Blunderbuss. Althought the muzzle looks pretty thin, it's spread. Now, it's either bores like that, meaning the true bore is thicker further back where it becomes a real 4 bore, or it's been swaged to that muzzle size and the barrel really is thin. Regardless, it is plenty strong enough for any load likely to be put through it. You'd need upwards of 450gr. of powder just to get pressures up to around 8,000PSi and that's unlikely, isn't it. The Big Bores truely are low pressure guns.
: Tks for sending me the pictures. I needed them for my file, Yogi!

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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tinker
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: DarylS]
#118549 - 08/11/08 12:49 PM

That thing is just bad and wrong.

Yogi, you need counseling!

--Tinker

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--

"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...

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Omnivorous_Bob
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: tinker]
#118638 - 10/11/08 02:34 PM

Yogi, Nice looking gun! I'd love to see how that thing patterns with 38 cal (!!!) "shot". PM me your address and I'll send some 1.025" roundballs.
Bob

--------------------
"If we're not supposed to eat animals, how come they're made out of meat?"

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Yogi000
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Omnivorous_Bob]
#119040 - 18/11/08 04:12 AM

I swear, every home needs one of these Blunderbuss!

It is a HOOT and a HALF!

Next time I get a fresh BIG pieces of cardboard I will re shoot those 38 cal round ball loads in this thing and send the pictures in here so you can see the 'pattern' at 10 and 15 yards.

I will also shoot a 4 ounce load of #8 shot from close range so you can see the massive hole created from 1600 pellets from close range.

So far I have maxed out at 160 grains of 2F Black Powder under 4 ounces of shot in this gun. I will need a pad for my shoulder to shoot a hotter load than that.

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Yogi000
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Yogi000]
#119448 - 25/11/08 05:26 AM

Bob---

The 1.0" and 1.025" round balls arrived. Thank you!!! and both fit the barrel. Now I just need to find the right patch.

I will also try to find another BIG sheet of cardboard and get a pattern shot of it with the 38 caliber round balls an post pictures of it so you can see.

My son is coming in for Thanksgiving so I am thinking Friday or Saturday we should be able to play with this 4 bore and make some holes with it after we do the obligatory family stuff on Thursday.

Thanks again for the round balls. I now can shoot some when my son gets here in a couple of days. I truly appreciate your generosity, Bob.

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DarylS
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Yogi000]
#119470 - 25/11/08 12:34 PM

An interesting and quite thought provoking target is made using a full sized ball and several 'shot'. In the 4 bore, I suggest a single 1" ball plus 3 or 4 .54 cvalibre balls. You might put in normal buck, but they are tiny in comparrison to the big one. It's best to have larger 'secondary' holes. Subbing .50 cal. balls makes them at about 175gr. per 'extra' ball. .54's run around 220gr. each.

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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Yogi000
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: DarylS]
#119505 - 26/11/08 05:13 AM

daryl--- yea I can 'steal' some round balls from my 54 cal Lyman Flintlock. I am thinking of starting with 140 grains of 2F black (since I do not have 1F Black) underneath a 1.025" round ball. Then try a buck and ball with 3 .530" added over the round ball.

I can't wait to shoot it again. With the sun setting so early it is dark by the time I get home these days so shooting is now relegated to weekends and holidays.

I do plan I seeing how much powder I can get under these 1.025" round balls and be comfortable shooting it enough to shoot a few. I am also curious to see what accuracy I can get. One thing for sure---with thise massive quarter pound round balls I will not need binoculars or spotting scope to see where I hit!!! hahahaaaaaaaaaaaa

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Omnivorous_Bob
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Yogi000]
#119542 - 26/11/08 05:19 PM

Daryl, I've got no experience at all with buck-and-ball loads so this may be a dumb question, but I wonder if there is the possibility of the smaller balls "jamming" or wedging to obstruct the larger one? I guess it might depend on the combination of sizes, or is it a non-issue?

Yogi, I'm glad to help in a small way and hope you and your son have a hoot. What better way to celebrate Thanksgiving than eating turkey and shooting a blunderbuss. Very appropriate!

Bob

--------------------
"If we're not supposed to eat animals, how come they're made out of meat?"

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Yogi000
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Omnivorous_Bob]
#119562 - 27/11/08 02:49 AM

Bob---

Yes. And thanks again for your thoughtful actions.

I learned some time ago, when I lived near Plymouth MA., the first Thanksgiving main faire was LOBSTER, not Turkey. Although at some point early on (and just how many years later early on was I do not know) but it appears Turkey did make it on the scene. I just think it is fascinating how so many facts get changed, like the ride of Paul Revere. John Daws did the ride, Paul Revere did almost nothing. Paul Revere was also a thief of art and innovations. He gets so much credit for things OTHER PEOPLE did. Just like the Turley stole the place that the LOBSTER actually had on the first Pilgrim dinner table too. But since I have a Blunderbuss and not a speargun I guess my son and I will stick with TURKEY hunting... hahaha

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DarylS
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Yogi000]
#119563 - 27/11/08 03:00 AM

Buck and Ball loaded ctgs.(paper) were used by the US military up until about 1850 for their .69's in a ratio of 3:1 or 4:1 over single ball loads. These were made up in paper ctgs., with the buck shot over the large ball.
There is no wedging problem. I've tried them in my bro's 1728 Bess as well as in the pistols mentioned (.54 rifled and .58 cal. smoothbore. They are quite 'special' at close range.
The US military used them to increase the 'hits' on the enemy, even though the buck-shot 'hits' were only wounding hits at longer ranges.

In the 1960's, multi-bullet loads were developed for the .223's (& .308's) to 'attempt' to increase the 'hits' of the then-current soldiers. These apparently weren't very successful as they seem to have 'gone by the board' - or have they?

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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Yogi000
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: DarylS]
#119566 - 27/11/08 03:36 AM

"Buck and Ball" might be more accurately conveyed if it was "Ball and Buck" since the ball goes in first and the buck on top. For dangerous game it would be the most confident load especially in low light or night time conditions. Or if you hear something go bump in the night the gun loaded with "ball and buck" would be my "go to" gun.

I like the idea of something like five 54 caliber round balls and twelve 38 caliber round balls in this blunderbuss as well.

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Yogi000
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Yogi000]
#120019 - 02/12/08 06:29 AM

I shot the 1.025 round balls in my blunderbuss this Holiday. Over 140 grains of FFg. They worked well. I did not chrono the load but it seemed like they would definitely be lethal at under 40 yards. I was wearing a watchman's cloak (heavy wool cape) when I was shooting and the first shot pushed me pretty hard, hard enough I needed to take a step back, well I was in tall grass and somehow I ended up stepping onto the cape itself, which pulled me down, rather than damaging the cape I just sort of went with it and ended up falling down backwards which made it seem the recoil literally knocked me over. It was pretty funny. The audience seemed to like it. hahaha

We also shot 4 ounces of number 8 shot over 140 grains of black powder. At about 18 yards I would say any bird in a 6 foot diameter circle would be dead. The pattern was dense out to that distance.

This 4 gauge Blunderbuss is a bucket of fun. Everyone home should have one of these!

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Yogi000
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Yogi000]
#121509 - 19/12/08 01:43 AM

Did I tell you guys---this blunderbuss only weighs 8 and 1/2 pounds! That is why a heavy dram load of Black Powder is alot of recoil. Right now I am up to 6.6 DRAMS (or 180 grains of Black) under a 1600 grain round ball. ....ah...Impressive kick.

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DarylS
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Yogi000]
#121527 - 19/12/08 09:47 AM

Yogi000 - that would have been hilarious to watch, that's for sure. Can you imagine how that #8 shot load would be on pass shooting teal over decoys? Gives 'flock' shooting a whole new meaning. I once killed 27 snipe with one shot from a 10 bore, using a spreader load with 2 oz. 8 1/2's. Your 4 bore would make that look like a .410 pattern!

You might be right - I do think I need one of those. It will sure bring some stares in 'bear' camp when I tell Ela (cook) that's what I'm going to protect her kids and her with. Perhaps a double flint blunderbus with a bit less 'trumpet? Now THAT sounds liek a fun project.

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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Yogi000
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: DarylS]
#121580 - 20/12/08 01:02 AM

Well there are some double four bores out there although a bit rich for my purse right now. I wish the barrels that Rayle makes weren't so thin at the muzzle, I found some rounded, thicker barrels but the biggest they made them to was 10 gauge.

I do intend to pattern the 4 oz of number eights and the 21 or so thirty eight caliber loads again in this blumnderbuss. It would definitely make a stout camp cook and family protection gun.

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DarylS
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Yogi000]
#121592 - 20/12/08 04:54 AM

I was thinking round ball only. Shot won't stop the grizzlies - unless they're .60" or larger. I prefer MUCH larger.

Oh well, I guess a 10 bore double would have to suffice.

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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Yogi000
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: DarylS]
#122667 - 31/12/08 07:19 AM

True about those grizzlies. If I was in Grizzly country I'd have a ball and shot in this blunderbuss for around camp but more than likely a double.

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themadhatter
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Yogi000]
#126533 - 10/02/09 02:05 PM

that thing is awesome but i would have made a bigger one

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Yogi000
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: themadhatter]
#127557 - 20/02/09 02:00 AM

2 Bore?

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DarylS
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Yogi000]
#127559 - 20/02/09 02:36 AM

Not many men can stand up to a 4 bore with normal hunting charges - and then, are likely to develop a flinch that will never leave. This happened to Selous who used single barreled 4 bore Dutch smoothbore fowlers, cut shorter, for his elephant killing. Full charge, 16 drams - figure it out, 1 dram is a 16th of an ounce - 16 drams ia full ounce.

WW Greener broke his recoil machine with a 14 dram load, 382gr. The machine registered up to 200 pounds recoil and the lighter 14 dram load was enough over that, that the machine broke. A .458 WM comes back at about 56 pounds in a 9 1/2 pound gun, while a .460 WTBY is around 85 pounds, both with factory loads.

No wonder Selous developed a flinch.

Can't imagine shooting a 2 bore (1.35") rifle or smoothbore, even with a light 300gr. load. We have a reduced bore cannon, with a 1.5" bore. We shoot patched 1.4" WW balls with 300 to as much as 800gr. of powder from it. Even the 300gr. charge gets supersonic and rolls the 600 pound gun back on it's wheels. We put 6 or 7 into a 6" circle at 100 meters with it, winning the cannon shoot at helfey Creek Rondy last August. We're just getting to know the gun and are developing good loads for it.

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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Yogi000
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: DarylS]
#127564 - 20/02/09 03:51 AM

When I get rich again I intend to get three more doubles:

a 470
a 10 bore
a 4 bore

All doubles!

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DarylS
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Yogi000]
#127578 - 20/02/09 09:20 AM

Yeah - a nice 10 bore double would be nice indeed - for all the hunting I'll ever do - no need for the other 2 - HA!

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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empirevr
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: DarylS]
#127592 - 20/02/09 05:43 PM

........Rich again Yogi? I sort of know how that feels.......sheesh.

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Yogi000
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: empirevr]
#127614 - 21/02/09 01:31 AM

Daryl---

Yes I guess the 4 bore double is mostly for OUTLANDISH fun, not so much for actual hunting unless I wanted to hunt a Rhino. I have been drooling over a Merkel 470 side by side for so many years now that I keep that on the wish list just to stop the drool.

However, yes a 10 bore double would be truly awesome, loaded way down or loaded hot and heavy and hard it could take virtually any animal on the planet.

Empire--Yes I was pretty wealthy at one time before I had it all stolen by a white collar conman who aside from being brilliant was also protected by the gov. Not the same theft of wealth that is going on now, but I can have empathy for those who have worked hard and are losing $$$ big... The only difference is I went from wealthy to an utter pauper from the cruel deception of one man. It has been 15 years and the new company I own looks like it may finally make some money. If so I have 1-3 doubles to bring into the fold.

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DarylS
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Yogi000]
#127637 - 21/02/09 07:49 AM

I hope your new company does well, Yoogi. Sometimes it's a rough row to hoe.

'Course, I don't own any double rifles. I'm not buisiness oriented, unfortunately. I've been in enforcement all my working career.

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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Yogi000
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: DarylS]
#127824 - 23/02/09 12:32 PM

Thanks Daryl...

The only double rifles I own are a "poor man's" double --- a 50-70 converted from a Merkel 12 gauge and a 12 gauge smoothie set up for slug shooting and a 20 gauge side by side that I use to shoot slugs and birdshot.

I had the 12 gauge side by side out today. Man that is a heck of a double ball thrower. I was shooting round balls with it today mostly. Had both barrels shooting well. A bit high of point of aim but that could have been me more than the loads. Still it was in the down dead zone every shot and I shot quite a bit.

But yes I hope to make some additions soon, I hope. I have been wanting that 10 gauge side by side cut short and tuned up with the right roundball/powder/wad combo to be a reliable hunting double. I don't know why I like to shoot round balls and big projectiles so much but I do.

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DarylS
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Re: 4 Bore ROUND BALL [Re: Yogi000]
#127872 - 24/02/09 04:03 AM

Yoogi- re: your last sentence, the large round balls kill game more effectively than high velocity little bullets, is why. Out to about 175 yards, small calibre bullets have no advantage over large round balls - fired from a rifle. At close range, ie: to 80, possibly 100 from a good load in a smoothbore the same applies.

Plinking at various targets gives a high appreciation of the large diameter round balls, the larger, the better. They add a boost to the pleasure of this sport.

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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