Bloodnativ
.275 member
Reged: 14/11/04
Posts: 69
Loc: South Carolina, USA
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After searching literally 1000's of posts I am still looking for an answer. What is a good weight for a 458 Win Mag? I see several Ruger #1's online at the factory weight of around 9.5 pounds. I REALLY want one of these!! Is this too light or should I consider adding weight (i.e. mercury recoil reducer in the buttstock) to bring the weight up? If so what weight should I be aiming for?
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500Nitro
.450 member
Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
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I'd find a gun that fits you first and then worry about the weight.
You can add / subtract weight if and when you need to anytime.
Better have a gun that fits and doesn't kick.
Just my HO.
But 9.5lbs - 10.5lbs is my estimate.
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tinker
.416 member
Reged: 12/03/05
Posts: 4835
Loc: Nevada
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My whitworth .458 weighs a shade over ten pounds if I recall correctly.
Handles fine and shoots great, I don't notice the recoil in the field.
--Tinker
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--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--
"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...
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Tatume
.400 member
Reged: 09/06/07
Posts: 1091
Loc: Gloucester, Va USA
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Bloodnativ,
I regularly shoot my Ruger #1 458 Win Mag. Recoil is brisk, but not uncomfortable with bullets up to 510 gr. Length of pull is more important than weight, in my opinion. As a tall fellow, I find that stocks that are too short give one the opportunity to get whacked in the face with a scope. On this gun I use irons, but on my #1 in 375 H&H I added a thicker recoil pad just to get another half nch of length.
Take care, Tom
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DarylS
.700 member
Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 27701
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
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Stock design is the most important aspect related to increasing or decreasing felt recoil.
The Ruger #1 is the perfect answer in design and weight for a heavy recoiling round for many people. They fit pefectly for many of us. A friend's #1 in .375 H&H was a much more pleasant shooting rifle than any .300 mag I've ever fired. We shot the .375 off and on all day, eventually pounding off 80 rounds, 40 each, along with the other guns we'd brought which included my .458 Alaskan pushing 400's out at 2,350fps. The .458 weighed 10 pounds with 2X Leuy scope and while recoil was brisk, it was certainly controlable. The .375 felt like a .222 on the shoudler and was my go-to when I became weary of shooting the .458.
Going to Africa? - taking a #1 in .375 would be my choice. Best all-round ctg. there is. MK10 Mauser's built in .458 with laminate stocks to 10 pounds with scope, 9 to 9 1/2 without scope would be my choice for a dedicated .458WinMag.
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Daryl
"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V
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Bloodnativ
.275 member
Reged: 14/11/04
Posts: 69
Loc: South Carolina, USA
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Thanks guys. I knew I could count on you. This will be my first REAL big bore rifle. I've shot my 12 with 3" mags without any problem. Although it's close I don't really consider it the same (I may change my mind after this but we'll see). I'm going to go with one of factory weight and see how it shoots. I've handled a #1 in this caliber and it felt great. I may add a thicker pad for more length but I'll have to see after I shoot it a bit. Thanks again guys!
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szihn
.400 member
Reged: 24/06/07
Posts: 2121
Loc: United States
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I like them to go about 10 to 10.5 pounds .
But that just my openion.
Stock fit and a wide butt pad make more difference than weight alone.
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chuck375
.333 member
Reged: 13/10/07
Posts: 445
Loc: Colorado Springs CO
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szihn, is that 10 to 10.5 lbs without scope? I'm having my CZ Safari Classic in 375 H&H rebored to 470 Capstick as we speak. It was 10.25 lbs without scope before, will probably be 9.5 to 9.75 lbs after. Just wondering if I will need to add weight ...
Thanks,
Chuck
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"There's a saying in prize fighting: Everyone's got a plan until they get hit"
Michael Douglas "The Ghost And The Darkness"
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bigmaxx
.375 member
Reged: 13/06/07
Posts: 660
Loc: Bowling Green KY U.S.A.
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I shoot a M77 in .458 lott and it is quite manageable for a big bore. Proper fit, physical condition, and shooting technique are probably more significant to handling recoil than weight in my opinion.
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One day at a time...
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szihn
.400 member
Reged: 24/06/07
Posts: 2121
Loc: United States
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I like it to be 10.5 in my hands, ready to hunt with.
My old 458 had irons only, but it I were to make one for myself for scope use I would have made it about 9.75 pounds and then put a scope on.
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Bestboss
.224 member
Reged: 21/10/08
Posts: 16
Loc: Michigan, USA
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I also have a Ruger Tropical in 458, with the heavy barrel. Not needing anything this heavy for hunting in my patch of the woods, I still wanted to experiment with the caliber. The heaviest of loads are fun, but I have digressed to heavy cast bullets for much of it's range time. The lighter 350's and the like tend to lead up too quickly.
Anyway, back to the weight issue, I will quickly agree that the fit comes first. Unfortunately, this rifle, while excellant, is not quite right for me if I were depending on it in a pinch. It is nice though, to have the weight of the heavy barrel. I guess that's a vote for the heavy side.
The one change I have strongly considered, is a reciever mounted peep sight. Too many toys - too little time!
Bestboss
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DarylS
.700 member
Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 27701
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
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Bestboss - I shoot straight WW metal without leading to 2,200fps in my .458's. I'm using mostly Lyman's Moly lube lately, but have the same results with Lyman BP Gold and SPG. This shooting includes 420gr. Lyman and RCBS bulelts as well as 505gr. Lee, 525gr. RCBS and 560gr. Lyman moulds.
All the above are capable of shooting into 1" at 100 yards - no leading.
I size and lube using an RCBS lubemaster as well as a Lyman 450 lube sizer. The secret, if it can really be called one, is to run the bullets .001" to .002" larger than the groove diameter. If they are groove diameter or smaller, they'll lead the bore. I use a polished out .459" die. It sizes my bullets to .4595".
With the heavy bullets, jacketed bullet duplication loads are simple, fun and easy to load for. I especially like the Lee 505gr. bullet with gas check. It's an especially good shooting bullet, generaly cloverleafing the first 3 when driven at 2,000fps to 2,150fps. The only negative, is I don't like Lee mounds.
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Daryl
"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V
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chuck375
.333 member
Reged: 13/10/07
Posts: 445
Loc: Colorado Springs CO
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So I will need to add weight to the 470 Capstick I'm having built? As it stands it will be about 9.5 lbs without scope, mounts and sling.
Chuck
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"There's a saying in prize fighting: Everyone's got a plan until they get hit"
Michael Douglas "The Ghost And The Darkness"
Edited by chuck375 (22/10/08 10:50 AM)
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szihn
.400 member
Reged: 24/06/07
Posts: 2121
Loc: United States
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I would not say that Chuck, unless you want to.
Different men like different guns.
I am short (only 5'6")and strong, and quite muscular. I find a 10 pound gun is not "heavy" to carry. And a bit more weight makes the big rifles more pleasant to fire. I shoot them more then I hunt with them these days, so I like a bit of weight on them.
My "deer rifles" I like to make light. My 'big rifles' I like to make heavier.
But if you feel good firing a 9.5 pound 470, leave it alone. If you think you want more weight, then have it done that way.
Don't take my word for it. It's only got to please you.
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DarylS
.700 member
Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 27701
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
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A 10 pound rifle is nothing to carry round while hunting. My brother, when hunting with his Sharps, carries 11 1/2 pounds plus ammo.
: My ZKK602 .358N mag. was 11 pounds with scope.
: Nowadays, much older, probably wiser, I carry the best rifle for NA game - and this iron sighted rifle weighs 7 1/2 pounds loaded, a 9.3x57 Husky.
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Daryl
"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V
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wyoske
.224 member
Reged: 15/10/08
Posts: 7
Loc: Wyoming
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When I build a .458 I shoot for 10 1/2 pounds. Remember, you can almost always add weight,I would rather end up light and add than try to reduce. If you use AcraGlas and shot you can pretty easily drill it out, or mill it out if you put it in the forend.
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BRS
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4seventy
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Reged: 07/05/03
Posts: 2210
Loc: Queensland Australia
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Quote:
After searching literally 1000's of posts I am still looking for an answer. What is a good weight for a 458 Win Mag? I see several Ruger #1's online at the factory weight of around 9.5 pounds. I REALLY want one of these!! Is this too light or should I consider adding weight (i.e. mercury recoil reducer in the buttstock) to bring the weight up? If so what weight should I be aiming for?
I guess it depends on how sensative to recoil you are and also if the rifle will sometimes wear a scope.
The type of country you intend to use it in would come into play as well.
Overly heavy guns are a major pain to carry long distances in extreme heat.
If you are used to hard kickers then nine and a half pounds is fine for an open sighted .458 Win Mag IMO.
A scope and sturdy mounts will add a pound or thereabouts, which will put it close to ten and a half pounds scoped.
I wouldn't want any .458 that weighed over 10 1/2 pounds for serious hunting.
If you start out any heavier than 9 1/2 pounds with irons, it will end up pretty heavy with a scope fitted.
Also if you ended up buying a bolt gun instead of a single shot, the cartridges in the magazine will top the weight up even more.
If you intend to never mount a scope on it, then ten pounds would be ok I guess and make it nice to shoot. 
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Ripp
.577 member
Reged: 19/02/07
Posts: 16072
Loc: Montana, USA
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Quote:
A 10 pound rifle is nothing to carry round while hunting. My brother, when hunting with his Sharps, carries 11 1/2 pounds plus ammo.
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Agree---one of my .416 with scope weights in around 10 1/2 lbs..and it is NO problem while hunting in Africa ---my .458 is very similar in weight as well as my .470 WR...
IMHO--as previously stated above---stock design, fit, etc are HUGE in the recoil felt...
Ripp
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ALL MEN DIE, BUT FEW MEN TRULY LIVE..
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chuck375
.333 member
Reged: 13/10/07
Posts: 445
Loc: Colorado Springs CO
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I carried my rifle (before rebore) as a 375 H&H elk hunting this fall. It weighed 11 lbs with scope and wasn't a problem. If the recoil isn't too unpleasant I'll leave it at 9.5 lbs without scope, 10.5 lbs with scope, mounts and sling ... A 458 Win Mag should kick a bit less than a 470 Capstick, by the way, Bloodnativ
Thanks guys,
Chuck
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"There's a saying in prize fighting: Everyone's got a plan until they get hit"
Michael Douglas "The Ghost And The Darkness"
Edited by chuck375 (27/10/08 11:28 AM)
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SAFARIKID
.275 member
Reged: 08/09/05
Posts: 83
Loc: Savannah,Ga. USA
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My 2 cents (though I am known for my much lighter than average Big Bores)...Unless you are really recoil shy,or will be doing mostly bench shooting and not much hunting,go lighter!If your on a bench,you can always use the Caldwell Lead Slead when sighting in...I think you are correct in assuming a 3" mag 12ga is similar to a 9-10pd 458Win and a 3 1/2" would be closer to the Lott...Above post mention stock design,this is definitly Important too! I had a 13pd 600 Double that kicked way more than my 8pd 600 Overkill! Hard to believe,but true!To much drop,as in that double,can be brutal....anyway,if you are to do alot of African Savanna's and tracking spoor for miles in the hot African sun,you will be happy that your not carrying a 11-12pd rig that gets heavier every mile!...In Alaska after Brownie,again,go light as the mountain walking/stalking is much more "fun" with the lighter of choice....Most guys go for the longer barrels,brakes(removable is better)and weighted stocks...Not necessary in a 458 Win...The Lott is a little more thump,but no problemo!....Last,the lighter bullets are lighter in felt recoil for sure! Good Luck!
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Lots of BIG Bores!
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JabaliHunter
.400 member
Reged: 16/05/07
Posts: 1958
Loc: England
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Quote:
So I will need to add weight to the 470 Capstick I'm having built? As it stands it will be about 9.5 lbs without scope, mounts and sling.
Have you thought about magna-porting the barrel? I've seen some very neat barrels with twin port slots - not pepper pot style like on some shotguns! I'm quite tempted.
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chuck375
.333 member
Reged: 13/10/07
Posts: 445
Loc: Colorado Springs CO
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I have thought about it, I'm going to see how it goes. I think if I shoot 470 NE level loads (500g at 2150 fps) it will be pretty mellow. 500g at 2400 fps will be a bit different.
Chuck
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"There's a saying in prize fighting: Everyone's got a plan until they get hit"
Michael Douglas "The Ghost And The Darkness"
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Indy
.224 member
Reged: 23/04/04
Posts: 22
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I say go light. When buffalo hunting, I carried my rifle for six days and only shot it for a few seconds. Also consider 450 grain loads in a .458. the recooil is noticeably less. Plenty for buffalo and there is a lot of evidence that 450 grain flat nose solids penetrate as well as 500 grain round nosed solids.
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ozhunter
.400 member
Reged: 18/08/04
Posts: 1692
Loc: Sydney, Australia
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If hunting rugged and thickly vegetated terrain I would prefer a 458win un scoped at around 9lbs.
Shooting 480grn bullets sounds just the ticket for Buffalo and Ele.
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Caprivi
.375 member
Reged: 30/09/08
Posts: 811
Loc: America's Serengeti, Buffalo W...
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I like a 458 to weigh about 8.5lbs. I also like them with no scope. My 2 current ones, a M98 and a M70 pusher both are 8.5lbs near even. I think the 458win is a dream at this weigh with the normal load of a 500 at 2000. The newer hot factory loads start to make it feel a bit "light". My favorite was the old A-Square 480gr load in the M70.
I had a ZKK 458 rechambered to 3" Bell cases made up as a light weight rain forest Elephant gun. At 8lbs and pushing a 500 at 2300 it was a real big handful for me.
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To live life as it is handed to me from God
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