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bakerb
.224 member


Reged: 03/09/08
Posts: 48
Loc: SW MO
Ivory handled knives???
      #114156 - 11/09/08 05:03 AM

I have a dream. Don't even know if it's legal, but seems like it would be. I would like to travel to Africa and take a trophy elephant (with a double rifle), and once I have the tusks home, have some hidden portion (maybe an inner portion that would not be readily visible while displayed) of the tusks removed, and used as a knife handle on a custom made knife. I would like the ivory left in it's raw state, that is, stained by sap from years of use knocking over trees and knocking the dirt off of the elephant's lunch.

Does anyone have a knife like that that I can drool over? I would love to have some master knifemaker create a work of art from nature's work of art. I would call it the "African King"

Bake

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Shots rang out. . . as shots are wont to do.

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ChrisPer
.300 member


Reged: 12/05/08
Posts: 235
Loc: Australia
Re: Ivory handled knives??? [Re: bakerb]
      #114171 - 11/09/08 12:37 PM

Your best bet would be to try the knifemakers forums.

I have never seen one with the stain of trees still on it, but there is no reason you couldn't make it. My own knife that is nearest to that was someone else's custom work acquired at auction in Harare, and the local SA knifemakers Perth agree the handle is giraffe bone. Another made for me by Korn Smit of Darwendale has ivory panels but I asked for warthog to ensure legality in travelling to Australia.

The whole CITES setup is pretty tight for ordinary people when considered in conjunction with travel. Unless you are related to a dictator, its unlikely new ivory will be legal for you if you travel through the different customs regimes of various countries.

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bakerb
.224 member


Reged: 03/09/08
Posts: 48
Loc: SW MO
Re: Ivory handled knives??? [Re: ChrisPer]
      #114210 - 11/09/08 11:41 PM

Thanks. This is one of those things that I would like to have made when I get home, and I realize that I could never travel with it, and probably never sell it. I just think it would be a really cool thing to have, and a great tribute to an animal. And it would be a wonderful heirloom. Kids may never want to display my old deer mounts, etc., but they may want to keep hold of a knife that I had made and used

Bake

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ChrisPer
.300 member


Reged: 12/05/08
Posts: 235
Loc: Australia
Re: Ivory handled knives??? [Re: bakerb]
      #114265 - 12/09/08 02:04 PM

I agree it would be unique. If it is legal to shoot the elephant and it is taken ethically in accord with a legitimate government's game population management plan, it should be legitimate to do what you suggest. Doesn't say what the LAW says though.

I have only read a few Zim Hunter magazines and such, never hunted myself or deliberately bought ivory though I lived there.

There are a couple of points to consider; first, how do you actually acquire the tusks. I understand they are usually not the property of the hunter, but are auctioned by the national government at intervals not to hunters' convenience. Money may be involved, and you would want a good local agent to set it up for you. Legal documentation would have to be thorough. My guess is that your PH would be best to advise you of a starting point.

Second, what are your home country's laws for importing new ivory.

Third, what are the laws for possession and sale of new ivory in your home country AND state. The knifemakers in the US will seek a legal certificate that the ivory you give or sell is old ivory, but I am unable to comment on what applies for new.

Fourth, what are the laws in the countries you transit the ivory through. Your plane may go through Joburg, Heathrow, Sydney, Auckland... or be diverted via Germany, who knows. Stuff happens in transit.

The guys here may be able to point you in hte right direction for an experienced ivory using knifemaker:
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/forumdisplay.php

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bakerb
.224 member


Reged: 03/09/08
Posts: 48
Loc: SW MO
Re: Ivory handled knives??? [Re: ChrisPer]
      #114284 - 12/09/08 11:36 PM

As far as I know, you can import legally taken ivory into the US, provided that you have the proper CITES documentation and paperwork. I'm an attorney, and I haven't perused the laws on the CITES convention, but my gut, and a little common sense tell me that becuase of CITES and the ivory ban, that I wouldn't be able to sell the knife if I had one made. So I couldn't chop up the tusks and make 100 knives and sell them. But I can legally possess tusks in my home for display as long as the elephant was taken legally and the ivory imported legally, so I don't know why I couldn't take a small portion of those tusks and have made into a knife for my own personal use. Never for sale.

Maybe they specifically address this issue, I really don't know.

Bake

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mickey
.416 member


Reged: 05/01/03
Posts: 4647
Loc: Pend Oreille Valley, Idaho
Re: Ivory handled knives??? [Re: bakerb]
      #114290 - 13/09/08 01:34 AM

You can import Sport hunted Ivory, that you have taken, into the US. Depending on the type of hunt you are on.

Cull hunts etc usually say you cannot keep the Ivory.

I have one Ivory knife handle from an Elephant I shot and have 3-4 with Cape Buffalo handles from Buffalo I have shot. Also I have a couple from a Walrus Tusk I found.

It adds a neat extra to your equipment to have something on it that you have taken.

--------------------
Lovu Zdar
Mick

A Man of Pleasure, Enterprise, Wit and Spirit Rare Books, Big Game Hunting, English Rifles, Fishing, Explosives, Chauvinism, Insensitivity, Public Drunkenness and Sloth, Champion of Lost and Unpopular Causes.

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9.3x57
.450 member


Reged: 22/04/07
Posts: 5504
Loc: United States
Re: Ivory handled knives??? [Re: mickey]
      #114293 - 13/09/08 01:58 AM

Interesting discussion.

Yes, knives made from game products or locally-important or interesting raw materials seem to attract a lot of folks.

I make knives, bolos and parangs from various materials found in our area. Handles from mountain maple and serviceberry, blades from millsaws and chainsaw bars. I've made some using elk antler also.

And yes indeed, using tools you make yourself adds a dimension of enjoyment quite similar to taking game with handloads, cast bullets and the like.

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What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?

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bakerb
.224 member


Reged: 03/09/08
Posts: 48
Loc: SW MO
Re: Ivory handled knives??? [Re: 9.3x57]
      #114297 - 13/09/08 02:47 AM

Pictures guys!!!???? Please?

I personally have a huge liking for the tools of our trade. And I'm sentimental. I'm not the type to sell or trade a weapon that I've taken game with. The weapon itself is almost a trophy to me.

I would love to have an ivory handled knife, or buffalo horn knife.

My dream is this. In my twisted mind, there are many great trophies in this world. But some that because of difficulty, scarcity, beauty or just plain majesty are maybe nearer to the top of the heap. Trophy bull elephant, Altai argali, desert bighorn, Marco Polo, well-maned lion, bongo, and lesser kudu are at the top of my list. There is just something about each one of these animals that makes me want to hunt, pursue, and take one of these animals.

I think it would be an amazing heirloom and there would be a lot of sentiment in using a knife made from ivory (from a bull I hunted and killed on his terms), and from the horn of the altai argali. I think you could take small portions from the tusk, and maybe small portion from argali horn, and have a taxidermist fill the missing space and camouflage it in. (they do it all the time with broken horns, etc.)

A knife from ivory and ram's horn would be amazing

Bake

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ozhunter
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Reged: 18/08/04
Posts: 1692
Loc: Sydney, Australia
Re: Ivory handled knives??? [Re: bakerb]
      #114310 - 13/09/08 09:49 AM

When hunting Argali, you often see horns from naturally killed animals, you could take a hacksaw blade.
The same go's for Elephant, you can often find broken bits of Ivory in areas with many Ele and few people.
I regret not asking for some of the Ivory that we found and have it made into a knife handle as a memory of that Safari.

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NitroXAdministrator
.700 member


Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39264
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...
Re: Ivory handled knives??? [Re: ozhunter]
      #114312 - 13/09/08 10:26 AM

I think if an animal is legally taken such as an elephant with ivory, being able to use the ivory should not be a problem.

I think an ivory handled knife would be nice. In reality if not taken across international borders I can't see a problem.

Removing some if possible from inside sounds like you get to get both. Don't know how one would do this though.

Ivory and especially rhino horn handles were traditional on Arab knives.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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tarawa
.333 member


Reged: 21/10/07
Posts: 420
Loc: South Florida
Re: Ivory handled knives??? [Re: NitroX]
      #114534 - 16/09/08 03:59 AM

Here is a knife that I purchased from a friend for $60.00. It seemed like a good deal. Brass hilts, Gemsbok horn/hardwood handle with mammoth ivory inlaid pommel.



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Life is for Service

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bakerb
.224 member


Reged: 03/09/08
Posts: 48
Loc: SW MO
Re: Ivory handled knives??? [Re: tarawa]
      #114535 - 16/09/08 04:10 AM

That's a nice knife Tarawa

http://www.agrussell.com/a-g-russell-gents-hunter---wooly-mammoth-bark/p/RUhhhG97MB/

Here is a link to two knives like I'm talking abouut. The top one in this picture is especially nice. I would like knives almost exactly like this. I would just have the hilt changed, so it was rounded, and not so pointy



Bake

Edited by bakerb (16/09/08 04:11 AM)

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bakerb
.224 member


Reged: 03/09/08
Posts: 48
Loc: SW MO
Re: Ivory handled knives??? [Re: bakerb]
      #114541 - 16/09/08 06:13 AM

Would also be cool to have the knife in an elephant leather sheath.

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bigmaxx
.375 member


Reged: 13/06/07
Posts: 660
Loc: Bowling Green KY U.S.A.
Re: Ivory handled knives??? [Re: bakerb]
      #114551 - 16/09/08 08:31 AM

The ivory could be obtained possibly from nutmeg sports, Mr. Jim Alaimo. Worth a try, then choose a maker. It won't be cheap.

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One day at a time...

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tarawa
.333 member


Reged: 21/10/07
Posts: 420
Loc: South Florida
Re: Ivory handled knives??? [Re: bigmaxx]
      #114553 - 16/09/08 09:14 AM

Those are nice knives. I always liked Russel knives.

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Life is for Service

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bakerb
.224 member


Reged: 03/09/08
Posts: 48
Loc: SW MO
Re: Ivory handled knives??? [Re: tarawa]
      #114605 - 16/09/08 11:54 PM

I don't want to buy the ivory though, I want to shoot it

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Shots rang out. . . as shots are wont to do.

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