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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Big Bore Rifles
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NorthernBob
.224 member


Reged: 09/12/07
Posts: 37
Loc: Northern Alberta
What .577 cartridge and rifle is this??
      #112476 - 25/08/08 11:56 AM

I'm new to the big bores and hope you experts can help. I bought a single shot hammer rifle yesterday and I'm confused as to what cartridge it takes and who made it. I didn't have much time to check it out before I bought it. The place I bought it at described it as a 600 Swiss, but I can't find any indication such a cartridge exists. I'm on the road and haven't cast the chamber, but I made a few measurements with a micrometer. The diameter of the 8 groove rifleing is about .5745" (14.59mm). The chamber to the rifleing is 1.65" ( 41.9 mm). The rim diameter is around.74" (18.76mm), and the base is .66" (16.74mm). The bore is in great shape. I think it may have a tapered bore. Does this make sense to anyone? Would it be a shortened .577 Snider?

As far as the rifle goes it has no letters, numbers, or proof marks on it. It seems to be very well made, with double set triggers, one fixed and one flip up v notch sight as well as a tang sight. The heavy 28 3/4" barrel is octagon with a hooded front sight. There is a sling attachment on the barrel and a button to attach it to on the stock. It opens with a Lefachaux under lever. The straight stock has a cheek piece and inset trap. The engraving is nicely done open scroll, with nothing unusual except for on the trigger guard. There are some musical instuments, french horn, drum, another brass instrument in a group with a couple of halberds sticking out. The surprising thing is there is a book open on top of the instruments. I had to use a 30X illuminated microscope to see it, but it is a music book with a couple of lines of musical notes engraved on each of the .11" tall by .19" pages. LOTS of case colour and blueing on it. All the metal was heavily varnished(?) and intact except on the under lever. Anyone with a guess of what country would make a rifle of this style?

I was hoping to use this to hunt game up to the size of moose, but with the short cartridge I guess it wouldn't have the power. Would lengthing the chamber to Snider or slightly longer length be a good idea? Thanks in advance for your comments.

Edited by NorthernBob (25/08/08 01:19 PM)

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NorthernBob
.224 member


Reged: 09/12/07
Posts: 37
Loc: Northern Alberta
Re: What .577 cartridge and rifle is this?? [Re: NorthernBob]
      #112482 - 25/08/08 12:48 PM

Another question I forgot in my post above. I've read a bit about people using small charges of slow burning powder in place of black to get the same velocity. Would this rifle with it's smaller capacity be a good candidate for using nitro powder to achieve those velocities without having to extend the chamber or mess with fillers or wadded up paper? I don't need or want 577 nitro express speed or recoil, just something capable of effectively taking moose out to 200 yards. Thank you for your advice.

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CptCurlAdministrator
.450 member


Reged: 01/05/04
Posts: 5284
Loc: Fincastle, Botetourt County, V...
Re: What .577 cartridge and rifle is this?? [Re: NorthernBob]
      #112576 - 26/08/08 10:40 AM

NorthernBob,

I doubt anybody can answer your questions without more precise information, especially a chamber cast.

Your rifle sounds like a nice piece. You might consider posting photographs of it for all to see.

Curl

--------------------
RoscoeStephenson.com

YOUR DOUBLE RIFLE IS YOUR BEST FRIEND.



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bpesteve
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Reged: 18/11/03
Posts: 106
Loc: Sunset side up
Re: What .577 cartridge and rifle is this?? [Re: NorthernBob]
      #113489 - 03/09/08 11:22 PM

Sounds like a rifle chambered for one of the muzzle loading conversion cartridges like the various Roberts .58s in the US, Krnka .58s in Russia and several Enfield versions. See Hoyem's "History and Development of Small Arms Ammunition" vol 2 for some pictures and descriptions. One of the more common ones in Europe was the short case Snider which would fit your description pretty well.

With the complete lack of standardization in the early cartridge days the chamber will pretty much be unique to the gun. If you are lucky you might find some sort of currently manufactured brass that you can form to fit, otherwise you can send a good chamber cast to Dave at http://rockymountaincartridge.com/ and he can turn you some to match the chamber.

These cartridges were set up to contain a typical muzzle loading military charge - 50-60 grains of black and a 450-500 grain bullet. As to altering the chamber or using smokeless, I sure would not.

Sounds like a pretty cool early cartridge rifle, probably mid to late 1860s vintage. Pictures please!

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93mouse
.375 member


Reged: 17/08/07
Posts: 745
Loc: Slovenia
Re: What .577 cartridge and rifle is this?? [Re: NorthernBob]
      #113492 - 03/09/08 11:42 PM

Could it be 14,5 x 41 R aka .58 Berdan?



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