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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Building Double Rifles & Gunsmithing

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xsheadspace
.224 member


Reged: 09/07/08
Posts: 28
Loc: Upstate NY
Re: Beretta 45/70 [Re: Birdhunter50]
      #109364 - 10/07/08 03:05 AM

Wow, that's beautiful, too! Makes me think seriously about putting a nicer piece of wood on my homebrew Merkel 45-100 to replace the factory plain jane. But the Merkel cheekpiece fits me perfectly....and all that fitting, and checkering....maybe next winter.....

--------------------
hippie redneck geezer


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xsheadspace
.224 member


Reged: 09/07/08
Posts: 28
Loc: Upstate NY
Re: Beretta 45/70 [Re: Birdhunter50]
      #109726 - 14/07/08 10:19 PM

That's a fine piece of work! A friend has a 1968 circa Beretta SXS 12 ga that looks strong enough for a DR, and he only wants $600 for it. Fired it maybe 10 times, dinged up the stock in a duck boat. But the "engraving" is really ugly.

--------------------
hippie redneck geezer


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Birdhunter50
.375 member


Reged: 03/06/07
Posts: 815
Loc: Iowa,U.S.A.
Re: Beretta 45/70 [Re: xsheadspace]
      #109727 - 14/07/08 10:53 PM

They may not be the best looking shotgun for converting but they are very strong and make good donor gun in spite of their looks. They kind of grow on you after awhile. I have used four of them to date for rifles. They are already built on a monoblock system so that makes it easier to convert them. Some of the earlier ones and some made for sale in Europe , have an articulated front trigger. That is a nice feature to have on a rifle. The euro ones also come with sling swivels, sometimes. They also have a different engraving pattern that I like much better. Bob H.

Edited by Birdhunter50 (14/07/08 11:00 PM)


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Birdhunter50
.375 member


Reged: 03/06/07
Posts: 815
Loc: Iowa,U.S.A.
Re: Beretta 45/70 [Re: xsheadspace]
      #109728 - 14/07/08 10:57 PM

xsheadspace,
How are you coming along with your 45/100 rifle? Have you gotten it regulated yet? Do the two regulating screw on the front go in at a sharp angle to the barrel? Bob H.


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xsheadspace
.224 member


Reged: 09/07/08
Posts: 28
Loc: Upstate NY
Re: Beretta 45/70 [Re: Birdhunter50]
      #109971 - 19/07/08 03:55 AM

The screws go in at a shallow angle, have points on the end, and contact the left barrel about 45 deg from center horizontal of the bore line. Unfortunately, the regulation needs the barrels tighter together at the muzzle at the max speed of my 350 gr(2250 fps) with the screws out. Trying to remove maybe another .005" from the left side of the muzzle block now. Or I can rechamber to 45-120, for more speed. The left barrel is not soldered forward of the sling attachment block. The screws move the impact about 4" per 1/4 turn, so it's pretty sensitive. Right now the left is 4" away to the left, from the right at 50 yds.

--------------------
hippie redneck geezer


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Birdhunter50
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Reged: 03/06/07
Posts: 815
Loc: Iowa,U.S.A.
Re: Beretta 45/70 [Re: xsheadspace]
      #110355 - 24/07/08 09:03 PM

xsheadspace,
That business with the set screws for adjustment is really a slick way to do it. I have contemplated doing something similar but was afraid the barrels might eventually shake apart if they weren't soldered clear down to the muzzles. Will you go ahead and solder it up tight after you get the barrels adjusted like you want them, or just leave it that way? This is the kind of innovative thinking that pushes us ahead of the oldtime gunmakers. There is no reason to have to do some of these things the old way, except "that that is the way they have always been done!"
I will admit that some of the old ways work out best in the long run, but we need to learn to seperate out the tried and true best methods from all the "traditional wisdom" B.S. that is floating around out there about doubles.
I have only done a few of them myself, but I have read up on construction methods, etc. quite extensively, and many things that get repeated as wisdom, or the Best Way, don't turn out to be true. Here's one for instance. How much have you heard about the old time gunmakers spending hours at a bench, reaming and straightening barrels by sighting down through them to be sure they were good and straight? Now, consider that most, if not all, double rifles have their barrels converging together to start with and then are slightly sprung apart or bent towards the muzzles. In other words, according to the "Oldtimers" , none of our doubles should shoot well at all because they all have bent barrels.
Some will say that that is an exception to the general rule and doesn't apply to any other guns. But that's wrong too. I can guarantee you that most double barrel shotgun barrels are bent ,also.
The companies back then did use different size frames for different weights of shotguns, but, amoung the same frame sizes, you will find both Upland game guns, Waterfowl guns, Skeet guns, And Trap guns. An Upland shotgun might have barrels that converge at 20 to 25 yards, a Skeet might converge sooner than that, a Trap gun will most likely be about like the old Waterfowl guns and converge at about 40 yards. How do you think they got them to converge at different distances using the same unaltered frames? Simply by bending the barrels slightly.
I recently read on here that a shotguns' chambers are situated at right angles to the standing breech face. Close, but not true. The chambers converge slightly together on all double shotguns that I have ever worked on. You can prove this to yourself when you get ready to bore out a monoblock. Keeping the monoblock lined up on the lathe, bore out one side, then do the other side, you will have to reset the vice to hold the other side in line because the bores converge slightly. This slight convergence was built in by the old shotgun makers and is a standing tribute to their forethought and inventiveness. The slight angled-in attitude did not hurt the shotgun shells for reloading, nor will it bother your rifle, but you may find that you have to go just a little deeper than you thought at first, to get the case heads down flush so the action will close completely. If you stop chamber reaming when the outside of the rim is first down flush, your gun won't close completely, because the inside edge of the rims are still protruding slightly, because of convergence in the monoblock. They didn't miss many "tricks" back then. As a matter of fact, I am amazed at how far advanced they were. Bob H.


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