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Anonymous
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The 700 Nitro dies a terrible death..
      #103332 - 24/04/08 02:29 AM

I have only seen about 6 or so really nice doubles chambered in this round over the years. The one that sticks in my mind was a Holland & Holland that was offered by Bill Jaqua years ago in Las Vegas. Adorned with deep chisel relief and fighting dinosaurs, cased in a burl walnut chest.. I believe Bob Peterson bought the gun.

The 700 cartridge never gained popularity, and has fell to the wind.. Here’s a nice example by J&L Wilkins that has sat, and sat, and sat with no takers. At 1000 grains,
Muzzle Velocity of 2000 ft/sec, and Energy of 8900 ft/lbs then add 17lbs 6ozs to your pack, and go figure.









Edited by CptCurl (09/07/11 06:49 AM)

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500Nitro
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Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
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Re: The 700 Nitro dies a terrible death.. [Re: ]
      #103339 - 24/04/08 04:07 AM


The Question is

What price do they have on it ?


Very nice gun.

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dnovo
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Reged: 21/02/05
Posts: 490
Loc: Chicago & SE Wisconsin
Re: The 700 Nitro dies a terrible death.. [Re: 500Nitro]
      #103346 - 24/04/08 05:03 AM

If this is one of the two at Cabela's, its been around. Duke at Gulf Breeze had the pair of 700s and a couple of the Wilkes bolts, for a while and then they ended up on consignment at Cabelas in Ft Worth. The bolt sold, but the DRs have been there for a while. I think they are currently at 60K but that's up to the consignor. Wait long enough and who knows. Dave

--------------------
Time Wounds All Heels

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Anonymous
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Re: The 700 Nitro dies a terrible death.. [Re: 500Nitro]
      #103351 - 24/04/08 06:05 AM

Quote:


The Question is

What price do they have on it ?


Very nice gun.



500,

Asking is $59,000.00 down from the original price of $69,000.00

I would think $50,000.00 might work for them by now, considering they have 2 to move..

They had (2) 416 rigby bolt guns, with single square bridge mag mauser actions, and very nice wood. They went the first 60 days on there list at $8,999.00 which is very reasonable for a bespoke London gun. Bob Harvey is the maker for J&L.

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500Nitro
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Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
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Re: The 700 Nitro dies a terrible death.. [Re: ]
      #103356 - 24/04/08 06:33 AM



That's not a bad price for a 700 Nitro and
Wilkes isn't a bad maker at all.

Your - or anyone's - thoughts on the guns ?

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Anonymous
Unregistered




Re: The 700 Nitro dies a terrible death.. [Re: 500Nitro]
      #103357 - 24/04/08 06:43 AM

Quote:



That's not a bad price for a 700 Nitro and
Wilkes isn't a bad maker at all.

Your - or anyone's - thoughts on the guns ?



I agree 100%, it looks like a very well made rifle and its regulated well at 50 meters. I guess it just comes down to if such a beast really has a niche in your battery. I know I don't need a stick that big..

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JTOMLINSON
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Reged: 16/02/05
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Re: The 700 Nitro dies a terrible death.. [Re: 500Nitro]
      #103358 - 24/04/08 06:44 AM

500

The Wilkins rifles were made in the UK in the late 1980's and 1990's as a project using that name by Chris Soysa, a lot of the work was done by Bob Harvey although Trevor Proctor of Wilmslow, Cheshire, England did some of the magazine rifles in the white and other aspects of the work were put out to the trade in Birmingham. Chris deals in double rifles as well as having a number of both doubles and magazine rifles made under the Wilkins name, he made a few in .700 but has said he will make no more, probably the for the reason why these two remain for sale after so long.

Chris continues to trade in double rifles, many of which he sources in India and Africa left over from the days of Empire, he has a US outlet for many of these doubles in California.

Wilkes relates to the unrelated and older established London firm of John Wilkes of Beak street which remained a family firm until quite recently when it ceased trading.

jonathan

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Anonymous
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Re: The 700 Nitro dies a terrible death.. [Re: JTOMLINSON]
      #103359 - 24/04/08 06:47 AM

JT,

Do you have contact info for Chris Soysa?

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JTOMLINSON
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Reged: 16/02/05
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Re: The 700 Nitro dies a terrible death.. [Re: ]
      #103362 - 24/04/08 07:11 AM

Sinner

PM sent

JT

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500Nitro
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Re: The 700 Nitro dies a terrible death.. [Re: ]
      #103363 - 24/04/08 07:11 AM


Deathby600

I can probably get you Chris's contact details if needed.

It may tale a week or 2.

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500Nitro
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Re: The 700 Nitro dies a terrible death.. [Re: 500Nitro]
      #103364 - 24/04/08 07:13 AM

Jonathon

Thanks for that update / info.

Sounds a bit like the "William Douglass" guns !!!

I didn't realise Chris was involved. He is friends with a friend of mine. I Haven't had the pleasure of meeting him yet.

Don't think I need a 700 Nitro !!!

Edited by 500Nitro (24/04/08 07:14 AM)

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bigdog
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Reged: 05/02/06
Posts: 559
Loc: Southern Illinois
Re: The 700 Nitro dies a terrible death.. [Re: 500Nitro]
      #103366 - 24/04/08 07:24 AM

I had made an offer on the one that Gulf Breeze fire arms had at $79,000 a couple of years ago for 65,000.00 and they turned me down, since then I have picked up a Searcy 700 and a couple of 4 bores. The 700's are both nice guns, but a very limited market.

--------------------
Kyle, I love you buddy, Dad

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Anonymous
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Re: The 700 Nitro dies a terrible death.. [Re: 500Nitro]
      #103367 - 24/04/08 07:30 AM

Quote:


Deathby600

I can probably get you Chris's contact details if needed.

It may tale a week or 2.



Thanks bro but JT sent them already..

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dnovo
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Reged: 21/02/05
Posts: 490
Loc: Chicago & SE Wisconsin
Re: The 700 Nitro dies a terrible death.. [Re: 500Nitro]
      #103368 - 24/04/08 07:33 AM

Quote:



That's not a bad price for a 700 Nitro and
Wilkes isn't a bad maker at all.

Your - or anyone's - thoughts on the guns ?



Sure. Why would you, or anyone else, want them? 17 lbs, 6oz is a lot to lug around, and even so, the recoil will be substantial. Shoot it at the range? Yeah, for how much per round, even if you load yourself.

Next, what are you going to do with it? Does anyone hunt a 700 or, conversely, do you need a 700 to hunt anything that exists? A 470 will do the job just fine on the most dangerous of dangerous game, a 500 NE will add an extra edge, and if you really don't feel that's enough, a 577 NE is lots lighter and the ne plus ultra of real world hunting. And you can get a new build for less or a vintage for this price, and one that will resell a whole lot more quickly.

Really need an extra hunting edge? Find a 600 and still have something more 'moveable' on resale and marginally easier to shoot.

That leaves you with a rifle that is unpleasant and expensive (squared) to shoot, worthless as a practical hunting tool and, as it turns out from the information above, a standard, albeit nicely built, boxlock with a name of a famous but now defunct maker that didn't build it and where a pair of them have been around unsold for at least a year or more.

Accordingly, I would submit that it makes no sense to pay 50 or 60K for a rifle that hasn't been sold and has been all around the circuit for a year or more. Plus when it is time to sell it, don't look for any apprecation nor a sea of ready buyers. Hell, its twin will no doubt be around.

My 2 cents and UMMV. Dave

--------------------
Time Wounds All Heels

Edited by dnovo (24/04/08 07:42 AM)

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500Nitro
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Re: The 700 Nitro dies a terrible death.. [Re: dnovo]
      #103370 - 24/04/08 07:42 AM



Good summary Dave.

I am a firm believer that if a gun doesn't sell in a reasonable period, you are better pulling it completely off the market, all adverts, web sites and putting it in a back room. Maybe even take it to the range every so often.

Then re list it 3 months later with new / different photos.

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Anonymous
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Re: The 700 Nitro dies a terrible death.. [Re: 500Nitro]
      #103373 - 24/04/08 07:50 AM

I think the 577 has the best penetration of all the biggies anyway, and at 13lbs is fairly easy to handle. Mammoths have been extinct for some time now, the designer of this round was no doubt a Teradactyl in his last life.

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500Nitro
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Re: The 700 Nitro dies a terrible death.. [Re: ]
      #103375 - 24/04/08 07:58 AM



By designer, you mean
Feldstein, Jim Bell, Russel Wilkins, Geoff McDonald.

I think Feldstein just had to have the biggest !!!

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Anonymous
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Re: The 700 Nitro dies a terrible death.. [Re: 500Nitro]
      #103376 - 24/04/08 08:00 AM

Quote:



By designer, you mean
Feldstein, Jim Bell, Russel Wilkins, Geoff McDonald.

I think Feldstein just had to have the biggest !!!



Yeah I had heard it was all about the BIGNESS.

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bigdog
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Re: The 700 Nitro dies a terrible death.. [Re: 500Nitro]
      #103377 - 24/04/08 08:06 AM

There must be some market for the big mammoth killers. Two of Ken Owens 4 bore doubles out of the 6 he made have been resold at good prices in the last 3 months. So, though the market is limited, there are people that spend $$$ on the big stuff, weather for hunting or collecting. I like both calibers, but... I am a crazy gun nut, I admit it.

--------------------
Kyle, I love you buddy, Dad

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500Nitro
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Re: The 700 Nitro dies a terrible death.. [Re: ]
      #103378 - 24/04/08 08:09 AM

Quote:

Quote:



By designer, you mean
Feldstein, Jim Bell, Russel Wilkins, Geoff McDonald.

I think Feldstein just had to have the biggest !!!



Yeah I had heard it was all about the BIGNESS.




Well the other 3 who were involved it was a
Commercial thing !!!

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starwars
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Reged: 03/04/08
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Re: The 700 Nitro dies a terrible death.. [Re: 500Nitro]
      #103399 - 24/04/08 01:22 PM

Quote:

Well the other 3 who were involved it was a
Commercial thing !!!


The motivation was based on greed and shock value- [maybe the later worked] and which can be argued either way. A worthless pursuit in my view given the excellent stopping rounds already long since proven in every corner of the globe. I like a nice 600 though or maybe a 577 is nice and sexy also- those would be my choice for a top stopping round.

--------------------
Richard

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starwars
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Re: The 700 Nitro dies a terrible death.. [Re: bigdog]
      #103400 - 24/04/08 01:30 PM

Quote:

There must be some market for the big mammoth killers. Two of Ken Owens 4 bore doubles out of the 6 he made have been resold at good prices in the last 3 months. So, though the market is limited, there are people that spend $$$ on the big stuff, weather for hunting or collecting. I like both calibers, but... I am a crazy gun nut, I admit it.


An Owen 4 bore is a desirable item I cant say the same about a 700 nitro. If you have done much dangerous game hunting many times you need to hold the gun on your target for some time- while the animals usually baulk several charges. Even with all your fluids flowing it wipes you out quick with that kind of weight. Then there's the ever so voodooish flinch! Owe the flinch is bad with guns like these- and if you develop one on this gun it carries over sometimes. I drive right bye these big boys when they come up and I think just about everyone else does to giving how long these have been out. Just my thoughts

--------------------
Richard

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BigFiveJack
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Reged: 25/12/05
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Loc: Half hour North of Tampa Bay F...
Re: The 700 Nitro dies a terrible death.. [Re: starwars]
      #103692 - 27/04/08 03:01 PM

The 2,4,8,10.12 bore rifles have HISTORY!

The 600 NE, 577NE, 500NE, etc. do as well.

The 700 NE does NOT, and NEVER will. It was

not in the game when the history was being

made. It was BF's SECOND choice! When H&H

refused to build a 600 NE for him he became

the driving force behind the 700 Nitro. If H&H

could have/ would have built the 600 NE when

BF originally asked for one none of us would

ever have seen a 700 NE.

--------------------
Cordially,
Jack

NRA Endowment Member
DRSS Member

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rigbymauser
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Re: The 700 Nitro dies a terrible death.. [Re: BigFiveJack]
      #103700 - 27/04/08 04:19 PM

I would love to have a.700 Nitro....however it would be interest as a collector. The gun is simply TOO big for me to carry around all day. My 14.5 Ibs 10 bore could be "ok" for a limited period of time a la 4-5 hours...but that is it!!!!. In the recoil department the .700 nitro must be stiff!. My 10 bore loaded with 275grain black + 900 grain bullet is about my limit. Flinching is something that no man can control, it just comes. Flinching is where the mind of the shooting really are saying "no good for me" and tries to reject the upcomming action. Its funny to read all kinds of posts on other forums where members are building so powerfull rifles, that braindamage could be the finally outcome. The is a practical limit on guns as far as 1)taking it to a foreign land with ammo 2) developing a solid shootingskill in the field, without a flich 3) carry the rifle for a day in adverse terrain etc etc.

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500Nitro
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Re: The 700 Nitro dies a terrible death.. [Re: BigFiveJack]
      #103702 - 27/04/08 04:39 PM

Quote:

If H&H could have/ would have built the 600 NE when
BF originally asked for one none of us would ever have seen a 700 NE.




100% correct.

And if by chance the three others involved (apart from BF)
had not all been together to sit around a table and draw the initial diamgrams, it may also not have come to pass.

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