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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Lee Speed Forum & Archive
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Checkman
.333 member


Reged: 15/03/08
Posts: 256
Loc: Idaho
BSA Lee Speed Pattern No. 1 in .375 2.5" Flanged
      #101647 - 05/04/08 12:53 PM

This forum has inspired me. I want an English sporting rifle and I've actually found one right here in Idaho.

I've got a line on a BSA Lee-Speed Pattern No.1. It's in very good condition both mechanically and cosmetically. And it is the No. 1 pattern with the rib running along the top of the barrel and so forth. Manufactured in the early 1900's and cordite proofed.

It's a long story, but I got put in touch with the owner through a contact I made at work. The owner is asking $1,500 (US). Now based on my research and intuition I believe that $1,500 is a good deal.It's a stretch for me, but the owner is willing to go on a payment plan. He's local and knows where I work so I could be tracked down if I tried to rip him off. I'm a local cop.

Anyway here is my question. Is it safe to shoot modern .375 Flanged through this grand old gem? I know that Kynock loads it and I can purchase it without any problem . No I would not be shooting it much. Actually I will probably only shoot it once in awhile. More often I will just pull it out of my safe to show off and clean it. Dosen't matter I like Lee-Enfields and I've been wanting a Lee Speed since 1996.That was the Year that I saw The Ghost and the Darkness. But I also want some ammo on hand becasue it wouldn't be as fun owning the rifle without the ammo. I ask because I know that ammo specs have a tendency to change over a century.Even if it isn't recommended (shooting ammo through the rifle) I'm still buying it. Just nice to know.

Edited by Checkman (05/04/08 09:44 PM)

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Marrakai
.416 member


Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 3591
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia
Re: BSA Lee Speed Pattern No. 1 in .375 2.5" Flanged [Re: Checkman]
      #101658 - 05/04/08 03:53 PM

Buy it, and shoot it! Shoot it heaps!

Modern loads for the .375 NE will be lower pressure than the original cordite loads by a fair margin I expect, especially if you ever use it in the tropics.

Today we have better bullets, better brass, better primers, and much better powders. Blaze away!

...and don't be shy about posting photos when you take delivery. Many of us here are Lee Speed addicts!


In an effort to encourage you further, here's a pic of a few Brit sporters from my gunsafe,
on display at the Royal Darwin Show last year:



Army & Navy Lee Speed (BSA No.1 Pattern)
Army & Navy Martini Enfield
BSA Lee Speed No.3 Pattern
BSA Lee Speed No.3 Pattern w/ heavy barrel
Churchill SMLE No.1 Mk.III sporter


--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

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Checkman
.333 member


Reged: 15/03/08
Posts: 256
Loc: Idaho
Re: BSA Lee Speed Pattern No. 1 in .375 2.5" Flanged [Re: Marrakai]
      #101662 - 05/04/08 04:33 PM

I'll shoot it and I will post photos of it when I get it. It was just a lucky find and a fluke as well. So the modern ammo is safe to use. Lower pressure instead of higher. I'm not real familiar with cordite ammo except that it was the predecessor to the modern smokeless ammo. It was explained to me once that it was an intermediate between blackpowder and smokeless.

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dnovo
.333 member


Reged: 21/02/05
Posts: 490
Loc: Chicago & SE Wisconsin
Re: BSA Lee Speed Pattern No. 1 in .375 2.5" Flanged [Re: Checkman]
      #101670 - 05/04/08 07:35 PM

Hey, if you don't want it, I do. Yes, I am serious.

Our friend Marrakai has a great collection, and I envy him. Lee-based sporters are an underappreciated item here in the US. I have been buying Lee variations since my first WWII era Lee Enfield was acquired for I think $10 as mail order surplus (with a genuine British Army sling and 40 rounds of surplus ammo) when I was 12. (I will avoid comments on the 'good old days' of pre-1963 surplus buying here.) Since then, the collection has gone on reaching back to the 1875 ancestor, the Vertical Breech Lee single shot trials rifle for the US Army in 45-70, the various Sharps/Lee/Remington Lee US Military and Cuban (!) bolt action versions all done here in the US and then British iterations, Military (Lee Metford, Lee Enfield, various carbine versions, then the beloved SMLE -- although the older 'Long Lee' is my preference-- to the various Lee Speed commercial variations. I doubt if I have as many as Marraki, as this looks like only a sample of his trove, but each of them is a pleasure to own and to shoot.

I have one which is chambered in the short 375 cartridge which you are considering, and it shoots quite happily on modern loads, which can and should be loaded mildly and will provide you with decent accuracy. Recoil is modest and the actions I have in this and some of the other loadings above the more traditional 303 function with modern powder without sticking, popped primers, or any other indication of overstressing the action.

By the way, you may also keep an eye out for commercial variations on the standard British Military patterns. Many well known commercial builders turned out near replicas of the then standard British military Lees for private or 'territorial' purchase. A Westley Richards built (and with their London address on the barrel) turned up a week ago through a source that sent it to me to consider. All of the markings and proofs (commercial) show a Westly built version of the CLLE Mk*1 of approximately 1900 vintage, no markings on the wrist straps (as correct for a commercial weapon) but with long range volley sights, etc and adopted with the correct WWI vintage side receiver mounting points for a telescopic sight. (No sight attached, dang it!)

The finish is commercial standard and yet another chapter in the virtually endless number of commercial Lee variants.

Sorry, up late working on a brief and got carried away with my joy at seeing more of these neat weapons. Dave

--------------------
Time Wounds All Heels

Edited by dnovo (05/04/08 07:37 PM)

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Checkman
.333 member


Reged: 15/03/08
Posts: 256
Loc: Idaho
Re: BSA Lee Speed Pattern No. 1 in .375 2.5" Flanged [Re: dnovo]
      #101675 - 05/04/08 08:30 PM

I understand.

I'm a big fan of Lee Enfields and Webley revolvers. Don't know when or where it started. Except that when I was a kid I enjoyed many a movie and novel set during the height of the English Empire or the past world wars. Zulu, The Four Feathers, Gunga Din, Sherlock Holmes, The Eagle Has Landed, The Battle of Britian, Breaker Morant, Guns of Navarone, Waterloo, Horatio Hornblower, etc.

Somehow Lee Enfields, Martini Henrys, Webleys, and more always ended up playing a role in the stories. Even the melodramatic movie Eye of the Needle had the heroine shoot the bad guy played by Donald Sutherland with a Webley Mk VI. My first Lee Enfield was a Lithgow SMLE MK III* (mfd. 1918). It's been years and I still own the Lithgow. I have absolutely no intention of letting it go.

I even own a couple "sporterized" Lee Enfields that I'm rather found of. Yes they were done in somebody's workshop or basement, but they have a charm.

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JabaliHunter
.400 member


Reged: 16/05/07
Posts: 1958
Loc: England
Re: BSA Lee Speed Pattern No. 1 in .375 2.5" Flanged [Re: Checkman]
      #101680 - 05/04/08 09:31 PM

Tear his arm off - you'll love it! If you don't I'll take it off your hands

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