Home | Ezine | Forums | Links | Contact
NitroExpress.com: Shooting Ball and buckshot through a drilling? Thoughts?

View recent messages : 24 hours | 48 hours | 7 days | 14 days | 30 days | 60 days | More Smilies


*** Enjoy NitroExpress.com? Participate and join in. ***

Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Single Shots & Combination Guns

Pages: 1
kcordell
.275 member


Reged: 06/01/08
Posts: 78
Loc: Deep South
Shooting Ball and buckshot through a drilling? Thoughts?
      #97660 - 26/02/08 04:03 AM

Hi,

I have a number of drillings and capes (all pre-war) with differnt chokes in the shotgun. I have yet to shoot anything other then typical 6 or 7 shot. What about Brenneke slugs? What is the best choke? Most of mine are modified or improved modified or full and are 16 2 1/2. I would like to use the shotguns for deer, boar and ?. I know ballistic research has the components to manufacture but I am concerned in shooting with such a tight choke.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
88MauSporter
.375 member


Reged: 06/06/07
Posts: 530
Loc: Alaska / Texas
Re: Shooting Ball and buckshot through a drilling? Thoughts? [Re: kcordell]
      #97669 - 26/02/08 07:15 AM

We had a great run on this subject a few weeks ago. Methods of Ball loads in drillings and capes and chokes. Daryl_S of BC, Canada and beleg2 of Bahia Blanca, Argentina had great info.
Using the waste cut off shot cup gas checks from fired loads in a )(O configuration to center a choked bore size ball was a great idea I am going to try. I previously used felt wads with limited success with undesized ball loads. You might search for the past thread for these posts. Very helpful.

--------------------
"A hunter should not use a rifle that will kill an animal when everthing goes right; you should use one that will do the job when everything goes wrong." 88MauSporter


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
DarylS
.700 member


Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 27000
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: Shooting Ball and buckshot through a drilling? Thoughts? [Re: 88MauSporter]
      #97679 - 26/02/08 10:15 AM

I use the base gas check cup, cut off a plastic shot wad, one down on the powder, then whatever fibre wad needed for height, then one gas cup, cup-up underneath the ball. The cup centres the ball in the bore, no matter what the choke.
: Since there is no loading data for 16 bores for ball that I know of, you have to measure the tightest bore you are going to use, and use a ball that size or a bit smaller.
: A full 40 points of choke in a .16 bore, would have a .622" hole at the muzzle. This means a .622", .620", .615" or .610" ball would work. I tend toward the heaviest ball I can use in the smaller gauges, so would order a mould from Jeff Tanner in the UK at the exact size I wanted - in the above cae, a .622". I would use WheelWeights for my alloy. At .622", the ball does not need expansion and penetration will be wonderful.
; As to loads, since the ball weighs only around 340gr. or less (down to 310gr.depending on size), this is only just over 3/4oz. so any shot load with that weight would be the place to start with loads. Use the slowest powders you can, as they will give the highest velocities. Round balls develop less breech pressure than does a load of shot, even though of equal weight, so some slight increase is allowed. You should easily be able to breech 1,400fps with a round ball. If loading your own shotshells is all new to you, only use the loads given an a shotshell manual.
: If you want more power than that, you can use black powder and as much as you can get into the case, still leaving room for 1 or 2 card wads on the powder and the plastic cup gas check wad underneath the ball. You can use either roll or folded crimp. I used a partial fold on my BP loads so they're recognizable and full crimps on my smokeless loads. A Lee hand die set for 16 bore is all that's needed. The wad guide, decapper, recapper and cromp starter are the important parts.
; BTW- shooting BP is fun. Just don't put plastic directly on black powder. The heat of the BP burning will melt plastic onto the bore - you don't wand that.
; Good luck and keep us posted on your results. As with any sort of loading, one must be open to having to juggle loads to improve results. This type of handliading is not different that working up a load for a rifle, handgun or shotgun. You cannot merely pick a load and have it be the best - it might be, or you may have to work up the load as I did - in just about every gun I ever loaded for. Different powders, different wads, even different primers. You must have a powder measure, beam or electronic.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
88MauSporter
.375 member


Reged: 06/06/07
Posts: 530
Loc: Alaska / Texas
Re: Shooting Ball and buckshot through a drilling? Thoughts? [Re: DarylS]
      #97735 - 27/02/08 09:15 AM

OK,Kcordel!
What did I tell you. There is no discounting experience. Daryl_S has done it and proved it.
I will be hunting boar with at least one of my drilling or capes this year. I will work up the Ball load for the second shot as above. Mine also are 16ga and then the rifle caliber. One is a Swedish 12.7X44R shooting 410 grain bullets (cape gun), one a very nice old German F. Newmeyer cape with all of the Germanic flair to stock, sights,horn levers and pistol grips, etc. This is a 16ga x 9.5x56R. A case I have yet to duplicate. I have a die set, but sizing down the 11.15 X60 R Mauser case has been a trial.
Another is a nice Kettner German drilling in 16X16x 9.3x72R (normalized). It will be a chore just to pick the one I want to bring!!
I am working on my "photobucket" account so I can post some photos.

--------------------
"A hunter should not use a rifle that will kill an animal when everthing goes right; you should use one that will do the job when everything goes wrong." 88MauSporter


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
DarylS
.700 member


Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 27000
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: Shooting Ball and buckshot through a drilling? Thoughts? [Re: 88MauSporter]
      #97744 - 27/02/08 01:10 PM

88Mau - you are too kind. I have plaed with them and tend to overdue things when I get interested in something.
; The most important aspect or ingredient in these loads, is the cupped gas check off a plastic wad, be it a steel shot wad, or lead shot wad - doesn't matter. With smokeless loads, you can also put a gas check off a wad, cup-down on the powder.The important part or aspect is to put the gas check in the case above the base wad with the cup facing up so inertia will hold the ball in the cup upon it's trip up the bore, thus holding it in the middle. Size really doesn't matter, but bigger is always better - in projetiles.
; Some of the fellows I know have used very much uindersized balls that would fit inside plastic wads. They used these in muzzleloading shotguns without chokes. Beware, if you use something like this in a choked gun, you should be able to push the upper part of the wad, with ball, through the choke or inset it into the muzzle, plastic and all or it might be too tight and damage the choke. It is best to use the proper sized ball and the gas checks. More power and better accuracy.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
mickey
.416 member


Reged: 05/01/03
Posts: 4647
Loc: Pend Oreille Valley, Idaho
Re: Shooting Ball and buckshot through a drilling? Thoughts? [Re: DarylS]
      #97763 - 27/02/08 03:40 PM

Daryl

Have you encountered any problems with plastic cups and old barrels?

--------------------
Lovu Zdar
Mick

A Man of Pleasure, Enterprise, Wit and Spirit Rare Books, Big Game Hunting, English Rifles, Fishing, Explosives, Chauvinism, Insensitivity, Public Drunkenness and Sloth, Champion of Lost and Unpopular Causes.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
DarylS
.700 member


Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 27000
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: Shooting Ball and buckshot through a drilling? Thoughts? [Re: mickey]
      #97797 - 28/02/08 02:33 AM

My double was made of "fluid Steel" - back around the turn of the 19th century. No problems in it. Any gun that is really rough, ie: pitted badly or deeply, might slough off plastic from abrasion, but then, it will slough off everything else as well. Deeply pitted barrels or barrels with wide pits should be shown a great deal of caution, especially when damascus - the holes can tend to go through almost to the surface.
: I would use only smooth bores. I can fore-see no reason for problems with relatively smooth bores of any age. I know the boys used to shoot plastic wads in their black powder shotguns, until they had to get the plastic out. From then on, it was a couple hard over-powder card wads down first - then plastic.
; One old .74 cal. single barrel gun I patterned put out almost improved modified patterns with 2-1/8"cards, pink steall shot plastic wad, 1-1/8oz. #6's, thin "BB" wad loaded with 3 drams 2F. The shot loads were used for the 'trap' event on a trail-walk at Hefley Creek Rondy. All the rest of the shots on the trail were with round ball - I won 2nd or 3rd place on that trail walk. That Gun, an H. Wahl, was made in Birmingham, I think, around 1860. The plastic didn't hurt the bore at all, nor even foul the pits. I had polished the bore as well as possible with a tight cloth on a mandrel, in the electric drill- turned full speed, and with chrome polish on the cloth. It helped smooth the entrance and exits to the pits, I assume.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
88MauSporter
.375 member


Reged: 06/06/07
Posts: 530
Loc: Alaska / Texas
Re: Shooting Ball and buckshot through a drilling? Thoughts? [Re: DarylS]
      #97798 - 28/02/08 02:56 AM

Great Info. I will let you know how mine work out.

--------------------
"A hunter should not use a rifle that will kill an animal when everthing goes right; you should use one that will do the job when everything goes wrong." 88MauSporter


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
DarylS
.700 member


Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 27000
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: Shooting Ball and buckshot through a drilling? Thoughts? [Re: 88MauSporter]
      #97810 - 28/02/08 06:10 AM

Gil Sengel came out with an article on a Martini he'd put a heavy 12 bore barrel on and developed round balls for.
; This came out some years after I'd done my 'work' on the subject. He ended up using the gas checks off the bottom of wads as well, and as well, his results were similar - wonderful accuracy from a smothbore. This would have been a handloader magazine. One of the forum members here, copied the article and sent it to me- I enjoyed reading it very much - almost like going through my own notes. It now resides with my notes on loading balls in the 12 bore.
: I ended up with around 10" groups fired offhand at 100 meters. I could just stay on a 12" steel plate hung at that range, so that's the goal to beat. Due to the recoil with black powder loads to 7 drams, I didn't shoot off the bench when testing loads, but used a standing rest position to help absorb recoil. Smokeless loads didn't kick much at all, in comparrison to black - maybe 1/3 the felt recoil.
: 27.3gr. per dram.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Pages: 1



Extra information
0 registered and 156 anonymous users are browsing this forum.

Moderator:  Huvius 

Print Topic

Forum Permissions
      You cannot start new topics
      You cannot reply to topics
      HTML is disabled
      UBBCode is enabled

Rating: *****
Topic views: 3494

Rate this topic

Jump to

Contact Us NitroExpress.com

Powered by UBB.threads™ 6.5.5


Home | Ezine | Forums | Links | Contact


Copyright 2003 to 2011 - all rights reserved