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500grains
.416 member


Reged: 16/02/04
Posts: 4732
Loc: Salt Lake City, Utah USA
Saw a Heym PH model today
      #68291 - 29/12/06 03:21 PM

I saw a Heym PH double in 470 NE today. It was shipped into Utah for a customer and I happened to be on hand to take a look. The workmanship was very good. The rifle is slender, like the other Heyms I have seen, and the metal work was all smooth and well done. Wood to metal fit is good, but Heym leaves the Wood a bit high above the metal. I wonder if that might lead to the wood chipping in the future. The rifle did not appear to have bushed strikers, however. Overall at $14K I think it is a desirable piece.

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mickey
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Reged: 05/01/03
Posts: 4647
Loc: Pend Oreille Valley, Idaho
Re: Saw a Heym PH model today [Re: 500grains]
      #68292 - 29/12/06 03:52 PM

Leaving the wood proud was a good idea 100 years ago when rifles were used regularly and routinely redone. It allowed a couple of stock refinishes.

Now, not enough DG rifles are used enough to need this. I think a nice smooth wood metal fit is desirable nowadays.

What is the cost compared to the others?

--------------------
Lovu Zdar
Mick

A Man of Pleasure, Enterprise, Wit and Spirit Rare Books, Big Game Hunting, English Rifles, Fishing, Explosives, Chauvinism, Insensitivity, Public Drunkenness and Sloth, Champion of Lost and Unpopular Causes.

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new_guy
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Reged: 10/08/04
Posts: 581
Loc: Texas
Re: Saw a Heym PH model today [Re: mickey]
      #68294 - 29/12/06 04:54 PM

Dan - I'm glad you got a chance to get by Aleko's and see the rifle first-hand. Yes, you're right, the wood is a little proud, but if a customer wants it flush (for whatever reason) that can be accommodated too... Just have to specify what they want.

--------------------
www.heymUSA.com

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bulldog563
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Reged: 21/10/05
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Re: Saw a Heym PH model today [Re: new_guy]
      #68307 - 29/12/06 10:35 PM

Is there a reason the wood is done this way? I always assumed it was to reduce costs.

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new_guy
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Re: Saw a Heym PH model today [Re: bulldog563]
      #68317 - 30/12/06 02:45 AM

On a mass-produced gun, yes, I'm sure the wood is left proud to save some time/money.

But on a hand-made gun it's left a little high to allow for a few refinishes on the wood. (Obviously some wood is sanded away in the refinish process and you’ll have less when you’re done than when you started.)

The photo below is of a stock maker at HEYM finishing up the edges of the wood. You can see that the wood is a little proud, but you can also see that with just a few more minutes of work how it could be flush with the metal.

Planned refinish in the future or not, I tend to err on the side of caution... you never know what might accidentally happen to the stock, drop it, bump it etc... and you might want to have the stock refinished without the whole stock really needing it.

As I'm fond of saying:
It's just a little wood: real easy to take off... but harder than hell to put back on.



--------------------
www.heymUSA.com

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EricD
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Reged: 27/02/04
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Re: Saw a Heym PH model today [Re: new_guy]
      #68327 - 30/12/06 04:25 AM

Quote:



Planned refinish in the future or not, I tend to err on the side of caution... you never know what might accidentally happen to the stock, drop it, bump it etc... and you might want to have the stock refinished without the whole stock really needing it.

As I'm fond of saying:
It's just a little wood: real easy to take off... but harder than hell to put back on.





A wise choice in my opinion. Especially for a working gun that will eventually get dinged and scratched. It's good to see that Heym lets the customer make some personal choices, in order to get the gun like they want, unlike some of the other makers in/near that price range that don't offer such options.

Erik

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Marrakai
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Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 3595
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia
Re: Saw a Heym PH model today [Re: EricD]
      #68349 - 30/12/06 11:25 AM

Funny how the best London and Birmingham makers never 'erred on the side of caution' a century ago. They made them 'correct', first time. Stuffed if I could live with ill-fitted wood at that price, just in case of a possible future accident (Huh?).

...though I notice from full-page ads in DGJ, SS, etc that poor wood-to-metal fit is becoming common-place even on high-priced British guns (though 'British' is only a half-truth when describing today's hybrid Italian/Spanish/English commercial products).

No offence, new guy, but if finishing 'proud' can be done with the stock in place (as illustrated in your post), whereas perfect wood-to-metal fit requires repeated removal and refitting of the stock, and properly-cured wood in the first place!, then cost (as per the stocker's time-sheet and climate-control in the curing room) is probably the driving factor.

BTW, stock refinishing in the traditional sense did not require the removal of any wood, just the old finish. Sure, it took time and infinite care, which is admittedly hard to find at any price today.

IMHO proud stock-wood is purely an economic decision, and shouldn't be tolerated on a high-grade gun.

--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

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new_guy
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Reged: 10/08/04
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Loc: Texas
Re: Saw a Heym PH model today [Re: Marrakai]
      #68355 - 30/12/06 11:59 AM

Marrakai - What does a current "British Best" gun cost these days?

The least expensive boxlock I know of starts at 20K Pounds or about $40K US. Even that gun is not from a "Best" maker.

So where exactly do we "start" and "stop" in comparing a $15K gun to a $40K gun? Or if it has to be from a "Best" maker, I think it's fair to raise the latter number to about $80K. You and I both know that they are apples and oranges.

Regardless, I'll make you this promise: when I receive your check and order, I'll make sure your gun is delivered with flush wood. Guaranteed... at no extra cost.

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Dave_Hall
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Reged: 09/12/06
Posts: 185
Loc: PA. ,U.S.A.
Re: Saw a Heym PH model today [Re: new_guy]
      #68361 - 30/12/06 01:36 PM

new_guy, I would love to have a 88-B PH in 450 NE.I love the plain look it makes it look more solid.It might just be me,but I don't like a lot of engraving.When I get my Caddy payed off I want a double.Maybe I'll get lucky and find one of your Heyms used.Dave

--------------------
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2011 Ruger SP-101 4.2" 357 MAG.

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Marrakai
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Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 3595
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia
Re: Saw a Heym PH model today [Re: new_guy]
      #68377 - 30/12/06 05:57 PM

new guy:
Apples and oranges indeed, though part of my point is that the oranges are becoming more apple-like as today's economic constraints erode the British gun trade.

I suspected you might burr-up at my post, so again, apologies. ...although your post is a pretty clear admission that leaving the wood proud is a commercial decision. And while I agree that the Heym is probably the best newly-manufactured double on the market today for the price, I know I would always be happier with a vintage British double for the same money, no matter how many faults it may have accumulated over the intervening decades, so please don't hold your breath waiting for my cheque!

I do appreciate the offer, though. If I was in the market for a new double, we would definitely be talking.

--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

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Safarischorsch
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Reged: 28/02/04
Posts: 98
Re: Saw a Heym PH model today [Re: Dave_Hall]
      #68397 - 31/12/06 07:27 AM

I have a Heym Classic Safari in .450 N.E. 3 1/4...

Fantastic rifle... so i will not sell it...

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bonanza
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Reged: 17/05/04
Posts: 2335
Loc: South Carolina
Re: Saw a Heym PH model today [Re: Safarischorsch]
      #68409 - 31/12/06 12:40 PM

New old guy,

Try anywhere from $120,000 to $180,000 for a new bespoke H&H or Purdey.

--------------------


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new_guy
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Posts: 581
Loc: Texas
Re: Saw a Heym PH model today [Re: bonanza]
      #68417 - 31/12/06 02:04 PM

bonanza - You're correct for sidelocks (and then some), but I was pricing boxlocks in the 40-80 range.

--------------------
www.heymUSA.com

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500grains
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Reged: 16/02/04
Posts: 4732
Loc: Salt Lake City, Utah USA
Re: Saw a Heym PH model today [Re: new_guy]
      #68444 - 01/01/07 06:20 AM

If I were looking for a double rifle for less than 20K, a Heym would definitely be one of the top contenders.

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