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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Double Rifles
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pwm
.300 member


Reged: 15/06/04
Posts: 216
Loc: Banana Republik of Germany
Holland&Holland, price allwrigth?
      #61125 - 14/08/06 01:39 AM

see this double
http://www.egun.de/market/item.php?id=925377

is the price ok or wishfull thinking

its a long way from such a krieghoff here, if you only want a gun for shoting

http://www.egun.de/market/item.php?id=993311

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rigbymauser
.400 member


Reged: 15/05/05
Posts: 1972
Loc: Denmark
Re: Holland&Holland, price allwrigth? [Re: pwm]
      #61128 - 14/08/06 01:50 AM

..naa.......the price is wayout..not just for my wallet, but the
internationally also..!
That Holland & Holland should bring about 50.000 Euro$ as MAX....not a dime more..!!
The krieghoff is ofcouse cheaper, and will always be..

One cannot compare a newly manufactured massproduction rifle with a british handmade best quality gun from the past century....its two different things, like apples and oranges.!!

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577Robert
.224 member


Reged: 10/02/05
Posts: 30
Loc: Germany, NRW
Re: Holland&Holland, price allwrigth? [Re: pwm]
      #61148 - 14/08/06 04:45 PM

PWM
as rigbymauser stated, you could not compare a Krieghoff double with a Holland & Holland double!
One the other hand the price for the 500 on ebay seems way to high, I thought that also when I have seen that gun weeks ago.
During a visit to Hartmann & Weiss, a couple of monthes ago, I had the opportunity to see and handle the .600 NE H&H double, which at one time belong to his Royal Highness Maharaja of REWA. Build in the 1920's in only, if I recall it correctly, 12 weeks during a visit to the british King the rifle is equiped with a foldable, diamond moon front sight. Fully cased this gun costed originaly 120 pounds ( there is a rumor that his Royal Highness has forgotten to pay the bill, and the britsh King has overtaken it quietly!!! )
Beside all the story, the requested price for this 600 Nitro which was on sale, was 110.000 Euro. I would rather buy this than a .500 with unknown history for 150.000 Euro

Robert

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500Nitro
.450 member


Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: Holland&Holland, price allwrigth? [Re: 577Robert]
      #61156 - 14/08/06 10:55 PM

577Robert

The price for the 600 H&H seems OK

What was it like ?
Good condition ?
Do you know what era it was made and
what was the "build quality" like ?

Just interested

500 Nitro

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pwm
.300 member


Reged: 15/06/04
Posts: 216
Loc: Banana Republik of Germany
Re: Holland&Holland, price allwrigth? [Re: 500Nitro]
      #61163 - 15/08/06 01:20 AM

I never compare this two guns from the point of collector's value, from technical view point both are shoting iron's.
Was only curious if the H&H price have to be realistic anyway.
In my opinion it seems that 50000 euro is a price you can sell such a gun. When it had have any historical value, the seller would't forget it to say it in the descripton. So I have to assume i t havn't a famous history collectors are willing to pay for.

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577Robert
.224 member


Reged: 10/02/05
Posts: 30
Loc: Germany, NRW
Re: Holland&Holland, price allwrigth? [Re: 500Nitro]
      #61190 - 15/08/06 04:58 PM

500Nitro
The condition was superb. Give me two days time to look at my notes and I can give you more details. I am currently traveling and have therefor no access to this data. I can also provide some pictures of the gun if somebody is so kind posting them here on this side. They are old traditional color papercopies, but I can scan them in for sharing.

Robert

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500Nitro
.450 member


Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: Holland&Holland, price allwrigth? [Re: 577Robert]
      #61191 - 15/08/06 05:11 PM


577Robert,

Thanks - yes I would love to hear more info + pics
except I can't post them for you ut I am sure
someone will.

With so few H&H 600's made, it's nioce to see what's
out there.

Thanks again

500 Nitro

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clark7781
.375 member


Reged: 28/10/04
Posts: 612
Loc: Fairfax County, Virginia, USA
Re: Holland&Holland, price allwrigth? [Re: 500Nitro]
      #61208 - 16/08/06 01:19 AM

577Roberts:

I can post them for you. Send me the photo files at hawk_paul@bah.com and I'll get them up.

--------------------
Clark

Double Rifle Shooters Society
.500 NE and .577 NE

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mehulkamdar
.416 member


Reged: 09/01/04
Posts: 3688
Loc: State of Ill-Annoy USA.
Re: Holland&Holland, price allwrigth? [Re: 500Nitro]
      #61257 - 16/08/06 01:05 PM

Gentlemen,

Robert has some fantastic rifles and he has been very kind in sending me pictures of some of his treasures in the past. Suffice it to say that I doubt that anyone on ANY forum has commissioned as many new double and other fine rifles as he has. If I have his permission, I would gladly post some of the pictures that he has sent me. And whatever else he has now is certain to be spectacular. You can't expect anything less than perfection from someone who is a Marilyn Monroe enthusiast.

Cheers,





--------------------
The Ark was made by amateurs. Experts built the Titanic.

Mehul Kamdar

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577Robert
.224 member


Reged: 10/02/05
Posts: 30
Loc: Germany, NRW
Re: Holland&Holland, price allwrigth? [Re: mehulkamdar]
      #61269 - 16/08/06 07:18 PM

Hello Mehul -
thank you for the nice words. I think you are overdoing it a little bit , but I have to confess that my love goes into two directions - blond women and nice guns!
You do not need to ask for my permission to post everything I have send you in the past - I am happy to share and the permission is given. If I have your permission, I will send you more pictures in the future to share it in this forum. Currently I am most exited waiting for a Ziegenhahn & Sohn side by side, sidelock, chopperlumb double, to be finished hopefully before the end of this year. Being of meduim caliber ( .450No.2 ) it should fit between the small and big one which where build for me in the last few years by the same company.
As having said earlier, I will look into my files for the history and the pictures of the above mentioned .600Nitro and post the result in a timely manner.
Robert

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577Robert
.224 member


Reged: 10/02/05
Posts: 30
Loc: Germany, NRW
Re: Holland&Holland, price allwrigth? [Re: 500Nitro]
      #61388 - 18/08/06 10:19 PM

I went through my data and found the file. During the summerperiod of 1921, Gulab Singh the Maharaja of Rewa followed an invitation of the britsh Royals. In this time he ordered a .600 Nitro "Royal" H&H. After the first world war, orders for expensive guns where not so common, so the Maharaja was able to get the commitment for a very aggressive timing plan from H&H. The action was forget at P.Webley & Son in Birmingham and the rifle was build and completed in only 10 weeks! Try to do this today. The barrel carries the following: "H.H Maharaja Gulab Singh Ji Bahadur of Rewa 1921" inlaid in gold. As written in my previous post the night sight carries a big blue river diamont. The double weight 15,96 pounds the barrel lenght is 26". As mentioned ealier the invoice of 120 pounds was quitly overtaken from the Britsh KIng. As far as I know it is one of only six which where build by H&H before they finished they official "last one" in 1975.

The pictures will follow asap

Robert

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Double_Trouble
.375 member


Reged: 27/04/06
Posts: 577
Loc: Canada
Re: Holland&Holland, price allwrigth? [Re: 577Robert]
      #61390 - 18/08/06 10:46 PM

577: that sounds like one hell of a rifle and would love to see the photos of it !
Manufactured and delivered in 10 weeks from time of order......amazing!

you couldn't even get the engraving and gold inlay of the name on the rifle in 10 weeks in this day and age.

--------------------
Double Trouble,
Speak not of what you do not know.
Listen up when it's time to.

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500grains
.416 member


Reged: 16/02/04
Posts: 4732
Loc: Salt Lake City, Utah USA
Re: Holland&Holland, price allwrigth? [Re: Double_Trouble]
      #61392 - 18/08/06 11:42 PM

If it was delivered in 10 weeks, that means it was already built and they only had to put varnish on the stock.

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Double_Trouble
.375 member


Reged: 27/04/06
Posts: 577
Loc: Canada
Re: Holland&Holland, price allwrigth? [Re: 500grains]
      #61395 - 19/08/06 12:14 AM

lol thats funny stuff 500!
but i think we all know that it was a clear cut case of Rank Having ( and excercising) Its Priviledge

--------------------
Double Trouble,
Speak not of what you do not know.
Listen up when it's time to.

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400NitroExpress
.400 member


Reged: 26/11/03
Posts: 1154
Loc: Lone Star State
Re: Holland&Holland, price allwrigth? [Re: Double_Trouble]
      #61401 - 19/08/06 01:23 AM

500 Grains is correct. It's a nice story but it's fantasy. Bench time to build a "Royal" or "Modele Deluxe" double rifle was 1200 to 1400 hours or more in those days. This rifle was substantially complete when the order came in. There were quite a few substantially complete projects laying around in the British trade in 1921 - orders placed in 1914 - 1915 by gentlemen killed in WWI (750,000 British were killed in action). Keep in mind that not all of Holland's best double rifles were built by Holland.

This story is akin to that of the pair of Churchill "bests" ordered by the Prince of Wales in 1931. They were delivered in something like 2 or 3 weeks. They were needed quickly as HRH was departing on a trip to South America. By that time, Churchill was having most of it's guns built for them by a variety of makers in Birmingham. Those guns were sitting in a rack in Birmingham, complete except for final stock dimensions.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

--------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

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