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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Building Double Rifles & Gunsmithing
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Morten
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Reged: 24/04/04
Posts: 89
Loc: Ås, Norway
Re' Rifling a Double rifle??
      #58777 - 14/06/06 03:37 AM

Hi.
I am considering bying a fine (woodward) english DBR. from 1905. This har been been rebarreld with a boelher steel barrels in 308 Win. This is for me a bit strange cal to have in a rilfe like this, so I am thinking of re rifling it to another chartridge, like 9'3-74R or even 375 Flanged H&H. But when I talked to a gunmaker to day he adwise me not to do this because the action might could crack from the higher presure. Does anyone here have experience with rifling up Double rifles barrels??
It was originaly chamberd in 303

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400NitroExpress
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Reged: 26/11/03
Posts: 1154
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Re: Re' Rifling a Double rifle?? [Re: Morten]
      #58778 - 14/06/06 04:04 AM

Hard to say. I would think that if the concern about cracking the action bar were valid, then it shouldn't have been rebarreled to .308 Win to begin with.

I would be more concerned about having adequate barrel wall thickness after reboring to 9.3. I've seen several early .303 doubles that had been rebored, rechambered, and reproved to 9.3X74R in England. I wouldn't have thought that an original .303 double would have enough meat in the barrels to go to 9.3, but these apparently did.
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"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

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CptCurlAdministrator
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Reged: 01/05/04
Posts: 5284
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Re: Re' Rifling a Double rifle?? [Re: Morten]
      #58779 - 14/06/06 04:22 AM

There would be a problem in the chamber area if trying to go from .308 Win. to 9.3x74R. The diameter of the .308 case out toward the shoulder exceeds the diameter of the 9.3 case. Maybe an insert could be fit in the .308 chambers?

Curl



--------------------
RoscoeStephenson.com

YOUR DOUBLE RIFLE IS YOUR BEST FRIEND.



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Morten
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Reged: 24/04/04
Posts: 89
Loc: Ås, Norway
Re: Re' Rifling a Double rifle?? [Re: CptCurl]
      #58787 - 14/06/06 06:20 AM

What would you guys have done with this rifle. The rifle have a most wonderfull apperence but it is a strange round to have in this rifle. Would ou have changed it??? in that case into what?
PS It was rebarreled with barrels in 308

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Yochanan
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Reged: 26/01/03
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Re: Re' Rifling a Double rifle?? [Re: Morten]
      #58791 - 14/06/06 07:43 AM

Morten

9,3X65R Brenneke or 8X75 RS might work. Check if 300 H&H flanged or 30 blaser would clean out the 308 chambers

Cheers
/Johan

--------------------
© "I have never been able to appreciate 'shock' as applied to killing big game. It seems to me that you cannot kill an elephant weighing six tons by ´shock´unless you advocate the use of a field gun." - W.D.M. Bell: Wanderings of an Elephant Hunter.

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mickey
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Re: Re' Rifling a Double rifle?? [Re: Morten]
      #58797 - 14/06/06 10:19 AM

Johan has it. 300 H&H Flanged or 30 Blaser.

I like the Holland for the lower presure, I believe.

--------------------
Lovu Zdar
Mick

A Man of Pleasure, Enterprise, Wit and Spirit Rare Books, Big Game Hunting, English Rifles, Fishing, Explosives, Chauvinism, Insensitivity, Public Drunkenness and Sloth, Champion of Lost and Unpopular Causes.

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bulldog563
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Re: Re' Rifling a Double rifle?? [Re: mickey]
      #58798 - 14/06/06 11:14 AM

300 H&H would be great.

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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: Re' Rifling a Double rifle?? [Re: bulldog563]
      #58805 - 14/06/06 01:45 PM

A .300 Super (H&H Flanged) sounds a fantastic choice if it can be rechambered to it.

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John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
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vigillinus
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Reged: 11/12/03
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Re: Re' Rifling a Double rifle?? [Re: NitroX]
      #58912 - 16/06/06 04:39 PM

Back around 1998 Rigby (still in the UK) quoted me $5000 to rerifle, rechamber, re-regulate, refinish and remark a .350 No. 2 sidelock ejector to 9.3x74R. The firm said that the Germans were mad for Brit doubles in 9.3 and that the value would be increased by more than the cost of the work. At the same time a reliable American firm, now out of business, quoted $900 just for the reboring and rechambering alone. Since the .350 bores were still excellent I did not have the work done and instead wrote an article for Double Gun Journal on the rifle !!!

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500Nitro
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Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: Re' Rifling a Double rifle?? [Re: vigillinus]
      #58913 - 16/06/06 05:03 PM

vigillinus

One of the differences I can see is that if Rigby did it
you can sell the gun World Wide and it would shoot
whereas if the US company did it you could only sell it
in a few countries and certainly none of the markets where
9.3 x 74R Rigby's would be popular (UK, Europe etc).

I have a Sidelock Rigby which Paul Roberts (Rigby's) redid
into 375 Flanged Magnum.

It's a bit like all the 375 Flanged doubles that US gunsmiths made
into 375 Flanged Magnums as they were worth more - but only
in the US and I think those who are / were knowledgeable wouldn't
touch them anyway.

Just my HO.

500 Nitro

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DUGABOY1
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Reged: 02/02/03
Posts: 1340
Loc: TEXAS USA
Re: Re' Rifling a Double rifle?? [Re: Morten]
      #58928 - 17/06/06 06:54 AM

Morten , since the rifle has already been rebored, there is little collector value anyway, so why not re-barrel it to something like 375H&H flanged, or the old stand by 450/400NE 3". The chamber pressures in 308 Win (7.62 NATO) are far higher than either of the two alternitives. If the chambering will clean out the old chamber, the 300 flanged mag would be a choice as well, but pressures are getting high for such an old rifle, as it is with the 308.
I have an idea the reason this rifle was rebored, and re-chambered to 308 is, it was for a someone who had access to thousands of rounds of 308 military ammo,while stationed in a place, like in RSA,where there was good plains game hunting. May have been done durring the sanctions on RSA, when lots of ammo was hard to come by.

The 308 would be my last choice otherwise!

--------------------
..........Mac >>>===(x)===>
DUGABOY1, and MacD37 founding member of DRSS www.doublerifleshooterssociety.com
"If I die today, I have had a life well spent, for I've been to see the Elephant, and smelled the smoke of Africa!"

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Yochanan
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Reged: 26/01/03
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Re: Re' Rifling a Double rifle?? [Re: DUGABOY1]
      #58946 - 17/06/06 09:49 PM

Morten,

300 H&H Flanged would be the most sensible choice, if it could be done (most likely it will be very simple convertion compared to larger caliber). After this gun been renovated you need a double suitable for thick skinned game

Managed to dig out some C.I.P data over the cartridges pressures

308 Win.
4150 PTmax= maximum average pressure (bar)
4773 PK 1,15 Pmax = maximum statistical individual pressure (bar)
5190 PE 1,25 Pmax = mean proof pressure (bar)

30 R Blaser.
4050 PTmax= maximum average pressure (bar)
4658 PK 1,15 Pmax = maximum statistical individual pressure (bar)
5060 PE 1,25 Pmax = mean proof pressure (bar)

30 Super Fl. H.& H.
3200 PTmax= maximum average pressure (bar)
3680 PK 1,15 Pmax = maximum statistical individual pressure (bar)
4000 PE 1,25 Pmax = mean proof pressure (bar)

303 British
3650 PTmax= maximum average pressure (bar)
4198 PK 1,15 Pmax = maximum statistical individual pressure (bar)
4560 PE 1,25 Pmax = mean proof pressure (bar)

375 Fl. Mag. N.E.
3250 PTmax= maximum average pressure (bar)
3738 PK 1,15 Pmax = maximum statistical individual pressure (bar)
4060 PE 1,25 Pmax = mean proof pressure (bar)

450/400 N.E. 3"
2800 PTmax= maximum average pressure (bar)
3220 PK 1,15 Pmax = maximum statistical individual pressure (bar)
3500 PE 1,25 Pmax = mean proof pressure (bar)

450/400 Mag.N.E. 3"1/4
2950 PTmax= maximum average pressure (bar)
3393 PK 1,15 Pmax = maximum statistical individual pressure (bar)
3690 PE 1,25 Pmax = mean proof pressure (bar)


--------------------
© "I have never been able to appreciate 'shock' as applied to killing big game. It seems to me that you cannot kill an elephant weighing six tons by ´shock´unless you advocate the use of a field gun." - W.D.M. Bell: Wanderings of an Elephant Hunter.

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Morten
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Reged: 24/04/04
Posts: 89
Loc: Ås, Norway
Re: Re' Rifling a Double rifle?? [Re: Yochanan]
      #58960 - 18/06/06 01:50 AM

Thank you very much guys. this gives food for the brain. just to clear it, it was rebarreld to 308 not re-rifled. And does anyone have any idea of what a pair of new barrels would cost? not talking about the london made barrels, but elsewhere.

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bulldog563
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Reged: 21/10/05
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Loc: California
Re: Re' Rifling a Double rifle?? [Re: Morten]
      #58966 - 18/06/06 04:00 AM

Probably somewhere around 8K US I would guess.

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Yochanan
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Reged: 26/01/03
Posts: 912
Loc: Volksdiktatur Schweden
Re: Re' Rifling a Double rifle?? [Re: Morten]
      #58967 - 18/06/06 04:02 AM

Morten

You could have a new set of barrels made in Sweden, no idea what it would cost

Cheers
Johan

--------------------
© "I have never been able to appreciate 'shock' as applied to killing big game. It seems to me that you cannot kill an elephant weighing six tons by ´shock´unless you advocate the use of a field gun." - W.D.M. Bell: Wanderings of an Elephant Hunter.

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Ron_Vella
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Reged: 29/04/05
Posts: 432
Loc: Oshawa, Ontario, Canada
Re: Re' Rifling a Double rifle?? [Re: Yochanan]
      #77791 - 01/05/07 11:07 AM

Johan, I've got to ask, is that Agnetha Faltskog's derriere?

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