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Hunting >> Hunting in Africa & hunting dangerous game
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bulldog563
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Reged: 21/10/05
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Which would you choose?
      #56472 - 05/05/06 10:42 PM

I am going to get a new rifle soon for my collection. This will be mainly for use in Africa but will see use elsewhere. Currently I have 2 338WM bolts, 1 375H&H bolt, 1 500NE DR (being built).

There are two options that I have come down to;

A. Get a 9,3 DR(most likely Chapuis).

B. Get a custom bolt rifle (caliber 416 or greater) built by one of the top makers.

I am pretty much split halfway at the moment. I want to get both eventually but only money for one or the other at the moment. The DR will end up being less money which would be nice but I don't want that to be the deciding factor as the extra required for the bolt wont be an issue. The bolt would be more fun because I get to pick the exact components and style but will take multiple years to finish.

So do I get the Medium bore DR or a custom bolt? Any comments/opinions/experiences would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

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allenday
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Reged: 18/04/04
Posts: 318
Re: Which would you choose? [Re: bulldog563]
      #56475 - 05/05/06 11:05 PM

Get the custom bolt-gun. You won't have to pay for all of it up front, and it'll take some time to complete, allowing you to spread the cost out over time. Besides, such rifles are all about EXCELLENCE, and they'll last for generations.

You'll get far, far more use out of a true best-quality bolt-gun that's built, BY INTENT, for hunting than you will a double, because it's much more precise and versatile. Just make sure you hire the right craftsman who is a hunter himself, and sees himself as a builder of true hunting rifles and not "safe queens" that are mostly about fluffy artistic ideas. Not all of these guys are equal in that department, regardless of how pretty their checkering patterns and rust bluing might look on the surface.

The Chapius and similar doubles are fine, but they're limited in their use, and in terms of true craftsmanship and quality they don't come close to matching a best-grade bolt-gun..........

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500grains
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Reged: 16/02/04
Posts: 4732
Loc: Salt Lake City, Utah USA
Re: Which would you choose? [Re: bulldog563]
      #56478 - 05/05/06 11:29 PM

The custom bolt gun in .416 will have too much overlap with your .375 and .500. I think you need something that you can use on a more regular basis, and a nice 9.3 would seem to fit in well.

Or a drilling...

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bonanza
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Reged: 17/05/04
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Re: Which would you choose? [Re: bulldog563]
      #56479 - 05/05/06 11:32 PM

Bulldog,

A 9.3x74R and .416+ are really on the opposite ends of the spectrum (in power) except both are 50-150 yard cartridges. IMHO, you are a double man or a bolt man. Allen is a bolt man and that is what he likes. I like doubles. The Chapuis in a 9.3x74R with a quick-detach scope is an awesome hunting rifle that will set you apart from the bolt crowd. I have a Merkel .375 double and really enjoy taking it deer hunting as it’s so compact and distinctive. If you do go with a custom bolt, take Allen’s advice (and all in this forum); skip the fancy wood work and scroll. Keep it plain and it will be more valuable in the long run as it will be more appealing to the affluent hunter rather than “collectors”.

--------------------


"Speak Precisely" G. Gordon Liddy.

"Life is absurd, chaotic and we must define its purpose with our actions" Abert Camus

"I''m the dude playing a dude disguised as another dude."

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bulldog563
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Reged: 21/10/05
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Re: Which would you choose? [Re: bonanza]
      #56480 - 06/05/06 12:00 AM

Allen,

I have always lusted over the finest bolt rifles. They are truly works of art. If I did go with a bolt I really like Duane Wiebes style. Any Thoughts?

500grs,

I actually did consider a drilling but haven't seen one that does it for me within what I would be willing to spend on this project. I was thinking maybe a Lott or 416 Rigby though I am tempted by the Gibbs. The other two are the more useable choices. As far as the overlap I am giving the 375 to my dad as a present but most likely will still "hold" it for him because he doesn't shoot much and could use it whenever I need to anyway.

bonanza,

I realize that they are very different choices. I just need to decide which one is calling me. Rest assured though that if it is the bolt it will be a classic interpretation.



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allenday
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Reged: 18/04/04
Posts: 318
Re: Which would you choose? [Re: bulldog563]
      #56482 - 06/05/06 12:25 AM

The new June/July issue of 'Sports Afield' has an excellent series of articles on fine custom bolt-action rifles, plus wonderful photos.

On page 44 is a photo of a wonderful and beautiful 300 Win. Mag. that was built by Gene Simillion, who is truly one of the world's best practitions. He's a great and experienced hunter and rifleman in his own right, and he builds beautiful COMPLETE rifles that are dead-accurate and made to hunt with. Gene's a Colorado School of Trades graduate, he apprenticed under Jerry Fisher, and he's a close colleague of my friend, D'Arcy Echols. He's still in his prime, and he's just entering his best years to do his best work. There's NOTHING he can't execute in wood and metal, and you can rest assured that what you'll get from him will FUNCTION 100% and SHOOT.

Since you like the Wiebe style, Gene's stock design should really appeal to you.

Send me a PM if you're interested, and I'll supply contact info...........

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NE450No2
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Reged: 10/01/03
Posts: 942
Re: Which would you choose? [Re: allenday]
      #56496 - 06/05/06 06:52 AM

Bulldog
I recommend you get the 9,3x74R Chapuis double and scope it.
A big bore double, and a scoped 9,3 double has worked perfectly for me in Africa on two different Safaris.

The 9,3 has worked great on deer wild pigs and bears in Texas, Idaho, Montana, and Canada.

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bulldog563
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Reged: 21/10/05
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Re: Which would you choose? [Re: allenday]
      #56543 - 06/05/06 09:26 PM

Allen,

Not sure I could afford one of his rifles if they cost as much as a Wood/blue Echols rifle. If I did go with the bolt I would like to keep it under 10K.

Hopefully I can find a way to buy the Chapuis and put a good portion of the cost of the bolt down and only have to worry about paying it off over the next couple years.

That would be ideal in my eyse.

NE450No2,

Which model Chapuis do you have? The pistol grip on them seems like it is at a very acute angle (from the pics on the Chapuis website looks close to 90 degrees). Any comment?

--------------------
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Edited by bulldog563 (07/05/06 12:35 AM)

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NE450No2
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Re: Which would you choose? [Re: bulldog563]
      #56551 - 07/05/06 12:06 AM

Bulldog

My Chapuis is the standard UGEX model. It is their utility grade. The rifle handles and shoots good.
The pistol grip feels fine to me.

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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: Which would you choose? [Re: NE450No2]
      #56552 - 07/05/06 01:05 AM

For me it would be an easy decision, either a scoped .500/.416 DR and thereby no requiring the .416 BA or the 9.3mm DR (scoped) you are considering.

Whatever you decide have fun.



--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
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allenday
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Reged: 18/04/04
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Re: Which would you choose? [Re: bulldog563]
      #56557 - 07/05/06 04:22 AM

I terms of accuracy, precision, versatility, and shootability, bolt-guns rule the roost.

In terms of romance and theory, double rifles rule, so take your pick!

The Chapuis is a third-rate double that sells for the price of a first-rate bolt-action, and it lacks the bolt-gun's versatility and practicality, plus it offers no real advantages of its own.

Now.........which one do you think makes for a better investment????????????

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bulldog563
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Reged: 21/10/05
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Re: Which would you choose? [Re: allenday]
      #56590 - 07/05/06 03:52 PM

Allen and NE450No2,

Both of you have PM's

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DUGABOY1
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Reged: 02/02/03
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Loc: TEXAS USA
Re: Which would you choose? [Re: bulldog563]
      #56879 - 11/05/06 09:28 AM

Buldog563 , This is simply a matter of your choice, and Allen, and NE450No2 both have strong opinions toward their preferences. The fact is both sides have good, and true points made here. Both are honorable people who know of what they speak. When you consider both types of rifle have their place in the hunting fields, and both will cost you about the same amount in hunting trim, the choice is good which ever way you jump.

If going with Allen's choice, I wouldn't cut corners, but go right to the D'Arcy Echols rifles. The bolt rifle is easier to load for, and if you are shooting more than a couple hundred yds
the BA will be better for you. If you decide to go the Chapuis fork in the road, my advice is to scope it with a quality scope, in the Chapuis QD scope bases. This is a 200 yd rifle as well. I've seen Allen on film do a little shooting, and he can hold his own with anyone! I've aslo seen NE450No2 shoot his double Chapuis 9.3X74R double rifle, in person, and he shoots just as good as Allen does with his bolt rifles. The cost of these two rifle are about the same, and both are very good hunting rifles, and in a good chambering either will be a rifle you can use, and be proud to own, and pass along to your kids down the road. In any case, have fun in the choosing, and useing of your new rifle!

--------------------
..........Mac >>>===(x)===>
DUGABOY1, and MacD37 founding member of DRSS www.doublerifleshooterssociety.com
"If I die today, I have had a life well spent, for I've been to see the Elephant, and smelled the smoke of Africa!"

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bulldog563
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Reged: 21/10/05
Posts: 1153
Loc: California
Re: Which would you choose? [Re: DUGABOY1]
      #56885 - 11/05/06 10:35 AM

I think I am going to go with a bolt. I have just ordered a barrel from Martini & Hagn and am about to order one of Satterlee's new Magnum Mauser action. Just need to find a blank and send it off to be built.

I am really excited for the project.

I may be able to swing the Chapuis as well which would be awesome since the bolt rifle wont be ready for a couple years.

Thanks everyone for the advice.

--------------------
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