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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Double Rifles
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ozhunter
.400 member


Reged: 18/08/04
Posts: 1692
Loc: Sydney, Australia
Loads for 450/400J
      #51518 - 05/03/06 12:07 PM

I have just ordered a SEARCY CLASSIC in 450/400 3". Could any one with experiance let me know what loads they use in their 450/400J. Ideally with Australian powder's that are available in the states as I would like the rifle regulated with powder redly available here in Aus.
Is a MV of 2150fps possible in this caliber?
Cheers,
Adam C.

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400NitroExpress
.400 member


Reged: 26/11/03
Posts: 1154
Loc: Lone Star State
Re: Loads for 450/400J [Re: ozhunter]
      #51535 - 05/03/06 12:48 PM

The original standards for the .400 Jeffery were 60 grains Cordite and a 400 grain bullet at 2125 fps in a 30" pressure barrel for 16 tons bolt thrust. In rifles with 24" to 26" barrels, Cordite ammo was well under that.

My understanding is that Butch does something completely different with this cartridge. Seems like I read somewhere that his load gives 2150 in a 24" barrel - much hotter than the standard load. You should ask Butch for the load that he regulates with.

In my 26" barrels, I've used anywhere from 68 to 70.5 grains Reloder 15 (due to lot to lot density variance) to get 2075 fps with 400 grain Woodleighs. I use new Bell brass and Federal 215 primers.
-----------------------------------------------------------

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"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

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Marrakai
.416 member


Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 3591
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia
Re: Loads for 450/400J [Re: ozhunter]
      #51545 - 05/03/06 01:16 PM

ozhunter:
My Jeffery .400 regulates with 81gr AR2213 and the 400gr Woodleigh. Graeme Wright recommends 80gr IMR4831. No filler or wads are needed. Both these loads give velocities at or just above 2000 fps in 24" barrels.

I haven't developed a load for AR2213-SC yet as I bought the old powder in bulk and still have a few kgs to get through. Working on it, though!

I'm betting that your Searcy will be regulated at 2150 fps at normal barrel-length, and why not?, with new steel and modern powders. Start at 80gr AR2213-SC and adjust accordingly, till it regulates. Use a chronograph, very important, and don't exceed 2150 fps. If it comes together a bit under that, bonus. Margin for error. Remember that with a double, you are seeking perfect regulation NOT best ballistics.

As others have advised, if all else fails, ring Butch!

--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

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400NitroExpress
.400 member


Reged: 26/11/03
Posts: 1154
Loc: Lone Star State
Re: Loads for 450/400J [Re: Marrakai]
      #51549 - 05/03/06 02:12 PM

The "why not?" is pressure. There is no good reason to horse a double, and 16 tons is already plenty.

Were I having a new .400 built, I'd have it regulated with current factory Kynoch. That way you'll be able to get good accuracy with factory ammo, rather than being stuck with handloads only. You might want that option sometime. The current Kynoch is good ammo, and it's easy to duplicate with handloads. The above load does so in my rifle. New ammo from Hornady will also be available soon.
----------------------------------------------------------

--------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

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500Nitro
.450 member


Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: Loads for 450/400J [Re: 400NitroExpress]
      #51552 - 05/03/06 03:17 PM


400NitroExpress

We can't get Kynoch here in Aus and no one is going to import it
as it just costs too much (shipping).

All but the Powder and primers originated here anyway and
most of the powders are here as well.

500 Nitro

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ozhunter
.400 member


Reged: 18/08/04
Posts: 1692
Loc: Sydney, Australia
Re: Loads for 450/400J [Re: 500Nitro]
      #51555 - 05/03/06 05:20 PM

Thanks for the replies so far.
The rifle will come with 26" barrels and I am hoping that I can get a tad over 2100fps as velocity, seams to help with cat hunting.
I will most likely use HORNERBER or BELL brass, any thoughts?
Does any one know what AR3313sc is sold as in the US?
Many thanks,
Adam C.

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500Nitro
.450 member


Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: Loads for 450/400J [Re: ozhunter]
      #51557 - 05/03/06 05:51 PM


AR3313sc according to the ADI book is H4831

I'd also try for a load of AR2209 which is H414/H4350
as 2209 is more widely used and if you reload for other
calibres more likely to be on hand.

Suggest you buy the latest ADI Reloading book.


500 Nitro

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ozhunter
.400 member


Reged: 18/08/04
Posts: 1692
Loc: Sydney, Australia
Re: Loads for 450/400J [Re: 500Nitro]
      #51558 - 05/03/06 06:02 PM

Thanks 500Nitro,
I will try both as I use the 2209 for my 470NE and 2213sc in my 7x64.
I will ask Butch to try these for regulating as he confirmed he would be able to.
With the trouble with importing of gun items would you use any US made powder?
Cheers,
Adam C.

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500Nitro
.450 member


Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: Loads for 450/400J [Re: ozhunter]
      #51559 - 05/03/06 06:29 PM


Adam,

No, I don't use any OS powders as it is getting harder and harder
for the importers to import it.

By the way, we know each other (you bought stuff from me)
and have mutual friends.

Do you own a Merkel 470 ex Melbourne ?

500 Nitro

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Marrakai
.416 member


Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 3591
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia
Re: Loads for 450/400J [Re: ozhunter]
      #51560 - 05/03/06 06:32 PM

400NE:
Of course I agree with you on pressure, but I thought the point of the Searcy is that with modern steel and components we are not limited to vintage Brit pre-WW1 pressures in these cartridges. In any case, 16 tons is the old cordite pressure. I'll bet anything you like that I can get 2150 fps from that cartridge using modern ADI powders, and maybe even Reloader powder, in a 26-inch barrel at less pressure than the original cordite factory-load! Especially in the tropics!!

I don't like AR2209 in the .400 Jeffery as it leaves a bit more air-space in the case and raises the question of using a filler or wad. With AR2213 or IMR4831you definitely don't need it.

AR2213-SC (nee AR2213) works so well in all the big nitro-express cases, an Australian reloader would have to be mad to consider anything else IMHO. Doubly-so if you factor in price and availability!

--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

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400NitroExpress
.400 member


Reged: 26/11/03
Posts: 1154
Loc: Lone Star State
Re: Loads for 450/400J [Re: Marrakai]
      #51572 - 05/03/06 11:18 PM

Marrakai,

I understand your point about powder availability. That must be a pain in the ass for you guys.

As for the pressure and "modern" steels issue, I simply couldn't disagree with you more. I'm seeing more of the new rifles knocked loose these days than I do the old ones.
-----------------------------------------------------------

--------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

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