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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Double Rifles
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Will
.333 member


Reged: 04/02/03
Posts: 303
Loc: Kansas
Drop at the Butt of a Double Rifle
      #4639 - 29/10/03 03:52 PM

I was re-reading John Kingsley-Heath's book "Hunting the Dangerous Game of Africa" (or something like that) where he relates that his favorite rifle was a Westley Richards "White Hunter" in .470 NE, with a photo of the rifle.

What I noticed was that there was hardly any drop from the comb to the butt of the stock. Now that makes sense. It should minimize a lot of the recoil. I don't think any of the mass-produced doubles these days are even remotely similar.



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Bill Stewart

Once you have been amongst them, there is no such thing as too much gun.

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IronBuck
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Reged: 11/01/03
Posts: 237
Loc: Pittsburgh PA, USA
Re: Drop at the Butt of a Double Rifle [Re: Will]
      #4671 - 31/10/03 01:55 PM

I thought that they had the drop so that the iron sights would come into view more naturally. This is why older bolt action and lever action rifles had lots of drop in the passd before scopes became common.

It would eliminate percieved recoil nut wouldn't it make getting on target harder/slower?

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mickey
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Reged: 05/01/03
Posts: 4647
Loc: Pend Oreille Valley, Idaho
Re: Drop at the Butt of a Double Rifle [Re: IronBuck]
      #4676 - 31/10/03 03:19 PM

If the rifle was stocked to him it would fit him. Everyone views sights differently and holds a rifle differently.

The mass produced Doubles now are like Bolt rifles, they are made for 'Joe Average'.

I find that the drop on most BP Doubles is not nearly enough for me and find it very difficult to 'get low enough' t see the sights. Fat cheeks I guess.

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Lovu Zdar
Mick

A Man of Pleasure, Enterprise, Wit and Spirit Rare Books, Big Game Hunting, English Rifles, Fishing, Explosives, Chauvinism, Insensitivity, Public Drunkenness and Sloth, Champion of Lost and Unpopular Causes.

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4seventy
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Reged: 07/05/03
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Re: Drop at the Butt of a Double Rifle [Re: Will]
      #4698 - 02/11/03 09:34 AM

High straight combs may be able to reduce the felt recoil at the shoulder slightly but what they take from the shoulder they often put back into your cheekbone!
I'd rather take most of the recoil at the shoulder as a few good belts under the cheekbone from a hard kicker can take the fun out of shooting real fast.


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Will
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Reged: 04/02/03
Posts: 303
Loc: Kansas
Re: Drop at the Butt of a Double Rifle [Re: 4seventy]
      #4701 - 02/11/03 10:47 AM

I am no expert, and you could be right, but.....

for me, straight stocked rifles kick alot less. The 470 I had was just brutal to shoot even standing up, worse than the 416 and Lott that have straight stocks, which I use just perfectly fine with open sights.

I think that a large drop at the heel tends to yield muzzle flip and therefore would tend to give the cheek a bruising.

Of course, everyone is built differently.


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Bill Stewart

Once you have been amongst them, there is no such thing as too much gun.

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4seventy
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Re: Drop at the Butt of a Double Rifle [Re: Will]
      #4758 - 04/11/03 01:45 PM

Sounds like your 470 was behaving very differently to the other rifles you mentioned.
There is however, a lot more to it than just the amount of drop at the heel when talking about perceived recoil either at the shoulder or at the cheek.
Things like stock length, cast, comb height, pad width and type, barrel length and weight, gun ballance and weight, cartridge type and capacity, bullet weight and velocity, etc etc.
Bear in mind that while a 458 Win mag and a 470 Nitro express share similar external balistics, they can be vastly different in their felt recoil.
The thing is that even if you had fitted a stock with less drop at the heel to your 470 it still may have kicked much harder than your other 2 rifles.
Also if the new stock, because of its height, made you have to push down harder with your face in order to line up the sights, there would be more chance of getting a belt on the cheekbone.
You only need one good hit and your cheek swells a little and gets a bit tender and then you have no chance of getting your head low enough to use the sights.

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DUGABOY1
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Reged: 02/02/03
Posts: 1340
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Re: Drop at the Butt of a Double Rifle [Re: 4seventy]
      #4760 - 04/11/03 02:10 PM

4seventy, the strait stock has another effect on a double that wasn't made for the strait stock! The recoil is caused to recoil strait back more than with more drop! If the stock is changed drasticly in either dirrection, the regulation is often effected adversely! This is caused by the muzzles being at a different place in the recoil arch when the bullet exits.

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..........Mac >>>===(x)===>
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"If I die today, I have had a life well spent, for I've been to see the Elephant, and smelled the smoke of Africa!"

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4seventy
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Re: Drop at the Butt of a Double Rifle [Re: DUGABOY1]
      #4777 - 05/11/03 02:32 PM

Also if a fly landed on the barrels just as they were fired he/she could drasticly alter the barrels harmonics and vibrations and also affect regulation.

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DUGABOY1
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Reged: 02/02/03
Posts: 1340
Loc: TEXAS USA
Re: Drop at the Butt of a Double Rifle [Re: 4seventy]
      #4786 - 06/11/03 02:54 AM

Considering the amount of flies in the top end, you buff hunters are in trouble!

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..........Mac >>>===(x)===>
DUGABOY1, and MacD37 founding member of DRSS www.doublerifleshooterssociety.com
"If I die today, I have had a life well spent, for I've been to see the Elephant, and smelled the smoke of Africa!"

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