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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Big Bore Rifles

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303
.300 member


Reged: 15/03/05
Posts: 136
Loc: west retreat
50-140 sharps
      #46311 - 10/01/06 08:42 PM

i dont know much about this caliber and was wondering what i preforms like on game and what rifle best to have it in eg sharps

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DarylS
.700 member


Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 27005
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: 50-140 sharps [Re: 303]
      #46338 - 11/01/06 05:43 AM

On North American game, all of the .50's seem work better than the .45's. Nothin is changed there. The smaller bores were broght out for shooting longer ranges. The typical 36" twist of the .50 2-1/2" cal Sharps didn't stabilize the bullets well, which restricted it's effective range on buffalo to around 300yards. To that range, it was better than any smaller bore. The 3-1/4" .50 cal case was invented by Winchester, not Sharps. It was never Factory chambered in Sharps rifle.
The .50/90 is much easier to shoot with smokeless as well as black powder loads. By this, I mean the slightly shorter case is easier to produce accurate ammo in.
: I've had both, and the 2.5" case is the way to go.
: A friend, who owns my old 3-1/3" Sharps, routinely uses the 450 Lyman bullet with 110gr. of AA 4350 or 3100, not sure which, for well over 2,000fps. The load is listed in the Accurate Arms powder handbook. It polaxes moose, but then, so does a 550gr. RCBS bullet from the .50/90.
: Due to the cavernous case, smokeless loads don't bulk up well, which promotes the shooter into using very large charges of very slow burning powders. With a narrow butt plate, recoil is memorable. A shot-gun butt is recommended.
: One load that shot into 1.3" @ 100 meters(tang and pinhead sights) for me with the 3-1/4" case, was 63gr. 3031 with plastic bead filler and a 550gr. RCBS cast bullet. This made 1,760fps in my rifle and had all the recoil I desired - and more. It is listed max for the #515141 Lyman bullet in the Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook, but I had no trouble with it in my Sharps with the heavier bullet- this is not a load to simply use - it must be worked up to carefully, as all load data must be utilized.
: The 50/90's smaller case developed accurate ammo in less than 1/4 the time spent working on the longer case when using black powder. That's a month or two, vs. over a year with the long case. With so much powder, proper lubrication to keep the fouling soft is a major problem, bouncing back and forth between crusty fouled breech due to too hard a lube to crusty fouling at the muzzle due to lack of enough lube or too soft a lube leaving the bullet too soon in the bore. The .50/90 did not need extra lube balls to keep things soft, even with 100gr. of 2FBP for a charge - the longer case did.
: The .50/90 delivers more than enough power for any North American game & ballistics from the L:yman book can be improved upon by using AA data from their mailer handbook.
: 2.5" case- Lyman bullet- 440gr. (in their alloy)38.0gr. 5744- 1,557fps & the 550gr. RCBS w/35gr. 5744 for 1,411fps.(my preference)
: The 3-1/2" case, with 5744 runs 1978 with 440gr. and 1,736fps with 550gr. The Regular AA reloading book lists loads for both using their normal rifle powders, which is where my firend got his loads.
: Note that Federal 215 Pimers are suggested with this large bore cases.
: Hope this helps.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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BlainSmipy
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Reged: 24/11/05
Posts: 558
Loc: Washington, USA
Re: 50-140 sharps [Re: DarylS]
      #46350 - 11/01/06 10:12 AM

What sort of FPE are you getting out the 50/90 and 50/140?
Black and smokeless?

I am considering building a double made in 50/90 or 50/140, but I know nothing about this round. It will shoot both BP and smokeless.

Is there factory ammo, or is it strickley reloading?

Thanks,
Jason


--------------------
You horde gold, I horde lead.


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pwm
.300 member


Reged: 15/06/04
Posts: 216
Loc: Banana Republik of Germany
Re: 50-140 sharps [Re: BlainSmipy]
      #46414 - 12/01/06 03:48 AM

there is a 45/120 factory load in germany from WM Bullets with CIP proof.
the 485grain lead bullet makes 580 m/sec with an energie of 5434 Joule. Wolfgang Romey's 450/400 3 1/4" factory load have only 5308 Joule.
Because the 450/120 have the very strong CIP proof I have to believe that it is save for any old Blackpowder gun.
Two years ago I have seen an american made double gun for the 450/120 in the net. it was only a old 12 bore sxs with two . 45 barrel liner.
I cant imagine that the 50/140 cartridge is able to do the same.


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DarylS
.700 member


Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 27005
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: 50-140 sharps [Re: BlainSmipy]
      #46417 - 12/01/06 04:15 AM

BP ammo in these rounds ran in the 2,500 to 2600 fpe range. Smokeless, of course, ran much higher. Of course, this sounds lower than their game performance dictates. Either will drop a buffalo with a proper hit, and did, out to 300 or more yards. They lacked accuracy due to too-slow twists, not power for longer ranged killing. A 24" twist, barrels available from GREEN MOUNTAIN or "TRACKOFTHEWOLF" will re-barrel to a proper long range twist that will shoot 1-1/2" easily at from 100 to 200 meters with BP or smokeless.(mine did)
: Either .50's are much more powerful than equivalent fpe would suggest. It is a poor indicator of killing power.
: It does have one use though. We know from experience it takes roughly 400fpe from a .17 to .22 cal bullet to easily dispatch coyotes without loss.
: 1/2 that fpe, from a .54 round ball penetrated to the off side of a bull moose, dropping it in 40yards from impact, yet it's 200fpe is 1/2 of what is considered necessary for coyote - that alone should dispell fpe as being anything remotely attached to killing power of large bore rifles.
: I do not know if there is such an animal as factory ammo for either. I suggest that there probably is, but on a custom basis only. These rifles are individuals and need ammo developed for them specifically.


--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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