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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Mauser Discussion Forum
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Vintage_Canvas
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Loc: Western Cape, South Africa
Mauser 10.75x68. Let's give it another chance!
      #386960 - 28/09/24 04:03 AM

After my 8x68S photos, I promised John I will share my 10.75x68 journey! I will start by loading a article from one off our very informed members, Johan van Wyk, who was editor of SA Hunter magazine and is also a respected journalist of all things hunting and fine vintage rifles!
Johan, I hope its ok that I share your article from SA Hunter with our members??
So this article and a older one by Dirk Steynberg in Man Magnum about his challenges on trying to hunt a buffalo with his 10.75x68 custom rifle (I will try and find it and post it here) convinced me that it is possible to give this grand old caliber a second chance! in the next post i will share with you my first 10.75x68 rifle...
But first over to Johan!





--------------------
"the real Africa is still out there... you just need to know where to find it"

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Vintage_Canvas
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Reged: 18/02/20
Posts: 89
Loc: Western Cape, South Africa
Re: Mauser 10.75x68. Let's give it another chance! [Re: Vintage_Canvas]
      #386961 - 28/09/24 04:21 AM

So after a long search, a friend phoned me to asked if I still want a 10.75x68? Of course, I said! he send me some photos and without seeing the rifle, I bought it.... trusting his judgement! After all the red tape to get the license, the rifle finally arrived! What a disappointment! On the barrel it said maid in Belgium, as I was convinced by my friend that it was a FN?? this rifle look like it was build in someone's back yard shed. I was build on a mauser action! When I strip the barrel and action from the stock, I notice a huge crack behind the reciever all the way down to the trigger guard. the metalwork was horrible! After I tried to fix the broken stock as well as possible with a extra recoil lug, I also revive the stock and give it a new life, but I cant do anything to the metal work....
So eventually it was time to take it to the range....
I have some old Kynoch rounds in solid and soft nose. I tested them in the magazine. they fit, but some don't extract properly when the bolt is closed and opened without firing. That can be fixed, I told myself.
So after all the preperations, I loaded a soft nose, get the sights on the target at 50m and pulled the trigger! Click! I was tense as a bow! Slowly opened the bolt, closed it, pull trigger again.... click!
Eject the cartridge. Load a solid, pulled the trigger! Click! Same result. After inspection of the two cartridges, both had a light indent where the primer was struck, but it was not enough!
So after all my trouble and sorting out the broken stock and fitting the recoil lug, this was the last straw! I sold the rifle....
so below is the photos. but like they say, to him who waits patiently, all things good will come!
I manage to get a real beauty... but that is another story!















--------------------
"the real Africa is still out there... you just need to know where to find it"

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lancaster
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Reged: 06/05/08
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Re: Mauser 10.75x68. Let's give it another chance! [Re: Vintage_Canvas]
      #386963 - 28/09/24 04:58 AM

looks like a belgian made rifle but not orignal FN, would be engraved in no uncertain manner.
still had some potential if you figure it out. what was the problem with the firing pin - just a little bit to short or the spring weak?

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians

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buckstix
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Re: Mauser 10.75x68. Let's give it another chance! [Re: lancaster]
      #386966 - 28/09/24 10:01 AM

10.75x68 is one of my favorite calibers - here's a post about one of mine from earlier this year ... http://forums.nitroexpress.com/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=383896&page=0&fpart=1&vc=1

--------------------
"You never pay too much for something, you only buy it too early."

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DarylS
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Re: Mauser 10.75x68. Let's give it another chance! [Re: lancaster]
      #386983 - 29/09/24 02:13 AM

Quote:

looks like a belgian made rifle but not orignal FN, would be engraved in no uncertain manner.
still had some potential if you figure it out. what was the problem with the firing pin - just a little bit to short or the spring weak?



Suspect weak or standard spring in the magnum action?

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: Mauser 10.75x68. Let's give it another chance! [Re: DarylS]
      #386984 - 29/09/24 03:17 AM

An interesting "study" into the 10.75x68.

At one time these were quite "common" on the second hand market. Cheaper as well probably due to the cartridges lesser performance and the Mausers being standard actions.

Harry Manners had a 10.75x68 and rejected it for a .375 for buffalo culling and elephant.

The weak bullet construction was often blamed for the lesser performance.

A 347 gr at 2100 fps or less is anaemic.

I noted Woodleigh made a 347 gr SP for the x68 and a 350 gr for the .404. I wonder if the 350 gr has different construction? The sectional density is also a little low.

If modern powders could get the 10.75 with a 400 gr up to 2,100 fps, it would be an acceptable killer.

I'd love to see a 10.75x68 as an acceptable big game cartridge. A .404 is however a far better choice.

The 10.75x68 reminds me of the 9.5x57, a milder cartridge, perhaps a little less powerful than sensible. But good for medium and driven game.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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lancaster
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Re: Mauser 10.75x68. Let's give it another chance! [Re: NitroX]
      #386987 - 29/09/24 04:40 AM

before the war there was also a special DWM load for european big game that was listed in the DWM catalog with a muzzle velocity of only 610 m/sec against the common 10,75x68 load with 680 m/sec for the 350 grains bullet.

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians

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eagle27
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Re: Mauser 10.75x68. Let's give it another chance! [Re: lancaster]
      #386988 - 29/09/24 07:37 AM

This what Keith Luckhurst wrote back in an article 'Reloading the 404 Jeffery';

"My .404 started out life in 1928 as an original ‘Type A’ Oberndorf Mauser in 10.75x68mm. It was used to shoot an elephant in Tuli in about 1973. The shot was a frontal brain shot, which knocked down the animal, but it immediately got up and made off to Botswana with great enthusiasm. It was then decided that the conversion to 10.75x73mm, also known as the .404 Jeffrey, was in order."

My own 404 also started life as a Mauser Type A 10.75x68 suitably converted to the 404 Jeffery cartridge, presumably in Harare, Rhodesia where it was purchased and brought back to NZ.

Back in the late 70's when I got the rifle 404 ammo and components were hard enough to find let alone trying to find 10.75x68 stuff so I suppose after Kynoch closed down and RWS also limited its production of NE cartridges, converting 10.75x68 chambered rifles to 404 Jeffery was likely more an expedient for supply rather than anything else. Notwithstanding this I would much prefer the big 404 cartridge for large and dangerous game rather than the somewhat smaller 10.75 Mauser.

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Rolf
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Reged: 26/02/07
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Re: Mauser 10.75x68. Let's give it another chance! [Re: eagle27]
      #387002 - 30/09/24 05:29 AM

Gentlemen,

thank you very much for the article on the 10,75x68!

As I am quite a fan of the 10,75x68 I would like to add some information:

- cases are available from SHM (Süddeutsche Hülsen Manufaktur) in Bavaria/Germany

- Bullets can be obtained from Mr. Wim Degol (Degol bullets) in Belgium. The bullets are available in 300, 347 and 400grains in full metal jacket and bonded soft point configuration

- with Kemiras medium burning powders it is possible to accelerate the 347grs Degol and the Woodleigh SPRN bullets to 2350 fps / 715 m/s (61cm/24" barrel), resulting in 5700 Joules at the muzzle.

- precision is ok upto very good for a big game cartridge (best load : 6 shots at 100m within 32mm with a 6power scope)

A friend of mine used this load in a modern custom rifle (based on a pre-war II 98 system from Gunmaker Karl-Heinz Hirschle) for driven game (boar) hunt and had a very good results for anchoring the pigs (45kg upto 70kg). No animal went further than 50m with good shot placement.

- the mentioned rifle is based on a DWM 98 system and feeds flawless SPRN and, of course, the RWS FMJ RN bullets

@ John:
The 347 and 350grs SPRN bullets from Woodleigh differ only in the position of the crimp cannelure and for both bullets an impact velocity of 1800-2300 fps is recommended.

best regards
Rolf

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93x64mm
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Reged: 07/12/11
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Re: Mauser 10.75x68. Let's give it another chance! [Re: Rolf]
      #387003 - 30/09/24 06:03 AM

Great article VC!
Cartridges now 100 years+ can certainly get a new lease on life with modern powders & with new projectiles be better than ever!

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85lc
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Reged: 19/01/18
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Re: Mauser 10.75x68. Let's give it another chance! [Re: 93x64mm]
      #387016 - 01/10/24 01:33 AM

Great article and great discussion. Apparently a number of pre-war cartridges had poor bullet construction ad that impacted the written reviews. I believe the problem was mostly wioth German cartridges.

--------------------
RB

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Vintage_Canvas
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Reged: 18/02/20
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Loc: Western Cape, South Africa
Re: Mauser 10.75x68. Let's give it another chance! [Re: 85lc]
      #387017 - 01/10/24 02:05 AM

Rolf, thank you for your info on the cartridge and the bullet and powder choices!
do you know maybe what velocity did you get with 400gr bullets?
I am still looking for a dieset in 10.75x68 so that I can start with load testing and development!! So if any of you gents know of a dieset somewhere, please let me know! I tried CH4D in US, but they dont have stock at moment, and they cannot tell me when one will be available! I have bertram brass and an assortment of bullets, so very keen to start reloading...
I will post my custom new rifle's photos tonight!

--------------------
"the real Africa is still out there... you just need to know where to find it"

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93x64mm
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Re: Mauser 10.75x68. Let's give it another chance! [Re: Vintage_Canvas]
      #387020 - 01/10/24 06:06 AM

VC
Try CBE Engineering, they have bought SIMPLEX dies.
They are very well made & will last lifetimes!
I had a list of them somewhere & I think (not completely sure) that the 10.75x68mm was on it!
https://www.castbulletengineering.com.au/simplex-reloading-dies

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jvw
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Re: Mauser 10.75x68. Let's give it another chance! [Re: 93x64mm]
      #387027 - 01/10/24 02:50 PM

I wrote this article amidst the lockdown of 2020 for SA Hunter Magazine's special annual edition. No problem in keeping it up.

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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: Mauser 10.75x68. Let's give it another chance! [Re: jvw]
      #387033 - 02/10/24 12:31 AM

Quote:

I wrote this article amidst the lockdown of 2020 for SA Hunter Magazine's special annual edition. No problem in keeping it up.



Dankie. A future information asset.

Quote:


@ John:
The 347 and 350grs SPRN bullets from Woodleigh differ only in the position of the crimp cannelure and for both bullets an impact velocity of 1800-2300 fps is recommended.

best regards
Rolf



Rolf,

Danke Schoen, Thanks for the information.

***

A question for anyone.

What safe speed have you managed to obtain with a 400 gr projectile?

And if so, what safe load, what powder and how much? Thanks,

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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Rule303
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Re: Mauser 10.75x68. Let's give it another chance! [Re: Rolf]
      #387045 - 02/10/24 09:52 AM

Rolf thanks for that information. Certainly moves an old not successful cartridge into the ballistic area it should have been in.

I believe the 358Norma Magnum suffered for one of the same reasons, poor bullet construction.


If Simplex can not make the dies for you, and I would be very surprised if the can't, try Lee and Redding. I have given up on CH4D and would not recommended them to anybody.

Edited by Rule303 (02/10/24 09:56 AM)

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rglenz
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Re: Mauser 10.75x68. Let's give it another chance! [Re: Rule303]
      #387046 - 02/10/24 10:59 AM

John, In my rifle, put together from parts with an original Oberndorf barrel. I get 2100 fps easily with 64.2 grains of H335, 400 grain Woodleigh bullet.

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Rolf
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Re: Mauser 10.75x68. Let's give it another chance! [Re: rglenz]
      #387189 - 11/10/24 09:59 PM

Hello John,

here are some data on the 10,75x68 and the 400grs bullets:

- data copy of "RWS reloading handbook" issue 9
barrel length 60cm / 23.6"
bullet: RWS .423" FMJ RN (has only a thin metal jacket!)
powder Rottweil R902 max. load 61.0grs
obtained speed: 605 m/s // 1985 fps


my personal data from a custom built rifle with a 66cm barrel:

bullet: RWS .423" FMJ RN , OAL beyond the standard of 81,0mm
powder: Dynamit Nobel R902
displayed velocity: 637,7 m/s // 2092 fps
I found out later that the chronograph was overly optimistic and the reading should be reduced by around 20 m/s, which gives a realistic value of ca. 617 m/s / 2024 fps.

best regards
Rolf

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Vintage_Canvas
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Re: Mauser 10.75x68. Let's give it another chance! [Re: Rolf]
      #387219 - 13/10/24 06:20 PM

Rolf, thank you for the info! I am planning to hunt a buff with my 10.75x68, and once I manage to find a dieset, will start reloading and develop loads! Just a note on chronographs.... we tested the old Chrony one's with a new Garmin, and got very interesting results! Because the Garmin is right next to the barrel and the old Chrony is 5m in front of the barrel, the results that the Garmin give is always faster than with the chrony! I friend then respond that by the time the bullet reach the Chrony after 5m, the velocity could have dropped by up to 30-50f/s?? That was about the difference that we measured. Just a footnote.
I shot a few rounds in my new custom build 10.75x68 and the old Kynoch's 347gr measured between 2100-2150f/s with the Garmin and the Chrony. There was not really a difference between solids and softs.
So with the right powder and primer combo, I think 2100 would be easy to reach with 400gr?? I will let you guys know!
See below photos of my new 10.75x68 build on a DWM action.

--------------------
"the real Africa is still out there... you just need to know where to find it"

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Vintage_Canvas
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Reged: 18/02/20
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Loc: Western Cape, South Africa
Re: Mauser 10.75x68. Let's give it another chance! [Re: Vintage_Canvas]
      #387220 - 13/10/24 06:22 PM













--------------------
"the real Africa is still out there... you just need to know where to find it"

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Vintage_Canvas
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Reged: 18/02/20
Posts: 89
Loc: Western Cape, South Africa
Re: Mauser 10.75x68. Let's give it another chance! [Re: Vintage_Canvas]
      #387221 - 13/10/24 06:26 PM

Almost forgot... I manage to find a old article on the 10.75x68 in the Man Magnum. See below...




--------------------
"the real Africa is still out there... you just need to know where to find it"

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lancaster
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Reged: 06/05/08
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Re: Mauser 10.75x68. Let's give it another chance! [Re: Vintage_Canvas]
      #387227 - 14/10/24 12:18 AM

Quote:







this is a damned or bloody nice rifle!

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians

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85lc
.400 member


Reged: 19/01/18
Posts: 1038
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Re: Mauser 10.75x68. Let's give it another chance! [Re: lancaster]
      #387233 - 14/10/24 04:16 AM

Wondedrful rifle.

--------------------
RB

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DarylS
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Reged: 10/08/05
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Re: Mauser 10.75x68. Let's give it another chance! [Re: 85lc]
      #387234 - 14/10/24 05:00 AM

Good article. I quite enjoyed it and couldn't agree more about the use of cast bullets. I would include eland as suitable game for a decent cast bullet load.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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93x64mm
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Reged: 07/12/11
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Re: Mauser 10.75x68. Let's give it another chance! [Re: DarylS]
      #387237 - 14/10/24 07:11 AM

Very nice piece of kit there VC!
Hope the reloading goes well when you are able to, will unlock a far more potent cartridge after that, especially with better projectiles will turn this old girl into what she should have been!
Don't forget to add in the range report when you can, will certainly have a lot of us keen to see what transpires.

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