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buckstix
.400 member


Reged: 07/11/12
Posts: 1243
Loc: Whitetail Country
A Vintage 1872 W.W. Greener 450 3-1/4" bpe Double Rifle
      #320964 - 26/10/18 11:30 PM

Hello all,

Lightning strikes again. As always, your comments are welcome.

The Wisconsin Gun Collectors Show in Fond du Lac, Wisconsin, is one of the finest gun shows here in the upper Central States. It has over 550 tables and they hold 3 shows per year. However, its very unusual to find any Double Rifles for sale there. I've only seen 5 double rifles for sale at the show in the last 35 years.

Last April I purchased a Wm Evans 450 bpe at this local Wisconsin Gun Show. (see post)

http://forums.nitroexpress.com/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=299309&an=0&page=3#Post299309

Since my Wm Evans purchase last Spring, I always check back with that same seller to see if he has any other double rifles for sale. And, lo-and-behold, this year he did. A cased W.W. Greener 450 3-1/4" bpe. He told me this came from the same elderly man that owned the Wm Evans, and that he was helping him liquidate his collection.

I carefully examined the Rifle and its case, and asked about price. (I paid about 1/3 retail for that Wm Evans last year) He told me "the same price as the one last year." I pointed out that the Wm Evans double was in better overall condition than this W.W. Greener ..., and he pointed out ..., "this one comes with its Original Leather Case, an England made Oil Bottle, 50 pieces of brass, reloading dies, and....... 10 boxes of Kynoch Factory Ammo." And, the discussion was over - - it followed me home. That's 2 for 2 from this seller. I can't wait to see what he has for me next year.

Here are the specs.

W.W.Greener - SERIAL NUMBER 11169 - most markings have been worn or polished away from numerous re-blackening / refinishing / restoring.

Tight on face - Good bores - no cracks or chips in the wood - overall non-abused condition
Case color receiver (redone)
Under-lever
450 - 3-1/4" bpe caliber
28" Barrels
1 standing rear Sight
bead front Sight
9# 15 oz
14-1/8" LOP
Fences
Non-Rebounding Hammers
Red Silver's Butt Pad
Captive Wedge Forend Release
Both Locks marked "W.W.Greener"
Bottom of Barrels = "52" "11169" "elephant tragemark" "? Crown" "? Crown" (details worn away)

Although well used over many years, it remains very tight on face.

I'm guessing the age as the 1870's based on the non-rebounding hammers. I've already sent over 40 pictures to Graham Greener to see if he has any History on the Gun.

The case is embossed with; "W.R.M. WYNNE ESQ're" - "PENIARTH, MACHYNLLETH" so I searched his name on the internet. I found him listed on Wikipedia. - a fragment of a paper label on bottom of the case reads: "(C)AMBRIAN RAILWAYS".

If it stops raining today, I'll take it to the range for a test run. I haven't decided if I'll shoot some of the Factory Ammo, or sell it to recover 1/4th of my purchase price.
























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I received a reply from Graham Greener as to the History of this rifle. Here's what he said:

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--------------------
"You never pay too much for something, you only buy it too early."


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lancaster
.470 member


Reged: 06/05/08
Posts: 9038
Loc: There's a lighthouse in the mi...
Re: A Vintage 1872 W.W. Greener 450 3-1/4" bpe Double Rifle [Re: buckstix]
      #320966 - 27/10/18 01:17 AM

what to say about it, simply great double

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians


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Huvius
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Reged: 04/11/07
Posts: 3556
Loc: Colorado
Re: A Vintage 1872 W.W. Greener 450 3-1/4" bpe Double Rifle [Re: lancaster]
      #320969 - 27/10/18 01:55 AM

Another nice pick up and it sounds like you got into it quite reasonably.
So many of these rifles are overlooked - the general hunting public assuming they are obsolete and ineffective.
I'm sure you will get the best out of it (you have a knack for that) and I applaud you for getting out and working up loads for all of these rifles you are collecting.
As for the ammo, I think I would sell it off since the brass etc. are so easy to come by.
Question though, what is the headstamp on that ammo? Is it like the old Kynoch light cordite with the "L C" stamped on it? If so, I would be more inclined to keep some of it.

--------------------
He who lives in the past is doomed to enjoy it.


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DarylS
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Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 27009
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: A Vintage 1872 W.W. Greener 450 3-1/4" bpe Double Rifle [Re: Huvius]
      #320971 - 27/10/18 03:59 AM

Well done buckstix. Nice 'catch'.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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93x64mm
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Reged: 07/12/11
Posts: 4204
Loc: Nth QLD Australia
Re: A Vintage 1872 W.W. Greener 450 3-1/4" bpe Double Rifle [Re: Huvius]
      #320974 - 27/10/18 07:23 AM

Quote:

Another nice pick up and it sounds like you got into it quite reasonably.
So many of these rifles are overlooked - the general hunting public assuming they are obsolete and ineffective.
I'm sure you will get the best out of it (you have a knack for that) and I applaud you for getting out and working up loads for all of these rifles you are collecting.
As for the ammo, I think I would sell it off since the brass etc. are so easy to come by.
Question though, what is the headstamp on that ammo? Is it like the old Kynoch light cordite with the "L C" stamped on it? If so, I would be more inclined to keep some of it.




I don't think any more commentary is necessary - very succinctly put Huvius!
And yes we would most definitely like to see the results for this one when you can please.
Oh and by the way, how are the loads working out for your William Evans 500BPE?


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buckstix
.400 member


Reged: 07/11/12
Posts: 1243
Loc: Whitetail Country
Re: A Vintage 1872 W.W. Greener 450 3-1/4" bpe Double Rifle [Re: 93x64mm]
      #320976 - 27/10/18 08:05 AM

Quote:

Another nice pick up and it sounds like you got into it quite reasonably.
So many of these rifles are overlooked - the general hunting public assuming they are obsolete and ineffective.
I'm sure you will get the best out of it (you have a knack for that) and I applaud you for getting out and working up loads for all of these rifles you are collecting.
As for the ammo, I think I would sell it off since the brass etc. are so easy to come by.
Question though, what is the headstamp on that ammo? Is it like the old Kynoch light cordite with the "L C" stamped on it? If so, I would be more inclined to keep some of it.



Hello Huvius,

Thanks for the reply.

Head stamp on the 450 3-1/4" Nitro for Black Kynoch ammo is "KYNOCH" over "450".
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Quote:

I don't think any more commentary is necessary - very succinctly put Huvius!
And yes we would most definitely like to see the results for this one when you can please.
Oh and by the way, how are the loads working out for your William Evans 500BPE?



Hello 93x64mm

Thanks for the reply

Here's one of the William Evans test targets. A work in progress. For some reason it really likes the heavy bullets.



--------------------
"You never pay too much for something, you only buy it too early."


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kkeller
.224 member


Reged: 18/05/14
Posts: 16
Loc: Michigan Tip 'O The Mitt
Re: A Vintage 1872 W.W. Greener 450 3-1/4" bpe Double Rifle [Re: buckstix]
      #322273 - 08/12/18 12:06 AM

Beautiful!

--------------------
KKeller
I have become comfortably numb.


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buckstix
.400 member


Reged: 07/11/12
Posts: 1243
Loc: Whitetail Country
Re: A Vintage 1872 W.W. Greener 450 3-1/4" bpe Double Rifle [Re: kkeller]
      #322491 - 15/12/18 11:43 PM

Quote:

Beautiful!



Hello kkeller,

Thanks for the reply.

--------------------
"You never pay too much for something, you only buy it too early."


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