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JPK
.375 member


Reged: 31/08/04
Posts: 734
Loc: Chevy Chase, MD
Re: More shooting with my Thys 458 [Re: 4seventy]
      #29933 - 23/04/05 03:41 PM

In a post subsequent to this post I related that loading using New Guy's technique worked smoothly and without issues. I don't quite understand why, when using his technique, the belt issue disapears but it does.

It isn't quite as fast as just dropping them in but its close and easy and with just a bit of drill would easily become second nature. The ejector clips are always in the same position relative to the action or say the barrels so its not like you have to hunt for them to push them down as you slide in fresh rounds. I actually tried it while jogging between shots, loading on the run from my cartridge belt. Felt kind of silly running around but figured that if I could do it on the run I could do it anytime. I've now shot thirty rounds doing this and even without prechambering rounds to weed out any misfits I've had not a single issue.

This rifle will probably end up a 450NE 3 1/4" at some point but between now and my Oct Zimbabwe trip it will most likely stay 458 since I can easily and cheaply shoot the shit out of it and can become thouroughly accustomed to it.

JPK


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4seventy
Sponsor


Reged: 07/05/03
Posts: 2210
Loc: Queensland Australia
Re: More shooting with my Thys 458 [Re: JPK]
      #29959 - 24/04/05 08:51 AM

JPK,
Glad to hear that you seem to be having a win with the chambering.

Don't get me wrong on this one.
If that rifle was mine the LAST thing I'd want to do is rechamber it to a flanged case.
I'd be busting my butt to get the gun working properly with the 458 cartridge.
Why?
To start with I hate changing the originality of a double unless there is NO alternative.
This is especially true with high quality guns like Marcel Thys.
I've been a fan of the 458 Win for a long time and have done a fair amount of shooting with that cartridge in bolt rifles.
I've always wanted a double in 458.
Came close a few years back.

I'd love to own a Thys 458 in the Holland style.

But......When the pressure is on, and a fast reload is required, I want to be able to just drop the rounds in, and shut the gun without worrying about any possible jamups.
This is a piece of piss with a flanged cartridge and even a poorly built gun can achieve it.
With a belted case, it may not happen quite so easily and the whole extractor/ejector system needs to be as slick as,
well, as slick as a very slick thing!


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JPK
.375 member


Reged: 31/08/04
Posts: 734
Loc: Chevy Chase, MD
Re: More shooting with my Thys 458 [Re: 4seventy]
      #29960 - 24/04/05 09:50 AM

Allan,

Maybe because I'm a lefty and have to change so many guns to make them fit, I don't really hold originality in any real regard. I keep it mind only because others do and what I want to do to a gun might knock down its percieved originality and therefore value to some in the market. Even then I usually say screw it and do what needs to be done to make it right for me.

With this rifle I think the same way. Its got a right hand stock which for some unknown reason works fine for me. Even though its got some cast off, about 1/4" at the heel, if I mount the gun the bead is in the v. I will probably restock it at some point but there is no urgency at all.

On the chambering, I go back and forth. New Guy's technique really does work and its quick and easy. I've got a few videos here with guys hunting with doubles and it seems to me that my reload is on the same pace, even when I'm feeling silly and doing it on the run to give myself every opportunity to fumble.

Yea the 458 is a higher pressure round but the gun is built of modern steel. I'm waiting for one of our really hot summer days to leave the gun and ammo in the sun to see if any issues arise.

I was skeptical of the ejection but seems all is fine. Again waiting for that summer day. Dust is an issue thats been raised and there is no way to replace the real thing there.

Ammo is relatively cheap and readily available even in Africa I hear. Has any of it regulated? No, but the current Federals are pretty close and shoot at least within a five inch group at 50yds with rights and lefts and softs and solids all centered on the bull and maybe an inch high. I can't currently shoot well enough to do better and know from JJ's shooting the rifle that it can do much better. The Federal softs cross abot two inches at 50 and the solids don't and are about two inches apart at 50.

I'm sure handloads can be found that would bring out the best. No 500 or 510gr load I've shot or JJ shot has had a center of group more than three inches from POA at 50 yds.

Would 450NE be more ideal, yes and someday this rifle will get there. But in the meantime Ammo cost and availabilty let me shoot it alot as a 458 which I think is right now the critical thing.

Also since 458 ammo is pretty available in Africa the lost ammo issue isn't so bad.

As in life there seem to be good and bad point on both sides of the issue. When I bought the rifle I was an adherent to the "no rimless or rimless belted cartridge DGR" school of thought and thought I was just buying a very nice platform for a 450NE conversion. Now I'm leaning the other way since all seems to function well as a 458. Still need some scortching weather and some dust. I'll take it against buff as is unless the unexpected happens with the heat test. I always strive for the ideal so no matter the results I'll probably rechamber but not till I've put another three or four hundred rounds through it before my Oct safari and that might leave me looking for another rifle in 458 or 375 rimless to shoot alot cheaply and easily with ammo available down the street at the local dealer.

Thanks for your thought

JPK


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AussieMike
.300 member


Reged: 01/09/04
Posts: 236
Loc: Southern Tablelands, NSW, Aust...
Re: More shooting with my Thys 458 [Re: JPK]
      #29972 - 24/04/05 03:26 PM

I you're like me and really want to use your own rifle on the hunt (and I suspect you are, from the work your doing in preparation) the 458 has one big advantage - if your ammo goes missing you can easily buy more in country.

I've only taken my rifles to Africa once and Qantas managed to off load my rifles in Jo'berg even though I was booked through to Harare and it was the same plane. Took 3-4 days to get the gear back - luckily I'd booked five days sightseeing before my hunt, so it was ok.

I've got a trip booked for next year and plan on taking my 470WR and I'd like to take either my 9.3x64 bolt or 9.3x74R drilling as scoped back up rifle, but I'd really prefer to have at least one rifle with easily available ammo so will probably settle on my 458. I want to know I can get ammo for at least one of my rifles in country.

After the amount of practice you will have done by Oct I'll bet you'll be a lot less likely to fumble a reload than the average bloke with a 450 or 470.


mike


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JPK
.375 member


Reged: 31/08/04
Posts: 734
Loc: Chevy Chase, MD
Re: More shooting with my Thys 458 [Re: AussieMike]
      #29988 - 24/04/05 11:55 PM

AussieMike,

We definitely share a strong desire to be hunting with our own rifles and for me its nearly an imperitive since I'm a lefty. On the second rifle front I'm going to be taking my lefty bolt in 375H&H. Should any unforseen issues crop up with my double it will fill in just fine and from what I've read and been told will work for all else even if unnessecary for some of the game. Ammo is apparently universal. Also I've spent a great deal of time and money on my rifles and shotguns and though I can make do in a pinch, some of the enjoyment is lost and I never really feel comfortable or at ease using an unfamiliar gun and I don't shoot as well either.

If my double were any of the hard to find calibers I would do the same since the 375H&H (or 375 Weatherby, if you prefer, since in the case of lost ammo can be used with locally aquired 375H&H ammo) seems to get strong endorsement as the most versatile do everything rifle in Africa, even the world.

JPK


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