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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Big Bore Rifles

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buckstix
.400 member


Reged: 07/11/12
Posts: 1243
Loc: Whitetail Country
JACK LOTT MAUSER - HELP WANTED FINDING INFO - .458 WM
      #287855 - 14/09/16 10:28 PM

JACK LOTT MAUSER - HELP WANTED FINDING INFO - .458 WM

I just purchased this rifle, and I'm researching its History. Here is the Ad describing the rifle.

".....For sale is a .458 Win Mag built on a 1917 Oberndorf Mauser action by noted gunsmith J. P. Lott. This rifle was previously owned at one time by former Guns and Ammo editor Howard French. Unfortunately, the provenance to support this was lost by the estate of the owner before me. There was a pile of correspondence and pictures of dead African animals, taken by Mr. French. The rifle is however documented on page 80 of “Big Bore Rifles” by Jack Lott. There are three pictures of the rifle and the caption describes the custom, return to zero scope mounts.
...
The rifle is built on a 1917 Oberndorf action chambered in standard .458 Win Mag. The action interior is highly polished and the bolt runs very smoothly. Feeding is exceptionally smooth and it will feed empty cases and loaded ammo with no hesitations. The bolt is fitted with a two position M70 style safety and a custom checkered bolt handle which gives excellent purchase, but is not overly rough like some I’ve seen. The floorplate assembly is a non-hinged military style. The front of the floorplate is finely checked to give a good grip when sliding it back for removal. The trigger looks like the original Mauser unit and is serial numbered to match the action, as are the floorplate and bolt stop. The trigger is quite crisp and breaks at 4.5 lbs. The scope mounts, as described in the “Big Bore Rifle” article are customized Sako units on custom bases. Near as I can tell, the dovetails are parallel on both front and back and the width of the normal wider front Sako. Similar to a Talley mount, but with a wider dovetail. It appears he milled the Sako rings to match the bases. The front base is soldered to the barrel and the tops of both bases are stippled to reduce glare if using the iron sights. The barrel mounted sights consist of a three-leaf express type rear sight on a boss that also has a recoil lug inlet to the stock. This boss appears to be a separate piece soldered to the barrel. There is a mid-barrel band for a sling mount. The front sight is a stippled ramp holding a generous blade with what appears to be a square ivory insert. The front sight hood swivels away and is held in place via a spring loaded plunger. Bore is in great condition. I have not shot the rifle so cannot comment on accuracy but it is obvious that it has been used and taken care of. There is some bluing loss on the barrel near the band, most likely from being held there with the rifle over the shoulder while walking. The stock is a nice but not particularly fancy piece of dense walnut with a pleasing reddish hue. The barreled action is closely fit to the stock and appears to be skim bedded from the front sight base back to the mag box. There are no cracks in the wood I can find. The grip cap appears to be sculpted horn and the fore end tip ebony. It is fitted with a red Pachmayr Old English pad that is still in good shape. LOP is 13 7/8”. Weight of the rifle is unknown but probably between 8.5 – 9.0 lbs.
...
The top of the bolt shroud has a few scratches in it. There are a few bumps and bruises on the stock, but nothing too deep...."


.

It is very unfortunate that one of the prior owner's family members unwittingly discarded all the photos and papers that originally came with this rifle when it was sold. Those provided the provenance of this rifle being built by Jack Lott "for" G&A editor Howard French.

I'm sure I will spend untold hours searching through my collection of Guns & Ammo Annuals to see if I can find any photos of this rifle in French's hands. I also plan on contacting G&A to see if they might have photos in their archives.

The minute I saw this rifle, I knew it needed to own it. It has many of the features reminiscent of the English Safari rifles of the early days. My pictures below, really don't do it justice. Its far more impressive in person.













In lew of the lost provenance photos and letters, the articles I've been finding as references serves as definative proof that my rifle belonged to Mr. French, and was built by Jack Lott.

Perhaps some of you members can find additional articles that show my rifle, and will help with my research.

These pictures are from an article in the 1986 Gun Digest Hunting Annual. Although the pictures in the article are very dark with low resolution, all the rifle's features match, and there is no doubt this is is the same rifle.








The rifle is topped with the same Weaver scope in "Quick Detatchable" Sako rings (modified by Lott) that French had on the rifle when he owned it.



These pictures come from the 1983 G&A book "Big Bore Rifle", by Jack Lott.





The rifle's History is slowly being puzzled together. Today I found a couple more references to this rifle's build in the 1984 Gun Digest.

The first picture shows Jack Lott shooting a 458 model 70. And, right above him is a picture of my rifle. The picture shows the rifle before the scope blocks were fabricated.

The second picture shows my rifle's barrel unfinished, "in the white", during construction.





And here is another reference found.



.
.

As I said previous, I'm hoping some of you members can find additional articles that show my rifle, and will help with my research.

.


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FrankFarmer
.300 member


Reged: 06/08/06
Posts: 172
Loc: Florida USA.
Re: JACK LOTT MAUSER - HELP WANTED FINDING INFO - .458 WM [Re: buckstix]
      #287859 - 15/09/16 12:08 AM

“Research is creating new knowledge.” -Neil Armstrong

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Wanabebwana
.300 member


Reged: 11/01/13
Posts: 221
Loc: Canada
Re: JACK LOTT MAUSER - HELP WANTED FINDING INFO - .458 WM [Re: FrankFarmer]
      #287879 - 15/09/16 12:25 PM

If you look at the grain on the right side of the butt you will see that the rifle matches those in the picture. Like a fingerprint. Every other detail matches as well but the grain shows that it is the rifle featured in the magazine and not another one like it.

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gryphon
.450 member


Reged: 01/01/03
Posts: 5487
Loc: Sambar ground/Victoria/Austral...
Re: JACK LOTT MAUSER - HELP WANTED FINDING INFO - .458 WM [Re: Wanabebwana]
      #287883 - 15/09/16 02:09 PM

Well no matter what you have a Lott!

Treasure!

--------------------
Get off the chair away from the desk and get out in the bush and enjoy life.


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buckstix
.400 member


Reged: 07/11/12
Posts: 1243
Loc: Whitetail Country
Re: JACK LOTT MAUSER - HELP WANTED FINDING INFO - .458 WM [Re: gryphon]
      #287890 - 15/09/16 09:45 PM

Quote:

“Research is creating new knowledge.” -Neil Armstrong




Hello FrankFarmer,
Thanks for the reply.
Very True

.
.

Quote:

If you look at the grain on the right side of the butt you will see that the rifle matches those in the picture. Like a fingerprint. Every other detail matches as well but the grain shows that it is the rifle featured in the magazine and not another one like it.




Hello Wanabebwana,
Thanks for the reply.
Yes, it matches exactly

.
.

Quote:

Well no matter what you have a Lott!

Treasure!




Hello gryphon,
Thanks for the reply.
Yes, I "do" have a Lott.

--------------------
"You never pay too much for something, you only buy it too early."


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93x64mm
.416 member


Reged: 07/12/11
Posts: 4198
Loc: Nth QLD Australia
Re: JACK LOTT MAUSER - HELP WANTED FINDING INFO - .458 WM [Re: buckstix]
      #287906 - 16/09/16 06:58 AM

Buckstix,
I have a copy of the Big Bore Rifles by Jack Lott - far worse condition than that shown but is in .pdf form.
Some of the photos shown in your initial post are there in it & as Wanabebwana said the grain on the stock matches so I reckon you have the original .458.
Shame about the original papers!
Great find mate, but boy she'd kick at 9lbs!
93x64mm


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buckstix
.400 member


Reged: 07/11/12
Posts: 1243
Loc: Whitetail Country
Re: JACK LOTT MAUSER - HELP WANTED FINDING INFO - .458 WM [Re: 93x64mm]
      #287926 - 16/09/16 02:57 PM

Quote:

Buckstix,
I have a copy of the Big Bore Rifles by Jack Lott - far worse condition than that shown but is in .pdf form.
Some of the photos shown in your initial post are there in it & as Wanabebwana said the grain on the stock matches so I reckon you have the original .458.
Shame about the original papers!
Great find mate, but boy she'd kick at 9lbs!
93x64mm




Hello 93x64mm

Thanks for the reply.

Well, kick? - it actually weighs only 8 pounds 2 ounces without the scope, and 9 pounds 1 ounce with the scope. However, the cut of the stock is pretty stright, and recoil is very manageable.

--------------------
"You never pay too much for something, you only buy it too early."


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FrankFarmer
.300 member


Reged: 06/08/06
Posts: 172
Loc: Florida USA.
Re: JACK LOTT MAUSER - HELP WANTED FINDING INFO - .458 WM [Re: buckstix]
      #287955 - 17/09/16 10:45 PM

For those who are unaware, the 458 Lott was invented and developed by Jacques (Jack) Lott. After serious injury from a Cape Buffalo charge that failed to stop with factory 458 ammo. Jack began testing the compressed factory 458 load, he found that the published factory ballistics were somewhat overenthusiastic. The actual velocity and energy were more in the 1900 fps. category than the advertised. Jack began experimenting with a lengthened case and more powder eventually providing us with a 458 wildcat that became the 458 Lott. Jack did much for the present interest in big bore rifles both magazine and doubles, he did several articles on modern smokeless loads for Cordite proofed Nitro Express calibers, he was a real asset to our passion and hobby. Wonderful find Buckstix!

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Homer
.416 member


Reged: 07/04/09
Posts: 3081
Loc: Canberra, Australia
Re: JACK LOTT MAUSER - HELP WANTED FINDING INFO - .458 WM [Re: FrankFarmer]
      #287972 - 18/09/16 10:23 AM

G'Day Fella's,

WOW Buckstix, thank you for sharing this bit of serious history with us!
Unfortunately, I'm not able to assist you with further info regarding this rifle.

Doh!
Homer

--------------------
"Beware the Lolly Pop of Mediocrity,
Lick it Once and You Will Suck Forever"


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buckstix
.400 member


Reged: 07/11/12
Posts: 1243
Loc: Whitetail Country
Re: JACK LOTT MAUSER - HELP WANTED FINDING INFO - .458 WM [Re: Homer]
      #287990 - 18/09/16 09:36 PM

Hello FrankFarmer,

Thanks for your reply.

Jack actually worked on several wildcat 45 cal cartridges with greater case capacity than the 458 WM, but only the 458 Lott that bears his name, has survived to this day.

.
.

Hello Homer,

Thanks for the reply.

I love guns with History and Stories to tell, and this one's Story is starting to come together.

--------------------
"You never pay too much for something, you only buy it too early."


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458Win
.333 member


Reged: 15/12/06
Posts: 340
Loc: Alaska
Re: JACK LOTT MAUSER - HELP WANTED FINDING INFO - .458 WM [Re: FrankFarmer]
      #288199 - 22/09/16 12:01 PM

Quote:

For those who are unaware, the 458 Lott was invented and developed by Jacques (Jack) Lott. After serious injury from a Cape Buffalo charge that failed to stop with factory 458 ammo. Jack began testing the compressed factory 458 load, he found that the published factory ballistics were somewhat overenthusiastic. The actual velocity and energy were more in the 1900 fps. category than the advertised. Jack began experimenting with a lengthened case and more powder eventually providing us with a 458 wildcat that became the 458 Lott. Jack did much for the present interest in big bore rifles both magazine and doubles, he did several articles on modern smokeless loads for Cordite proofed Nitro Express calibers, he was a real asset to our passion and hobby. Wonderful find Buckstix!




Actually if you read Jack's own account in the pictured Big Bore Edition of G&A you will see that he wrote glowingly about the 458 and how it was his poor shooting that caused the incident and that in the hands of his PH, Wally Johnson, the 458 saved his life. Jack was both editor and writer of the issue.
Jack also claimed that all he wanted when he developed the 458 Lott was to achieve the identical 2150 fps that was advertised in the standard 458 but was difficult to acheive with the powders at that time. Today it is no problem getting an honest 2200 fps with the standard 458

--------------------
Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either never used one - or else is unwittingly commenting on their marksmanship
Phil Shoemaker
www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com


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Rockdoc
.400 member


Reged: 07/12/06
Posts: 1213
Loc: NSW, Australia
Re: JACK LOTT MAUSER - HELP WANTED FINDING INFO - .458 WM [Re: 458Win]
      #288204 - 22/09/16 07:16 PM

Jack also experienced bullet failure on that hunt which allowed the 'fun' to continue!

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buckstix
.400 member


Reged: 07/11/12
Posts: 1243
Loc: Whitetail Country
Re: JACK LOTT MAUSER - HELP WANTED FINDING INFO - .458 WM [Re: 458Win]
      #288208 - 22/09/16 10:19 PM

Quote:

Actually if you read Jack's own account in the pictured Big Bore Edition of G&A you will see that he wrote glowingly about the 458 and how it was his poor shooting that caused the incident and that in the hands of his PH, Wally Johnson, the 458 saved his life. Jack was both editor and writer of the issue.
Jack also claimed that all he wanted when he developed the 458 Lott was to achieve the identical 2150 fps that was advertised in the standard 458 but was difficult to acheive with the powders at that time. Today it is no problem getting an honest 2200 fps with the standard 458




Hello 458Win,

Thanks for your reply.

You are absolutely correct. Jack also worked on / developed other larger capacity 458 wildcat's in an attempt to obtain 2150+ fps.

--------------------
"You never pay too much for something, you only buy it too early."


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