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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Mauser Discussion Forum
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ducmarc
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68mm cartages'
      #287596 - 09/09/16 12:39 PM

Anyone shooting the 68mm cartages the 6.5 or 8mm ors a wildcat.the 6.5 has some interesting ballistics.

--------------------
'killed by death' Lemmy.. ' boil the dog ' Elvis Manywounds "my best friend is my magnum forty four" hank willams the third.

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szihn
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Re: 68mm cartages' [Re: ducmarc]
      #287598 - 09/09/16 02:12 PM

What?

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eagle27
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Re: 68mm cartages' [Re: ducmarc]
      #287602 - 09/09/16 04:40 PM

Quote:

Anyone shooting the 68mm cartages the 6.5 or 8mm ors a wildcat.the 6.5 has some interesting ballistics.



The 6.5x68 will have similar performance to the 264 Win Magnum generally recognised as a good long range sheep and deer cartridge.

A German friend of mine used the 8x68 which would be close in performance to the 8mm Rem Magnum. He used his 8mm on red deer and chamois.

I have not used either of those cartridges myself but they would perform as good as the more common 7mm Rem Magnum or or 300 Win Magnum cartridges both of which give about as good as it gets on hoofed game.

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DarylS
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Re: 68mm cartages' [Re: eagle27]
      #287609 - 09/09/16 06:07 PM

I chambered up a 6.5x68S on a 6.5x55 Model 38 1945 IIRC & yes the action is a little short) This one had a decent barrel, but it was .266" groove to groove and I think standeard 23.4" long or was it 24.3"?

Using a slightly reduced (from my buddies 6.5x68 load) load of H870, I was able to drive 129gr. Hornady SP at a respectable 3,200fps. This load gave me 1 1/2" groups at 100 meters with a 3-9x32 scope.

The only animals I shot with this rifle were 2 snowshoes hares, 1st at 200 yards, second at 210yards - with the same bullet/shot - a double kill. They were perfectly in line on the road ahead of Keith's stopped truck. I said to Keith my hunting buddy - 2 for one? He said "lets see it". "POW"!

We paced it off and and revealing the bullet which actually appeared not to expand initially, went through both shoulders of the first bunny (standing) making a 1" hole, both sides, hit and bounced off the road 1/2 way to the second then fragmenting and took the second with possible bullet fragments and stones from the road. He was peppered along one side. They had been crouched, facing opposite directions.

Yeah - good round!

I spotted (25x Spotting Scope) Keith on a bull calf elk down in elkford in the 1980's using his 6.5x68 Model 1917 Enfield. 1st round through the lights - 250yards. Lung tissue flew out both entrance and exit wounds. ALL of the elk ran 30 yards and stopped, milling around. When the target calf was clear, the second shot - same placement - perfect lung shot.
Again, bloody-tissue and liquid out both entrance hole and exit. Again the elk ran 20 to 30 yards and stopped. The calk hung his head down, then dropped. Sometimes they just don't know they are dead. Elk can be tough.
This was a late December special draw hunt.

The little 250 pounder (dressed) had a 5" hole through & through both sides. No shoulder muscle/meat damage, just rib meat- about 8" diameter - both sides. He was a decent size for a calf - with 2 1/2" high, hair covered "protrubences" for horns.

Keith was driving the 129's at 3,300fps from a 24" bl. using H870.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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jgrabow
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Re: 68mm cartages' [Re: DarylS]
      #287622 - 10/09/16 04:19 AM

NECG carries RWS loaded ammo for both the 6.5x68 and 8x68s.

I have an FN Mauser Deluxe 270 Win that was rebarreled to 8x68s.
I'm getting about 2850 MV (24" barrel) using Norma brass, Federal #215 primers and MRP powder in front of a Nosler 200gr Partition. The bullet is seated deep due to mazagine length. I have not hunted with this rifle yet.

I have a 1941 6.5x68 Schuler mode by Christoph Funk. I haven't reloaded for it yet but I will soon.

I purchased one box each of RWS 6.5x68 w/93 gr bullet and 6.5x68 w/127 gr bullet from NECG.

The MV of the 93 gr bullet is listed on the box as 3,770 ft/s. I chronographed three rounds: 3,362, 3,347 & 3,383.

The MV of the 127 gr bullet is listed on the box as 3,150 ft/s. I chronographed three rounds: 3,069, 3,060 & 3,053.

I was really disappointed with the 93 gr MV.

I have Hirtenberger 6.5x68 w/123 gr bullets. These chronographed at 2,838, 2,969 & 2,919.

RWS 6.5x68 w/93 gr bullet


RWS 6.5x68 w/127 gr bullet


RWS 93 and 127 gr and Hirtenberger 123 gr rounds


--------------------
Jim

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DarylS
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Re: 68mm cartages' [Re: jgrabow]
      #287637 - 10/09/16 11:01 AM

You should be able to do a better with the 6.5x68S than those factory ammo speeds. It will duplicate the .264 Mag.

The standard rate of twist at a normal 12" is pretty slow, even for 127's I'd think.

I found my old data - funny how the mind can play tricks - it was a 29" bl. I thought I was getting 3,200fps with the 129 Hornady, but it was with the 125gr. Nosler that I beat 3,200fps with safe pressures- from all I could ascertain.

129 Hornady SP OAL 3.440" test 28 May 1987

70.0gr. H870 - CCI250 - Base .5208 - .52125" 4-shot group .351"

72.0gr. H870 - CCI250 - base .5215 - .5219" - 2,9992fps 4 shot group .977" ESpread 25.7fps

74.0gr. H870 - CCI250 - base .5210 - .5220" - 3,072fps
4 shot group 1.000"
5 shot group 1,645"
ESpreaqd 10.6fps

If your rifle will shoot the 125 Nosler Partition, that is the bullet I'd use. With that bullet in my re-chambered model 96.

74.0gr. H870 with CCI250 ran 3,175fps 3.435"OAL - 1.1" group @ 100 meters. 40.3fps ESpread - Web expansion .521750 -.52225"

75.0gr. H870 with CCI250 ran 3,175fps(same speed & OAL)Web expansion .52175" - .52225" - 11.3fps ESpread -

76/0gr. H870 with CCI250 ran 3,241fps. The barrel was hot when I shot these - web expansion same .52150 - 52225 ESpread 51.0fps

The 'old' barrel was rough inside (though a good shooting barrel) so I bought a new barrel from Numrich, according to my book - 29" and brand new.

I barreled up my action and chambered it with the same reamer.

125 Nosler started too high with H4831 - 65.0gr. went 3,445fps with web at .52475" OVER MAX - try 60.0gr. and work from there.

Same bullet.

75.5gr.H870 CCI250 - OAL 3.260" - 3,291fps - 85.0fps ESpread
.52325" - .52425"
76.5gr.H870 CCI250 - OAL 3.275" - 3,320fps - 33.2fps ESpread
Web .5240" even all the way around
78/5gr.H870 CCI250 - OAL 3.375" - 3,393fps - 34.0fps ESpread
MAX - felt hot - Web still .5240" even all the way around

will edit as time allows.

OK - super is over- the rest of the story

-18C - 0F - 76.0gr. H870 CCI250 OAl - 3,275" still 125 Nosler Partition
group 1.990" - 3,249fps - 64.2fps ESpread -

Note - 140gr Speer - all bullets broke up in flight or disintegrated - when holes appears in the 100yard target, it was only the base 1/2 of the bullet. They did not like the 8" or slightly faster twist- obviously.

139gr. Norma 74.0gr. H870 CCI250 - 2,945fps - 1.945"

139gr. Norma 76.0gr. H870 CCI250 - ???????? - 2.800"

May 1988 - shortened the barrel from 29" to 28 1/2" to get rid of the threads and re-crown.

note - OAL of 3.4" will allow 2-shot operation plus unfired shell ejecting.

note- found vertical stringing on some loads - usually primer or powder related. Keith noted same and said a switch to Fed 215's solved that. Today, CCI250's are supposed to be the equivalence of the old Fed 215's.

Made a note that poor overall shooting for such a nice looking barrel was likely due to short OAL's (deep seating) trying for 2-shot operation - one in the chamber, one in mag. under the bolt.

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rigbymauser
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Re: 68mm cartages' [Re: DarylS]
      #287647 - 10/09/16 05:39 PM




Edited by rigbymauser (10/09/16 05:45 PM)

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Rule303
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Reged: 05/07/09
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Re: 68mm cartages' [Re: rigbymauser]
      #287649 - 10/09/16 09:42 PM

I have a 8X68s on a M17 action. I have not had the opportunity to test on game as yet but hope to rectify this in November.

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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: 68mm cartages' [Re: Rule303]
      #287662 - 11/09/16 06:28 AM

Three 68mm cartridges:
6.5x68;
8x68S; &
10.75x68.

The 10.75x68 is a different case from the first two.

I have a Mauser M03 in 8x68S and 6.5x65mm RWS. I did want the 6.5x68mm but Mauser does not make an M03 barrel in that chambering.

Embarrassed to say I have not used either M03 barrel and worked up any loads yet!!! But have used my .222 Rem and .404 barrels for the M03 a reasonable amount so far.

I have used a 8x68S Mauser M98 borrowed from Karl Stumpfe to hunt on safari in Namibia and took warthog, gemsbok, hartebeest and springbok with it, as well as using my 9.3x74R for some of the animals, mainly some of the warthog from memory with the 9.3.

From this small amount of use, I liked the cartridge so decided to acquire one. My purpose in borrowing Karl's rifle was to try a 8x68S out in the field. It hot hard and well. I am looking forward to finally setting it up and using it a lot more later in the year.

And also seeing if the 6.5x65mm RWS can achieve close to similar ballistics to the 68mm. The 6.5x68 and also really the 8x68S in my opinion do need a longer barrel to fully utilise the large cases. My barrels I think are both 650mm or thereabouts. Need to measure them again to familiarise myself. A 26" or at least a 25" is the minimum I would go for.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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ducmarc
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Re: 68mm cartages' [Re: NitroX]
      #288415 - 28/09/16 03:42 AM

Was there ever a wildcat in 9x68?

--------------------
'killed by death' Lemmy.. ' boil the dog ' Elvis Manywounds "my best friend is my magnum forty four" hank willams the third.

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93mouse
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Re: 68mm cartages' [Re: ducmarc]
      #288419 - 28/09/16 06:12 AM

8×68mm S case is the parent case for .375 Hölderlin (9.5×68mm).

Well I had and still have my share in shooting 8x68S. I was shooting it for couple of years then 8S gave way to the 9.3x62 for some time since my usual shooting distances were pretty close + I was constantly available for tracking wounded game so short barreled 9.3 (50 cm 9.3 barrel compared to 62.5cm on 8x68s)was just more appropriate. Since my dog is getting older and my tracking days are comming to and end 8x68s has found its way back and I must say I am increasingly impressed with every shot I make.

In general as John said - it shoots hard and well + it shoots flat and it feeds super slick. The biggest problem was finding appropriate bullet for its velocities. RWS was making a great KS (Cone Point) bullet back in 60's - it was nickel plated steel jacket one and it performed fine. It was later discontinued and replaced by copper/zn jacket - as can be seen on jgrabow's 6.5 pic (middle one) - while deadly accurate (usually all bullets shot great in 8x68S and a proper load isn't hard to find) it was too soft for the job.

Later on (70's), Hirtenberger began to load ABC bullet - see jgrabow's 6.5 pic (the one on the right). ABC bullet was (as far as i know) the very first x-type bullet and paired with fast calibers like 8x68S new dawn began.

Loaded with Woodleigh Hydros I wouldn't mind using it on all the game - Cape Buffalo and Elephant included.

It is trully a great calliber with bigest game over long distances in mind. It realy hits hard and kills fast - by all means faster than 9.3x62. Wher animal can make some strides when shot with 9.3, it is usually dead on the spot shot with 8x68S - since both calibers operate with almost the same energy (9.3 based on weight 8 based on velocity), maybe it is velocity thing I don't know.

Great for bears and should be perfect for big cats IMO.

It does on occasions behaves oddly - I shot my last stag with it through both shoulders and found the bullet just under the hide on the exit side. It was shot at 7m - I believe if it was shot at 30 meters or more bullet would definitely exit.

Pic of the bullet - CDP Blaser 196gr (mix between Barnes x and A frame) factory load going 3100 fps.

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Rolf
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Re: 68mm cartages' [Re: 93mouse]
      #288439 - 29/09/16 05:14 AM

Gentlemen,

after advice from NE forum I used the 8x68S in a Mauser 98 rifle for plains game hunting in Namibia.

I hunted (and collected) wildebeest, zebra, springbok and oryx in distances between 80 meters and 340 meters,using the 200grs Accubond for zebra and oryx and the 200grs Swift A-Frame for wildebeest and another springbok. The bullets were accurate, provided exit wounds and performed very good, if the shooter was doing his part...

If the rifle is buildt to your specifications in a Mauser 98 standard system, I would recommend to lengthen the magazine box to a possible cartridge length of about 92mm. In a standard chamber throat the bullets can be seated out to 90 - 91mm, which seems to improve precision.

regards
Rolf

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Rule303
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Re: 68mm cartages' [Re: Rolf]
      #288444 - 29/09/16 07:00 AM

Rolf, thanks for the info.

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