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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Big Bore Rifles
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hunta223rem
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Reged: 18/03/14
Posts: 15
Loc: new zealand
458 win mag to ?
      #264777 - 10/05/15 10:24 AM

hi guys
I have a cz550 magnum in 458 win mag
was wondering whats the biggest .458 caliber round the gun could be rechambered in?
any ideas advice greatly appreciated
cheers

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Huvius
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Reged: 04/11/07
Posts: 3556
Loc: Colorado
Re: 458 win mag to ? [Re: hunta223rem]
      #264779 - 10/05/15 10:44 AM

I would say that the 450 Rigby would be the biggest logical choice.

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DarylS
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Reged: 10/08/05
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Re: 458 win mag to ? [Re: hunta223rem]
      #264780 - 10/05/15 10:46 AM

if the action is the same size and I fully think it is - as the ZKK602 - the .460 Weatherby is entirely possible if you want to be stuck with that case size. Would the .375 Ultra Mag be larger?

A person who I knew back in the 70's bought a .375 ZKK 602 BRNO - pulled the .375 barrel never fired (I bought it for $100.00 to re-barrel my .358 NMag.BRNO602)

He then had the action barreled up in .500 Barnes Supreme (on the blown-out .460 case), action work done and bolt opened up. It kicked too much for me - something like 120gr. of IMR3031 with a 600gr. Barnes IIRC - spun me around like a weather-cock. THAT part I well remember.
1/2 hour later, after recovering from that one shot, I went back to shooting my now .375H&H ZKK 602 and it felt like a triple deuce, compared to that bloody .50.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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93x64mm
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Reged: 07/12/11
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Re: 458 win mag to ? [Re: DarylS]
      #264788 - 10/05/15 03:45 PM

hunta223rem
The 458 Lott would be the logical choice - however if you want something different, try the 460 G&A a full blown .404 case necked up to .458 calibre to use the full length of the magazine!
Just my 2 cents worth
93x64mm

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eagle27
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Reged: 24/01/09
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Re: 458 win mag to ? [Re: 93x64mm]
      #264791 - 10/05/15 06:50 PM

Staying with a chambering in the CZ550 where both the 458WinMag and the 458Lott can still be fired, what is wrong with the 458 3"Express? According to a Kiwi hunter here this chambering is just the ticket for elephant based on his experience with his CZ550 that he has transformed from the original 458WinMag through 458Lott to the ultimate 458Express, taking elephant with all three.

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speed
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Reged: 28/03/15
Posts: 15
Loc: alberta canada
Re: 458 win mag to ? [Re: eagle27]
      #264807 - 11/05/15 03:24 AM

I've often wondered why the .460W isn't more popular in rechambered CZ's.
Lots of case capacity, factory ammo is widely available and low pressures if loaded down
to 2400 fps.
Oh yeah ,it kicks pretty hard.

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Caprivi
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Reged: 30/09/08
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Re: 458 win mag to ? [Re: speed]
      #264809 - 11/05/15 04:45 AM

I have had 3 of them, 1 old 602 rechambered to 458-3" express, one CZ rechambered to Lott and a factory CZ in Lott. I have rechambered the CZ's to .378 and .460wby as well. They will indeed work and feed fine. The 450Rigby and the 460wby are the same thing, sans the belt.

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To live life as it is handed to me from God

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Buster95
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Reged: 01/11/10
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Re: 458 win mag to ? [Re: Caprivi]
      #264936 - 14/05/15 10:02 AM

Maybe a dumb question but the bolt face of a CZ 550 in 458 win mag need to be opened up for the 460 weatherby or 450 Rigby?

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Rule303
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Reged: 05/07/09
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Re: 458 win mag to ? [Re: Buster95]
      #264943 - 14/05/15 11:54 AM

Quote:

Maybe a dumb question but the bolt face of a CZ 550 in 458 win mag need to be opened up for the 460 weatherby or 450 Rigby?



Not a dumb question but yes it would have to be opened up.

Edited by Rule303 (14/05/15 11:56 AM)

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Ash
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Re: 458 win mag to ? [Re: Rule303]
      #264954 - 14/05/15 05:53 PM

I'd go a .460 Weatherby, personally. They look pretty cool with the belt (which some hate). Been around awhile too.

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albertan
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Reged: 13/06/06
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Loc: Alberta, Canada
Re: 458 win mag to ? [Re: Ash]
      #265206 - 19/05/15 02:59 PM

.... another big bore rifle in a cartridge bigger than .458 Winchester. If the gun, as it is presently chambered feeds, extracts, and shoots well, leave it as you now have a back up if something goes wrong with its larger mate in the gun safe. This will be your civilized response to the anti-this and that's.

Just a thought.

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Rolf
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Reged: 26/02/07
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Re: 458 win mag to ? [Re: albertan]
      #265215 - 19/05/15 08:15 PM

Hello hunta223rem,

I was already in this situation and my Brno .458 Win. Mag became a .450 Rigby Rimless.

Reason for this: in the Win Mag configuration the rifle had feeding stoppages.

The rifle was rechambered without problems and proofed at the german proof house in Ulm.
Afterwards the cartridge feeding and the ejection port had to be modified and function improved.

I still think the long magazine of the Brno makes the 450 Rigby a very useful chambering in this rifle.
However, I feel that the Lott configuration would need less gunsmithing for feeding and has at least one cartridge more in the magazine.

best regards
Rolf

PS: I am astonished because of your nick (223 rem) in the NitroExpress-Forum... :-)

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Wanabebwana
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Reged: 11/01/13
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Re: 458 win mag to ? [Re: Rolf]
      #265277 - 20/05/15 02:55 PM

For reloaders, the 3.85" mag of the CZ 550 Magnum and the long throat of the .458 Win chamber allows loading .458 bullets such as the Barnes 450gr and 500gr TSX and the new Woodleigh Hydrostatics to a COL of greater than 3.6" giving the same powder capacity as the .458 Lott(with the same bullets).
For non reloaders the .458 Lott chamber is designed to also fire .458 Win ammo and only a simple reaming of the Win. chamber is required.
If the Lott does not kick hard enough. The action can be rechambered to .450 Rigby,.450 Dakota or .460 Weatherby. The rails ,bolt face and extractor need to be modified.
If that is not enough,in the .458 bore you can go up to the .458-577 Wells but there are extensive modifications required such as in line feeding.This is the largest capacity case for this caliber in a CZ 550 /BRNO 602 action. 500grs at 3000fps or 600gr at 2800fps. Not only will this chambering give you bragging rights but it will allow you to save on ammo by killing, if they are properly aligned, 3 elephants with a single shot.
Then there is the 50BMG upgrade. Have a custom 12 lb sporting rifle built and load some 600gr bullets backed up by 240grs of powder for 3100fps. You might want a muzzle brake on that one.

Edited by Wanabebwana (20/05/15 11:20 PM)

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DarylS
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Reged: 10/08/05
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Re: 458 win mag to ? [Re: Wanabebwana]
      #265315 - 21/05/15 12:50 AM

YIKES!!!!!!!!!!!!!

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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ozhunter
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Reged: 18/08/04
Posts: 1692
Loc: Sydney, Australia
Re: 458 win mag to ? [Re: DarylS]
      #265336 - 21/05/15 12:31 PM

I'll stick with my 450Mag ( the Winchester one). Not too excessive recoil firing the proven 480grn bullets at 2150fps and all within a handy sized and weighted rifle.

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Wanabebwana
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Reged: 11/01/13
Posts: 221
Loc: Canada
Re: 458 win mag to ? [Re: ozhunter]
      #265337 - 21/05/15 03:09 PM

Ozhunter what you are holding in your hands in the above pic is my definition of the perfect DGR. It is also a proper English classic design reminiscent of the Rigby with its open grip and short forend.
My ideal rifle would be built with a Mauser action and have a drop box mag for a 5+1 cartridge capacity with the magazine lengthened to 3.5" to accommodate the new generation of long solid copper bullets such as the Barnes TSX and the Woodleigh hydrostatically stabilized in 450 and 480grs.These bullets offer spectacular penetration and reliability at the cost of extending into the case and reducing powder capacity. The longer magazine would allow the bullets to be seated out to compensate for their length.It is not difficult to remove metal from the rear of the mag box and shave a little off the front to achieve this. A Woodleigh HS .458cal, 480gr is 1.466" long compared to 1.261" for a conventional 480gr. That's an extra .2" deep into the case. Allowing for a COL of 3.48" instead of the 3.34" standard would recoup .14" of powder space.
(Please note that .458 Win Mag chambers are designed with very long throats so that seating the bullets out is not an issue).
With these mods I believe the .458 Win Mag could be the optimal DG cartridge.Six quick controllable shots should do the job.
I own a 1960 Browning FN Safari and a CZ 550 American in this caliber and reload from .45-70 levels to max loads with 3.6" COL in the CZ. It makes an excellent short range(<150yd)bear moose and anything you can hit gun with the wide range of bullets available. You also get minimal meat destruction and a big wound channel and if you retrieve a solid copper bullet you can most likely reuse it.

Edited by Wanabebwana (21/05/15 03:14 PM)

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ovny
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Reged: 19/06/08
Posts: 591
Loc: Spain
Re: 458 win mag to ? [Re: Wanabebwana]
      #268347 - 22/07/15 08:28 PM

A question ... is it really necessary something bigger than a 458 Lott or 458 Express? I do not understand.

Ovni

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I am Spanish

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JabaliHunter
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Reged: 16/05/07
Posts: 1958
Loc: England
Re: 458 win mag to ? [Re: ovny]
      #268375 - 23/07/15 06:41 AM

No, but then it's not strictly necessary to have anything larger than a .458 win mag either

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ovny
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Reged: 19/06/08
Posts: 591
Loc: Spain
Re: 458 win mag to ? [Re: JabaliHunter]
      #268376 - 23/07/15 06:51 AM

Quote:

No, but then it's not strictly necessary to have anything larger than a .458 win mag either




As they are wanting to complicate your life.

Ovny.

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I am Spanish

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DarylS
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Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 27000
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Re: 458 win mag to ? [Re: ovny]
      #268393 - 23/07/15 08:42 AM

Oh yes - I needed to have a 14 bore rifle - and now I do.

Now, I NEED a 10 bore, an original this time, of course.

I dad a .458 mag. - too small. LOL, but in a ctg. gun, too big now. Thus, I needed a couple mediums, 9.3 and .375 and now I do. I still 'need' a 10 bore, preferably a side by side, unlike my "cheap single".

A person needs what they desire - anything is possible.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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ovny
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Reged: 19/06/08
Posts: 591
Loc: Spain
Re: 458 win mag to ? [Re: DarylS]
      #268483 - 24/07/15 09:39 PM

Whimsical lol

Ovni

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I am Spanish

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