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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Double Rifles

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drbd
.224 member

Reged: 29/11/11
Posts: 44
Loc: belgium

rebounding or non-rebounding?
#259890 - 03/02/15 08:03 AM

Dear all,

Could anyone tell me the difference between rebounding and non-rebounding hammers? Is there an external difference? Are there any practical implications?
Been doing some research on google but the issues remains.
Best,
Benny

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underlever
.300 member

Reged: 01/02/07
Posts: 164
Loc: N.S.W Australia

Re: rebounding or non-rebounding? [Re: drbd]
#259893 - 03/02/15 09:17 AM

The shape of the hammers are the same, but on a firearm with rebounding hammers after being fired the hammers bounce back off the firing pins to half cock, under power of the main spring, and allow you to open the gun with nothing else needing to be done. On non rebounding guns you need to manually put the hammers back at half cock before you can open the gun. Rebounding guns are just that little bit faster to use.
It was considered that big of an improvement that many guns built before the invention on the rebounding lock had the locks converted to rebounding at a later date.

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Huvius
.416 member

Reged: 04/11/07
Posts: 3556
Loc: Colorado

Re: rebounding or non-rebounding? [Re: underlever]
#259895 - 03/02/15 09:37 AM

Quote:

The shape of the hammers are the same, but on a firearm with rebounding hammers after being fired the hammers bounce back off the firing pins to half cock, under power of the main spring, and allow you to open the gun with nothing else needing to be done. On non rebounding guns you need to manually put the hammers back at half cock before you can open the gun. Rebounding guns are just that little bit faster to use.
It was considered that big of an improvement that many guns built before the invention on the rebounding lock had the locks converted to rebounding at a later date.

The hammers don't rebound all the way back to half-cock, but between fully down (striking the firing pin assembly) and half cock. Most hammer doubles with rebounding hammers and stalking safeties still must be brought to half-cock to apply the stalking safety, and then, safety off, must be brought to full-cock in order to fire.
One very good reason is that the firing pins are allowed to spring back away from the primer so when the gun is opened, there is no hindrance of the firing pins dragging out of the primers with the risk of damaging the pin tips.

--------------------
He who lives in the past is doomed to enjoy it.

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underlever
.300 member

Reged: 01/02/07
Posts: 164
Loc: N.S.W Australia

Re: rebounding or non-rebounding? [Re: Huvius]
#259914 - 03/02/15 06:19 PM

Had a quick check of my hammer doubles with rebounding locks and all only have two positions, where the rebound feature returns them to after firing and full cock. Two have stalking safeties and the other doesn't. Looks like there is only one thing that you can 100% sure of with British firearms; the wonderful variation that each maker produced.

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Huvius
.416 member

Reged: 04/11/07
Posts: 3556
Loc: Colorado

Re: rebounding or non-rebounding? [Re: underlever]
#259930 - 04/02/15 12:23 AM

Quote:

Looks like there is only one thing that you can 100% sure of with British firearms; the wonderful variation that each maker produced.

THAT'S for sure!
So, your guns with stalking safeties allow the safeties to operate at full-cock?
That certainly makes sense. I feel it sort of defeats the purpose of having "stalking" safeties if you have to bring the gun to full-cock still.
My Henry is like that... but on the other hand, now that I ponder this, one wouldn't want the safety to be used at full-cock just in case the hammer were to be tripped and then...BOOM! once the safety is let off!

--------------------
He who lives in the past is doomed to enjoy it.

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underlever
.300 member

Reged: 01/02/07
Posts: 164
Loc: N.S.W Australia

Re: rebounding or non-rebounding? [Re: Huvius]
#259943 - 04/02/15 07:53 AM

The safeties on mine, an Alex. Henry and a W.R Pape, can be applied when the the hammers are in the rebounded position. They must be pushed out of engagement to allow you to bring the hammers to full cock. I hunt a lot with these hammer rifles and I would love to find one with a tang safety. Many times I wished for such a rifle.

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drbd
.224 member

Reged: 29/11/11
Posts: 44
Loc: belgium

Re: rebounding or non-rebounding? [Re: underlever]
#259945 - 04/02/15 08:06 AM

Hello Underlever and Huvius,
thanks for the prompt reply!
Best regards,
Benny

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TH44
.375 member

Reged: 21/02/09
Posts: 734
Loc: West UK

Re: rebounding or non-rebounding? [Re: drbd]
#259949 - 04/02/15 09:55 AM

These may help

Non-rebounding Early .577, 1876 note the position of the hammers/strikers

I borrowed this pic from the previous post, 3dogMike, I hope you do not mind, shows similar hammer position

Rebounding, .450/400 X 3 1/4" late 1880's

Rebounding, H&H 8 bore Ball gun 1887

Rebounding, .577 3" late 1880s early 1890s

Rebounding, WR Cape rifle 577/450 + 12g 1901 (very surprised at this late date)

Rebounding lock hammers are usually clear of the strikers

TH44

Edited by TH44 (04/02/15 10:01 AM)

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mauserand9mm
.400 member

Reged: 03/09/09
Posts: 1041
Loc: Queensland, Australia

Re: rebounding or non-rebounding? [Re: TH44]
#259972 - 04/02/15 10:19 PM

I had a single shot once that had the half-cock safety but also an interlock that stopped the hammer going forward from the rebounded position - in case the rifle was dropped without being in the half cock safety position I guess. (You could push the hammer forward from the rebound position if the trigger was pulled though - makes sense.)

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drbd
.224 member

Reged: 29/11/11
Posts: 44
Loc: belgium

Re: rebounding or non-rebounding? [Re: TH44]
#259991 - 05/02/15 06:30 AM

Thanks TH44,
Those pictures are very much clarifying the issue!
So if one would want to take apart a non-rebounding double, one would first pull the hammers to half-cock before removing the forearm and taking apart the action-stock and barrels.
Best regards,
Benny

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AkMike
.416 member

Reged: 19/11/05
Posts: 2576
Loc: Anchorage, Alaska

Re: rebounding or non-rebounding? [Re: drbd]
#259994 - 05/02/15 08:12 AM

Correct. You'd also need to set them half cock to open it to reload as stated before or the firing pins/ strikers will get caught on the extractor.

--------------------
"When you see that in order to produce, you need to obtain permission from men who produce nothing; when you see that money is flowing to those who deal not in goods, but in favors; you may know that your society is doomed." Ayn Rand

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AkMike
.416 member

Reged: 19/11/05
Posts: 2576
Loc: Anchorage, Alaska

Re: rebounding or non-rebounding? [Re: AkMike]
#260031 - 06/02/15 08:11 AM

Along these lines.. Does anyone know where locks could be converted from non-rebounding to rebounding?

It used to be done way back in the day but I've never heard of it in modern times.

--------------------
"When you see that in order to produce, you need to obtain permission from men who produce nothing; when you see that money is flowing to those who deal not in goods, but in favors; you may know that your society is doomed." Ayn Rand

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ChrisPer
.300 member

Reged: 12/05/08
Posts: 235
Loc: Australia

Re: rebounding or non-rebounding? [Re: AkMike]
#260909 - 22/02/15 12:09 AM

Quote:

Along these lines.. Does anyone know where locks could be converted from non-rebounding to rebounding?

It used to be done way back in the day but I've never heard of it in modern times.

I would certainly like mine done! But even a good set of photos of the lock internals in the different positions would be helpful.

Tell me; does the spring push the hammers all the way into the primers then pull back, or does the spring stop at the rebounded position and the hammer strike under its own inertia?

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