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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Mauser Discussion Forum
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BillfromOregon
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Reged: 27/10/04
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Loc: Sweetwater, by God Texas
Large medium on a VZ 24?
      #254377 - 01/10/14 04:14 AM

Have a nice VZ 24 action ca. 1937 on the way in original configuration, and want to build an over .40 DGR on it. Nothing terribly fancy. Was originally thinking .416 Taylor, but at only 42 years old, it is kind of a "recent development." Also considered the .400 Whelen, but since I have three Springfields at hand it would be wrong -- to me -- to build a Whelen on anything but a 1903 action. So I dipped into Boddington and John Taylor and got to thinking a .425 Westley Richards might be more like it. I know this poses some challenges regarding brass, bullets and reamer, but I am more concerned about how the .425 fits and works in a 98 action. Does it tend to be fiddly and need a lot of rail and feeding work? Any other chambering out there that would be properly at home in a 98 and that dates from pre WWI?
Thanks for any and all guidance.

Edited by BillfromOregon (01/10/14 04:19 AM)

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93x64mm
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Re: Large medium on a VZ 24? [Re: BillfromOregon]
      #254380 - 01/10/14 06:07 AM

Bill,
Jack Lott talked about using .404 brass & sizing to .425 Westley Richards, but using an opened out bolt to suit the larger rim - this would retain easy feeding.
He also mentioned having a second bolt, so if required he could use the proper rebated cases when available. This being said it depends on what you really want to use it for, the .425's were in most cases basically single feed (correct me if I'm wrong here fellas) so it will be a real labour of love to get this one up & running properly if using correct brass!
Every thought of a 10.75x68mm, it can push things along if required & there are plenty of 'classic' rifles in this calibre - load data should be here just use the search function.
Best of luck with the project
93x64mm

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BillfromOregon
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Reged: 27/10/04
Posts: 254
Loc: Sweetwater, by God Texas
Re: Large medium on a VZ 24? [Re: 93x64mm]
      #254384 - 01/10/14 07:35 AM

Thanks 93. You know, as I look over my options I am leaning pretty hard toward the .416 Taylor. It's useful and affordable, if a "youngster." Just a lot going for it.
I had a smith in Southern Oregon build one for me 15-20 years ago, also on a VZ 24 with Pac-Nor barrel and Bell and Carlson Medalist stock. Always regretted letting a friend in Texas talk me out of it. He has gotten a lot of use out of it over the years.

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szihn
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Re: Large medium on a VZ 24? [Re: BillfromOregon]
      #254391 - 01/10/14 11:54 AM

Speaking only for myself, I like the 416 Taylor above every other 416 out there.
I have made a few in my live and I have never been disappointed with the performance or the reliability.

Here are 2 of them I made on GEW length Mausers and one is a VZ24.





Edited by szihn (01/10/14 11:56 AM)

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9.3x57
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Re: Large medium on a VZ 24? [Re: szihn]
      #254399 - 01/10/14 12:47 PM

Whats the usable length on a VZ24? IIRC, it's a wee bit shorter than a M98.

Not that it couldn't be done right if it is, but just wondering.

--------------------
What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?

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Metalguy
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Re: Large medium on a VZ 24? [Re: 9.3x57]
      #254403 - 01/10/14 01:20 PM

I was thinking the VZ was the same length. I know the m48 was shorter by about 1/4" IIRC.

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szihn
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Re: Large medium on a VZ 24? [Re: Metalguy]
      #254431 - 01/10/14 11:57 PM

The VZ-24 is GEW. Length. The CZ-24 of the same period was 1MM shorter as I recall.

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9.3x57
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Re: Large medium on a VZ 24? [Re: szihn]
      #254438 - 02/10/14 02:02 AM

Thanks guys.

Yes, it is the M48 length I was thinking of.

--------------------
What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?

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BillfromOregon
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Re: Large medium on a VZ 24? [Re: 9.3x57]
      #254441 - 02/10/14 02:18 AM

Szihn: Nice! Looks like you are not afraid of a longer barrel either. I am thinking 25 inches just because I like that pre-war British look, and you get plenty of performance without have to run maximum pressure loads.

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458Win
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Re: Large medium on a VZ 24? [Re: BillfromOregon]
      #254477 - 02/10/14 02:55 PM

Another caliber to consider is the new, up and coming classic, the 416 Ruger. It may not yet have the history and glamour but brass and loading components are easily available and it at least looks like a reduced sized Rigby.

--------------------
Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either never used one - or else is unwittingly commenting on their marksmanship
Phil Shoemaker
www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com

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simonsaorsa
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Reged: 11/05/06
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Re: Large medium on a VZ 24? [Re: 458Win]
      #254796 - 08/10/14 05:05 AM

Copied over from the stalking directory website in the uk about the trick with getting the 425 to feed:-

"I worked for WR ( 12 years ), the .425 is a good round. I only built two rifles in this calibre. For the cartridge to feed effectively in the mauser 98 action, two spring loaded side clips are used to stop the cartridges being pushed out of the mag box by the follower etc. When the bolt is pushed forwards, the clips are pushed outwards allowing the bolt face to feed the round off the follower and into the chamber. It took a lot of time to alter the receiver walls and do the feedwork for this calibre than any other I have ever built. That aside, recoil was moderate. Modern rifle stocks are designed with higher cheek pieces and combs. The old rifles that came into the factory that I fired always kicked like mules because of their old stock measurements. Many of the old rifles had very long barrels - 24/26'', and the muzzle flash was always impressive in low light conditions."

Also check out www.fieldsportsmagazine.com for an article by Derek Stimpson on his 425, reloading and hunting with it titled " A Classic Revisited".

Two more articles from other publications feature on a current thread on the 425 at the stalking directory forum

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DarylS
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Re: Large medium on a VZ 24? [Re: simonsaorsa]
      #254797 - 08/10/14 05:14 AM

Bill- I think Steve's recommendation for a .416 Taylor is great or perhaps the newer .416 Ruger would be my choice for for a .40 cal. Good bullets & brass, easily available.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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Rell
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Re: Large medium on a VZ 24? [Re: DarylS]
      #254819 - 08/10/14 11:47 AM

400 Whelen.

--------------------
450-400, 9.3x74r and 7x65r.

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BillfromOregon
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Reged: 27/10/04
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Loc: Sweetwater, by God Texas
Re: Large medium on a VZ 24? [Re: Rell]
      #255182 - 15/10/14 02:41 AM

Simon, thanks for the intel on the feeding issues with the .425.
Rell, I have three 1903 Springfields at hand, two with questionable barrels, so one of these would be the home for one of the Whelen chamberings. The third one is an abused Sedgley with perfect bore that I hope to restore to look like an original Sedgley, at least from a few yards off.

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500Boswell
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Re: Large medium on a VZ 24? [Re: BillfromOregon]
      #255202 - 15/10/14 01:24 PM

Thats interesting about the WR making two 425s, and the side clips used to make it feed ,i wonder if 425s were all like that? Bill Marden made a 500 Jeffery years ago on a Model 70 which used side clips ,wondered if that is where the idea originated from 425s to get them to feed

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Ash
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Re: Large medium on a VZ 24? [Re: 500Boswell]
      #255216 - 15/10/14 08:45 PM

500Boswell: Not all of them. There was a model i think for the game departments that didnt have clips. See if the one was still for sale..

Checked, it's not on the site anymore, darn.

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gwh
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Re: Large medium on a VZ 24? [Re: Ash]
      #255226 - 16/10/14 12:51 AM

404 Jeffrey?

I have one on a VZ 24 and they go together like peas in a pod!

--------------------
Hunt hard, shoot straight

"I speak of Africa and golden joys; the joy of wandering through lonely lands; the joy of hunting the mighty and terrible lords of the wilderness, the cunning, the wary and the grim"

Theodore Roosevelt, Khartoum, 1910

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BillfromOregon
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Reged: 27/10/04
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Re: Large medium on a VZ 24? [Re: gwh]
      #255231 - 16/10/14 03:36 AM

GWH: I thought the .404 required a longer action. Perhaps I am mistaken.

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