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Ripp
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Reged: 19/02/07
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Loc: Montana, USA
Alaska man shoots/kills brown bear with .44 mag
      #251968 - 12/08/14 07:15 AM

http://www.outdoorlife.com/blogs/newshou...;obref=obinsite

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DarylS
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Re: Alaska man shoots/kills brown bear with .44 mag [Re: Ripp]
      #251969 - 12/08/14 08:03 AM

Sounds to me like a brown phase black bear. At 200 pounds, it certainly wasn't an "Alaskan" Brown Bear, but a brown (black) bear in Alaska.

Sucks to be him - lucky he had the revolver. Dogs usually bring bears back to their owner - that's what they do when allowed to run wild where there are bears.



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Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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Ripp
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Re: Alaska man shoots/kills brown bear with .44 mag [Re: DarylS]
      #252015 - 13/08/14 12:25 AM

Quote:

Sounds to me like a brown phase black bear. At 200 pounds, it certainly wasn't an "Alaskan" Brown Bear, but a brown (black) bear in Alaska.

Sucks to be him - lucky he had the revolver. Dogs usually bring bears back to their owner - that's what they do when allowed to run wild where there are bears.





Was thinking the same thing..200lb brown bear would have to be a juvenile or as you stated brown phase black bear..

Guy was killed in YNP a couple years back for the same reason I believe..dogs come running back with a sow griz on their tails...took out the guy,, hit the wife, he hollered to get the bear off her, griz come back to him and killed him with a bite to the back of the neck..lights out..

Also read an article a couple years back about the most often used firearm and caliber in Alaska for bear attacks and in that particular article it stated a .357Mag. which I found really odd ..figured it would have been a 44 mag or something large than .357..it also discussed 12 gauge with slugs, etc..but stated .357 was the most used.

Ripp

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DarylS
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Re: Alaska man shoots/kills brown bear with .44 mag [Re: Ripp]
      #252018 - 13/08/14 02:13 AM

12 gauge with round ball at 1,500fps to 2,000fps would be my choice - better than most commonly available slugs, like the Fosters.
The .357? nope - M29 4" would be my choice.
I can see the .357 being more popular with non-shooters - easier to hit with due to being less intimidating than the .44.
I shot a guy's .500 S&W w/factory 350gr. II think they were, at the range a while back - it had less 'felt' recoil than my 4" .44 was producing with 300gr. cast FN's. I was able to shoot the back to back and the .44 stung my palm (getting soft in my old age), while the big .50 didn't - at all - quite pleasant, really, but just like the .44, it did aggravate the arthritis in my wrist.

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Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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Al333
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Re: Alaska man shoots/kills brown bear with .44 mag [Re: DarylS]
      #252022 - 13/08/14 02:34 AM

I picked up a Smith & Wesson model 29 stainless 4.25 inch (Canadian model). Yes I would feel comfortable packing it in Grizzly country with good handloads. I agree with Daryl, handloads I could definately feel it in my palm. Factory loads I found to be kind of anemic. Might have been the brand of factory, but that was with two different brands. Al

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DarylS
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Re: Alaska man shoots/kills brown bear with .44 mag [Re: Al333]
      #252030 - 13/08/14 04:17 AM

I was shooting 300gr. hard cast commercial FN's with 20gr. WW296. Long been rumored, Hodgdon's data now shows H110 and WW296 as the same powder. This load is not for a steady diet in the S&W, of course. I've now gone 'through' 2 M29's with too many of these types of loads. Now playing with .44 SPL brass and 200's with TB - loads of fun rapid tapping.

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Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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Ripp
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Reged: 19/02/07
Posts: 16072
Loc: Montana, USA
Re: Alaska man shoots/kills brown bear with .44 mag [Re: DarylS]
      #252032 - 13/08/14 04:48 AM

Quote:

I was shooting 300gr. hard cast commercial FN's with 20gr. WW296. Long been rumored, Hodgdon's data now shows H1110 and WW296 as the same powder. This load is not for a steady diet in the S&W, of course. I've now gone 'through' 2 M29's with too many of these types of loads. Now playing with .44 SPL brass and 200's with TB - loads of fun rapid tapping.



I have a titanium S&W in 44 mag--and can tell you I certainly feel those when I touch off a 300gr Hard cast as you described above..which is what I carry/pack when in griz country..as do many others around here..

Didnt know the H110 & ww296 story though..thx for that...

Ripp

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szihn
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Re: Alaska man shoots/kills brown bear with .44 mag [Re: Ripp]
      #252035 - 13/08/14 05:18 AM

Daryl, 296 is the same as H110.
When I was doing load work-ups for Freedom Arms 454 Casulls back in the early 90s I saw the large barrels of H110 powder at their loading room. If you pealed off the label there was an Olin 296 label printed under it. They confirmed to me that it was the same powder and Hodedon just purchased it in lots from Olin. Same with the corporate office of Winchester.
Same stuff.
Like all powder it can vary a small amount from lot to lot, so you should not ever start with a hot load when you buy ANY new powder. Even if it's the same brand and number. Always assume that a hot load may be too hot with a different lot of the same power and load accordingly.

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DarylS
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Re: Alaska man shoots/kills brown bear with .44 mag [Re: szihn]
      #252090 - 14/08/14 12:50 AM

Good advice, for all powders, Steve. Some powders vary more, lot to lot than others.

I do not know about other Vihtavouri powders, but N120 is susceptible to quite considerable burn-rate changes, lot to lot. This is especially noticeable in very small case rounds, like the .17AH and .17HH. Having variations of up to .6 grains in this tiny case, means considerable actual difference, lot to lot. Only having a capacity of 12 to 14gr. makes a .6gr. modification a huge difference, yet it is a very popular powder for those tiny rounds. In my own testing, AA1680 is much more stable, lot to lot, which is slower than the old WW680 - not the same at all, even thought the numbers are similar.

Some years back, Hodgdon purchased from Olin, the last 3 or 4 tons of WW680 produced, then re-canned and labeled it H116.
It was a really GREAT powder in some small cases and especially for producing big velocity at .44 mag pressures in .45 Colt lever guns 200fps faster than WW296/H110 could produce at the same pressures. WW680 was also a super powder in the .17 AH and .17AB(my most accurate loads, in fact in the .17AB).

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Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

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Shackleton
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Reged: 11/08/07
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Loc: Iowa
Re: Alaska man shoots/kills brown bear with .44 mag [Re: DarylS]
      #252992 - 31/08/14 12:26 PM

Quote:

12 gauge with round ball at 1,500fps to 2,000fps would be my choice - better than most commonly available slugs, like the Fosters.
.


I agree on this. I tend to subscribe to the old story "If you carry a handgun for self defense in grizzly country file off the front sight"-the rest isn't exactly appropriate. A handgun with enough power to reliably kill a charging grizzly is going to have enough recoil to make it tough to get off more than one or two rounds. With that little time, I want a stock and longer sight radius.

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"I do not kill with my gun, he who kills with his gun has forgotten the face of his father. I kill with my heart."--Stephen King

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