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Tentman
.300 member

Reged: 13/06/10
Posts: 128
Loc: Southland, New Zealand

Pre WW2 European 30 cal cartridge's
#251453 - 02/08/14 08:03 PM

Hello Folks

I have an Obendorf sporter action, that I've been sitting on for some time, its an intermediate, large ring, small shank, dated 1910.

I was saving it to build a "275 Rigby" on, but I now have a fine Brno 7x57.

Obtaining chrome moly barrels down here in New Zealand has become quite difficult, but I have a line on a good quality 30 cal barrel blank.

If I could think of a suitable 30 cal chambering that is "appropriate" to the action I'd grab the barrel in an instant - but I can't . . . ( beyond 30-06 but I feel the the short mag box of the intermediate might be quite limiting)

Can anyone suggest an chambering that I'm overlooking??

Thanks

Foster

--------------------
Southland, New Zealand

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Igorrock
.400 member

Reged: 01/03/07
Posts: 1649
Loc: Finland

Re: Pre WW2 European 30 cal cartridge's [Re: Tentman]
#251455 - 02/08/14 10:21 PM

Old swiss one i.e. 7,5x55. It´s very similar powered like .308 Win. Swedish NORMA makes ammo for it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/7.5%C3%9755mm_Swiss

--------------------
http://promaakari.wordpress.com/

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Iowa_303s
.400 member

Reged: 22/03/13
Posts: 1016
Loc: Iowa, USA

Re: Pre WW2 European 30 cal cartridge's [Re: Igorrock]
#251456 - 02/08/14 10:47 PM

The 7.5x55 is a superb cartridge. Shorter than the 30-06, longer than the .308 Winchester and fatter than both. Ballisics are closer to the 30-06.
Brass is also made by Privi or it can easily be made from .284 Winchester simply by running the .284 case into a 7.5x55 sizing die.
In the Swiss K31 military rifle, this round is damn near unbeatable in vintage military rifle matches here in the states.

--------------------
Matt

formerly known as Iowa_303

"Once your reputation is ruined you can live your life quite freely."

"Enkelkinder über alles"

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John303
.300 member

Reged: 16/11/06
Posts: 243
Loc: Canada

Re: Pre WW2 European 30 cal cartridge's [Re: Iowa_303s]
#251458 - 03/08/14 12:25 AM

Not certain of the exact time period but look into the 7.65x53 Argentinian round. --- John

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fuhrmann
.333 member

Reged: 04/01/05
Posts: 328
Loc: Switzerland

Re: Pre WW2 European 30 cal cartridge's [Re: John303]
#251461 - 03/08/14 01:11 AM

Why not simply go for a 8x57IS or 9x57?
The 7.65x53 is "historically appropriate" but has a .313 bullet issue.
The Swiss cartridge will work with .308 bullets, but to my knowledge was never used in Mauser rifles.
fuhrmann

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kuduae
.400 member

Reged: 13/01/10
Posts: 1792
Loc: middle of Germany

Re: Pre WW2 European 30 cal cartridge's [Re: fuhrmann]
#251470 - 03/08/14 02:52 AM

As the .30 caliber was about as (un-)popular in central Europe as the 8 mm cal. was in the USA and the British Empire pre-WW2, there were no such cartridges you are looking for. Even the 7.65x53 Belgian-Turkish-Argentinian Mauser was purely an export and military cartridge, unknown here as a sporting number. In your case I would look for a 7 mm barrel and build a correct 7x57/.275 Rigby rifle on that action. The original .275 Rigby rifles used the same intermediate action. If you insist on a .30 caliber, such intermediate actions make nice .308 Winchester rifles. The magazine is too short for most 30-06 loads. The 7.55 Swiss never was a hunting cartridge, even outlawed in Switzerland for other than military and target practice use.

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John303
.300 member

Reged: 16/11/06
Posts: 243
Loc: Canada

Re: Pre WW2 European 30 cal cartridge's [Re: kuduae]
#251511 - 04/08/14 12:20 AM

No doubt Oberndorf did produce sporting rifles in 30-06, I happen to have a barrel off one.
It has a small shank and would no doubt fit quite nicely into your action. If the mag. etc
is not long enough I don't believe it's a big deal to lengthen things to suit. My barrel hopefully
is destined to be fitted into a 22H Brno action I have kicking about, they look quite well together.
Even the scratching on top of the bridges and barrel rib match up quite nicely.
--- John

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kuduae
.400 member

Reged: 13/01/10
Posts: 1792
Loc: middle of Germany

Re: Pre WW2 European 30 cal cartridge's [Re: John303]
#251519 - 04/08/14 03:15 AM

Quote:

No doubt Oberndorf did produce sporting rifles in 30-06,....

Of course they did, but for Export only.

Quote:

It has a small shank and would no doubt fit quite nicely into your action.

No, the shank diameter is the same, but the intermediate action takes a longer shank than the standard length action they used for the 30-06

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Tentman
.300 member

Reged: 13/06/10
Posts: 128
Loc: Southland, New Zealand

Re: Pre WW2 European 30 cal cartridge's [Re: kuduae]
#251536 - 04/08/14 01:26 PM

After more research (and I know when the wind is not blowing in my favour !!) What about the 300 Savage, was that ever used in Europe??

John303 - I bet you get at least a couple of PM'ed offers on your 21H, folks (usually including me too) just can't resist!!).

Thanks everyone,
Foster

Edited by Tentman (04/08/14 01:28 PM)

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Igorrock
.400 member

Reged: 01/03/07
Posts: 1649
Loc: Finland

Re: Pre WW2 European 30 cal cartridge's [Re: Tentman]
#251540 - 04/08/14 06:07 PM

If rimmed ammo with slanted magazine is possible, you could build yours Mauser in 7,62x53R. This conversion isn´t factory original and not so common anyway but here in Finland they used to make some of them before last war time.

--------------------
http://promaakari.wordpress.com/

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fuhrmann
.333 member

Reged: 04/01/05
Posts: 328
Loc: Switzerland

Re: Pre WW2 European 30 cal cartridge's [Re: Tentman]
#251541 - 04/08/14 06:11 PM

The .300 Savage would be an ideal fit for an M98 Kurz / short action.
I remember having seen in this forum some Mauser Kurz rifles with .250-3000 caliber, but can't say if they were original (again for export only) or rebarreled / reworked in the US.

In German catalogs BEFORE WWI I see quite some US handguns, rifles (Winchester, Savage etc) and ammunition.
But I think BETWEEN WWs I and II there was very little import or none at all - a lost war, economy crisis, and at some times import barriers.

I'd second what Kuduae said - before WWII there wasn't any .30 caliber hunting cartridge in use in Germany and Austria. And if you want to use a .30 barrel, you might as well chamber it for the .308 Winchester which will be not "period-correct" but otherwise a sensible choice.

fuhrmann

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7mmSAKO
.224 member

Reged: 11/11/06
Posts: 41
Loc: Finland

Re: Pre WW2 European 30 cal cartridge's [Re: fuhrmann]
#260084 - 07/02/15 01:57 PM

Griffin & Howe (from USA) has made at least one K-actioned custom Mauser in caliber .300 Savage.

.250/3000 aka .250 Savage was one of the original calibers offered for K-actions and it was available in European market as well.
There is one Model M sporter in Mannerheim museum Helsinki. I believe he bought it either from Austria or Germany(?).

From left to right Johann Peterlongo custom M98 9x71 Peterlongo, Rigbys magnum M98 .350 Rigby, Sako/Mosin sporter, Swedish M96, caucasian hunting rifle, Mauser M sporter .250/3000, pair of William Powell shotguns and Purdey double rifle .400 Purdey Light Nitro.

Edited by 7mmSAKO (08/02/15 12:13 AM)

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Ash
.400 member

Reged: 10/05/11
Posts: 1653
Loc: Australia

Re: Pre WW2 European 30 cal cartridge's [Re: 7mmSAKO]
#261353 - 28/02/15 02:09 PM

What a safe!

Can you post more photos of the Peterlongo please, in another thread? I've been interested in this caliber of late.

Cheers.

--------------------
.

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7mmSAKO
.224 member

Reged: 11/11/06
Posts: 41
Loc: Finland

Re: Pre WW2 European 30 cal cartridge's [Re: Ash]
#261533 - 03/03/15 05:16 PM

Sorry, this was only photo that I can find from internet (guns are from Mannerheim museum).
Perhaps I will try to contact the museum and ask if they allow me to take some closer photos.

Here is probably the Peterlongo in action...

...and moose hunting with .400 Purdey

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