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NitroX
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Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39885
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...

High seat etiquette
#24394 - 18/01/05 01:52 AM

Saw a thread with a lot of high seat photos over at AR and it got me thinking.

When walking around in a forest it is correct etiquette not to climb into one to check it out?

Myself when I travelled in Austria and Germany I could never resist climbing up everyone I found to see what they were like, or try them out or to see what the shooting lanes were like. An occasional one had a door with a lock, but most were open and some were obviously abandoned with the young trees having grown too much.

But is this bad manners as I assume someone built it for their personal use. Are they considered private property even if in a public forest or park?

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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André
.333 member

Reged: 28/06/04
Posts: 254
Loc: Brussels (Belgium)

Re: High seat etiquette [Re: NitroX]
#24504 - 19/01/05 12:28 AM

In this country they are considered private property, just the same as a cabin or chalet. In my case, the miradors are all built on privately owned land where trespassing is prohibited. This does not mean we have no trespassers and/or vandalism. At the 1st. encounter, we try to (friendly) explain why their presence is not wanted. In case of recidivism, they get a ticket from our sworn in game warden, with possible prosecution in court.

--------------------
André
---------------------------------
3 shots do not make a group, they show a point of aim or impact.
5 shots are a group.

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NitroX
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Reged: 25/12/02
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Re: High seat etiquette [Re: André]
#24506 - 19/01/05 12:32 AM

Andre

The ones I visited were in the Black Forest near Freiburg, which had public access, the Vienna Woods, again public.

Also I remember I have used on in Northumberland when hunting roe deer in 1989. No luck unfortunately, it was during the middle of the day and the roe heard me approach and spotted me in the high seat. The bugger stood just in the dark shadows of the pine forest and barked at me.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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André
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Re: High seat etiquette [Re: NitroX]
#24514 - 19/01/05 02:38 AM

That's a common mishap, one tends to look for game at the horizon, forgetting some may be bedded up close. When I approach my stand (always against the wind)and there's high grass near it, I'll stop and hide to spy the surroundings before breaking a small twig. Not enough noise to spook game but still enough to see a head coming up to investigate. If that's the case, I wait for the head to disappear, wait some more in case the Roe checks again (they often play that trick) and withdraw quietly. For if you get barked at, you may call it off in that part of the woods.

--------------------
André
---------------------------------
3 shots do not make a group, they show a point of aim or impact.
5 shots are a group.

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larcher
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Reged: 11/01/05
Posts: 2655
Loc: Saverne, Alsace, France

Re: High seat etiquette [Re: NitroX]
#24672 - 20/01/05 07:30 PM

Tolerating people visit one’s mirador depends on owner/user’s character and mood.
It’s a crude fact that high stand fascinate the wanderers. Mostly the kids who love to climb up and play in this kind of fancy hut. That’s why it’s a nagging trouble because not rare incurable preservationists sabotage high stands. The most frequent victims are the kids.
IMHO I wouldn’t like my hunting neighbours use my high stands to “spy” my territory. It’s stupid but even if we are friends, we like that everybody stay on his own ground.
Concerning walkers, we don’t care they use our high stand. Most of the time they are loud and as the game is shooed off long before the high stand be climbeb up, it cannot be taught to take notice of the danger for it a high stand represents. If it’s a foreigner like NitroX, we’ll be proud he enjoys the scenery around and the architecture of the building.
If You are a do-it-yourself guy there always is something to learn about high stand building.
One doesn’t omit that we are responsible for any accident caused by high stand utilisation, what is the reason for some nailed advertisings to forbid high stand utilisation.
Should it be NitroX visiting, he will be severely chastised, he will be advantageously fed and “watered” so that his waistline and liver never recover.

--------------------
"I don't want to create an encyclopedic atmosphere here when we might be having a beer instead" P H Capstick in "Safari the last adventure."

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EricD
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Reged: 27/02/04
Posts: 4636

Re: High seat etiquette [Re: NitroX]
#24728 - 21/01/05 08:33 AM

NitroX,

We have a few highstands here and there, but not as fancy as the ones you'll find in countrys south of ours. Ours are for the most part built with logs chopped there and then, and besides a railing around up on top (so you don't fall out when shooting) there are no walls, roof or weather protection (although I've often considered building a fancier one after sitting in the rain a couple of hours!). The reason is that we put up a highstand where the young pine trees in a clearing have grown too high to see over when sitting/standing on the ground. Obviously, in just a few more years, even the highstand won't help much, and is dismantled. If we had one on the outskirts of a field etc. it would be a differant matter, but there are no fields where we hunt...

In the rare instance where one has to answer natures call, there is no problem since there are no walls/windows. Just don't piss against the wind!

Since our roads are opened to the public, anyone that wants to, has physical access to our highstands. As is the case all over Norway. And if someone wants to climb up and have a look, they can. If they fall down and break their neck, that's their problem.

Erik

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Metswedi
.300 member

Reged: 20/01/05
Posts: 156
Loc: Yorks. England

Re: High seat etiquette [Re: EricD]
#24825 - 22/01/05 08:27 AM

In the UK, the high seats would be regarded as private property, generally they are erected by the syndicate that controls the shooting rights on the property. High seats here have to conform to strict health & safety legislation so you cannot just knock them together out of anything.

The owners would be most upset if people were messing around with their high seats and ended up injuring themselves. There are plenty of no win, no fee lawyers just waiting for an idiot to fall out of one and break something. Best to steer clear of a high seat here unless specifically told you are welcome to use it.

--------------------
Perfer et obdura!

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NitroX
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Reged: 25/12/02
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Re: High seat etiquette [Re: larcher]
#24843 - 22/01/05 12:41 PM

JB

Thanks for the comments. I'll bring a bottle or two if we ever share a high seat oneday too.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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NitroX
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Re: High seat etiquette [Re: NitroX]
#24844 - 22/01/05 12:45 PM

Metswedi

If the land was public land, or at least public access shouldn't the highseat be posted as 'no access' or 'private' etc?

***

Other than in Northumberland the only time I have actually used them was in Australia when hunting hog deer in the Boole Poole National Park (under ballot). Deerhunters had built some 'high-seats' in the trees over the decades usually near a water hole. This is totally public land and no ownership of high seats at all.

The countryside is very thickly forested and stand hunting is about the only way to have a measure of success. Some of these high seats I only tried once. Having ascended one and then tried to descend I did not feel like experiencing it again and some were pretty rickety and very high. Mostly were just planks nailed into a tree trunk to form a ladder and another couple planks to form a very unstable seat. Not always nailed well into the tree either. At one waterhole an unmodified tree formed a much better shooting platform but pretty uncomfortable.

I did score a nice trophy, not from a high seat though, from leaning against a tree trunk on a slight elevation. So comfortable it was hard to stay awake!

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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NitroX
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Re: High seat etiquette [Re: NitroX]
#24845 - 22/01/05 12:46 PM

Several people have mentioned the "calls of nature", ie pissing out of a high seat.

I thought it was an absolute NO-NO to do anything like this near a stand or a high seat. Either using a bottle or leaving the area by a good distance. Nothing would scare away a game animal quicker than human urine. Try it oneday on a game path and see the results.

A bottle is OK, but ask Bakes how some of this working compatriots use alfoil.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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Metswedi
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Reged: 20/01/05
Posts: 156
Loc: Yorks. England

Re: High seat etiquette [Re: NitroX]
#24969 - 23/01/05 09:11 PM

you're right Nitro, the seats are often marked in this fashion. There is no hunting on public or "Common" Land. It is invariably on private land, but footpaths and rights of way often cross the land and the public has rights of access. There has just been a great deal of private land opened up to the public as a result of pressure from such as the "Ramblers Association" which makes the problems worse. You will always find a bunnyhugger who will deliberately damage the seat if they get the chance and if the seat is damaged and does not meet the Health & Safety Standards, the owner is responsible if someone uses it and gets injured.

I would hate to test this in court, given the general attitude to guns and shooting in the UK, my feeling is that in a case where some lamebrain was messing about in a high seat and got injured as a result of being stupid and because they were trespassing, the court would very likely find against the owner.

If a trespasser in this country gets injured because the owner of the land has not met the Health & Safety regulations, the trespasser has the protection of the law. Illogical maybe, crazy even, but that's the way it is!!

--------------------
Perfer et obdura!

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NitroX
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Re: High seat etiquette [Re: Metswedi]
#24975 - 23/01/05 11:23 PM

Isn't there a simple solution by removing the ladder or the lower parts of it except actually during the hunting season?

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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Metswedi
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Reged: 20/01/05
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Re: High seat etiquette [Re: NitroX]
#24985 - 24/01/05 01:38 AM

probably too much trouble. If the ladder is made of wood, it must be securely fastened to the tree and each rung reinforced by steel wire or steel strips. I think these days, the trend seems to be more towards lightweight folding seats and ladders that can be erected fairly quickly and then dismantled later. The problem being of course, possible disturbance to the deer.

The last few times I have been to Scotland, I have seen more and more of what I call wooden "pill-Boxes" placed on high ground overlooking rides and tracks. These are very low and similar to a small box cabin. Takes a fairly impressive effort to fall out of one of these!!

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larcher
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Reged: 11/01/05
Posts: 2655
Loc: Saverne, Alsace, France

Re: High seat etiquette [Re: NitroX]
#25208 - 26/01/05 06:21 PM

To prevent from any climbing, some hunters remove 2 successive bars from the scale. To be able to climb up one must have these 2 bars. The bars are pierced in both ends and fit with the nails projecting from the scale uprights.
When one want to use the scale, one bring the 2 bars along or pick them when hidden near the high seat.
In insist on the fact that the kids are in jeopardy

should they play in safe or sabotaged high seats, no small concern.In most case the hunter/owner is responsible.
Concerning "Call of the nature", some use large cubic soft plastic containers (for example the ones for bulk purchase of wine).

--------------------
"I don't want to create an encyclopedic atmosphere here when we might be having a beer instead" P H Capstick in "Safari the last adventure."

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EricD
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Reged: 27/02/04
Posts: 4636

Re: High seat etiquette [Re: NitroX]
#25239 - 27/01/05 09:35 AM

In reply to:

Several people have mentioned the "calls of nature", ie pissing out of a high seat.

I thought it was an absolute NO-NO to do anything like this near a stand or a high seat. Either using a bottle or leaving the area by a good distance. Nothing would scare away a game animal quicker than human urine. Try it oneday on a game path and see the results.

A bottle is OK, but ask Bakes how some of this working compatriots use alfoil.

Actually, my mentioning the "calls of nature" was more meant in a joking sense.

BUT! I have had a couple of instances where there was no way out, and had to take a leak. One trick that works well is to bring a heavyduty "Ziplock" plastic baggy. Piss in it, zip it up, and put it on the floor (preferably where you won't step on it!). This works for women too!

When you leave the highseat, just bring it with you and empty it when you're far enough away, and dispose of the bag later.

Re. the "alufoil brownies". It's a bit unpleasant, and luckily no hunting I do is so important as to warrent this solution to disposing of yesterdays meals...

Btw, like alufoil, Ziplock bags can be used for "heavy stuff" too!

Erik

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vapodog
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Reged: 28/12/04
Posts: 237
Loc: Nebraska USA

Re: High seat etiquette [Re: EricD]
#25247 - 27/01/05 03:05 PM

Where I hunt there probably isn't a single acre that hasn't been deposited the previous day's beverage. How can a "deer" tell where to go with so much "don't go here" smell everywhere he goes.

If this really was the case one merely needs to funnel the game toward his location by appropriate deposition. I can assure you that this too don't work.

Sometimes we get all too worked up about things.

--------------------

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