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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Rifles

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Ripp
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The ideal sheep rifle --per Guy Eastman
      #227573 - 27/03/13 02:26 AM

What Makes the Ultimate Sheep Rifle?By Guy Eastman


There are some hunts that might just be important enough to warrant a new and unique rifle for the occasion. For a guy from Pennsylvania it could be a life-long dream hunt for a big bull elk, or for another from California it could be that fourth season Colorado mule deer tag it has taken you twenty-four long years to finally draw. For me, a Dall’s sheep hunt in Alaska would be just the occasion to trigger a new rifle purchase.

No matter the occasion or the quarry, there are certain criteria that will sway the sometimes almost painfully difficult decision on what make, model and caliber of rifle to invest your hard-earned money into. The following is a short outline of the decision-making process and results thereof that I came up with for my "ultimate sheep rifle” purchase.


The 5 Selection Factors


1) Weight - Most of the big game rifles on the market today tend to be in the seven to nine pound range without a scope and ammo. Add in a long-action magnum and you could tip the scale another quarter of a pound or so more. For my sheep hunt, I will be hunting on foot, backpacking for seven or eight days with everything necessary for the hunt on my back or in my pockets. This is why I chose to go with a very lightweight gun for this hunt. As light as I could possibly find.

My choice is right under the six-pound mark. The Savage Lightweight hunter is a true lightweight and is extremely compact. Sub-six pounds dry weight and just under 42-inches in overall length.

2) Knockdown Power - This is where the rubber meets the road for most hunters. Combine bullet weight and speed to create the phenomenon we call "knockdown power.” This is where you have to take your quarry into consideration. If it is elk, moose or grizzly you seek, then a magnum is probably your best bet. Keeping with the lightweight theme, and because sheep are not very hearty and they have little to no cover available to hide in if wounded, I chose a non-magnum caliber for this hunt.

To save as much weight as possible I have chosen a rifle chambered in a nonmagnum, 6.5X.284. This will cut down on weight both in the gun and the ammo. Slightly risky but possibly worth it in the long run. I sacrificed knockdown power for carry comfort.

3) Accuracy - Some gun set-ups are just more accurate than others. The problem with accuracy of a new gun is you never really know what is going to happen until you get the gun and actually shoot it at the range. The bullet, rifle, scope and shooter all play a very critical role in this element of the equation. As a general rule, an antelope, high country mule deer and sheep hunt would probably require the most accurate of rifles due to the size of the target and probable terrain of the shot. A long distance shot at a relatively small target definitely requires some next-level accuracy.

The 6.5X.284 has been a very accurate caliber for me purely based on my personal experience with it over the past four years. With a relatively long bullet and thus a high BC (ballistic coefficient), this caliber exhibits both down-range accuracy and good resistance to crosswind drift.

4) Price - As we all know, when it comes to guns the sky is nearly the limit for a hunting rifle set-up. For me, I wanted to keep the price at a reasonable level, certainly under the $1,000 mark for the gun alone if possible. This barrier narrowed the available options down significantly.

The Savage is a very reasonably priced gun particularly considering the additional factory work that goes into the Lightweight Hunter. Almost every ounce of excessive wood and steel are removed from this gun at the factory.

5) Dependability - Dependability is not only a very subjective term, it’s sometimes like trying to predict the future to some extent. I wanted to go with a factory gun, not only because of the price limit, but also a model that had stood the test of time. On a sheep hunt, you just don’t have the option of a quick service return, regardless of how good the warranty agreement is.

Both the Savage Model 111 and the AccuTrigger have been on the market for a number of years now. The brand, product and the manufacturing processes to build it have, without a doubt, stood the tests of time.

Buying a new rifle setup can be a very difficult and expensive decision. Try not to get too hung up on all the hype and options that today’s market offers. Almost every manufacturer makes a very accurate and dependable rifle these days and there are at least five or six great optics companies on the market that I would trust a riflescope from. If you clearly define your criteria based on these categories ahead of the purchase and do your research thoroughly, I’m sure you can find the best gun fit for your taste, style, budget and excursion.

--------------------
ALL MEN DIE, BUT FEW MEN TRULY LIVE..


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SharpsNitro
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Re: The ideal sheep rifle --per Guy Eastman [Re: Ripp]
      #227576 - 27/03/13 02:43 AM

I can't disagree with keeping things light for that kind of hunt, the caliber selection isn't bad either. Limiting the rifle price to $1000 seems stupid though, what does a Dall sheep hunt run, >$15,000? One important thing he misses completely is practice and familiarity with the gun, ultralight rifles can be a challenge to shoot with consistent accuracy. Would be a shame to go on such a hunt and miss your target, or poorly place a shot and lose the trophy.

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Ripp
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Re: The ideal sheep rifle --per Guy Eastman [Re: SharpsNitro]
      #227582 - 27/03/13 04:27 AM

Quote:

I can't disagree with keeping things light for that kind of hunt, the caliber selection isn't bad either. Limiting the rifle price to $1000 seems stupid though, what does a Dall sheep hunt run, >$15,000? One important thing he misses completely is practice and familiarity with the gun, ultralight rifles can be a challenge to shoot with consistent accuracy. Would be a shame to go on such a hunt and miss your target, or poorly place a shot and lose the trophy.





I agree with you on the cost..I have a Lex Webernick -Rifles Inc. that I picked up several years ago for hunts like this ..chambered in .280 Ackley..great gun but does require a little more attention shooting it as it is very light..have a 4-14 scope on it..rings, scope, rifle all in --6lbs even..

the magazine these guys put out --they pride themselves on doing it all alone on public land..think they are going after the market of spending as little as possible and showing it can still be done as such..which is great --have no problem with that..90% of mine are on my own with the exception of Africa or if I have to by law have one in Alaska...

But think there are things you don't want to skimp on..glass and guns are two of them..IMHO..

Ripp

--------------------
ALL MEN DIE, BUT FEW MEN TRULY LIVE..


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gryphon
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Re: The ideal sheep rifle --per Guy Eastman [Re: Ripp]
      #227601 - 27/03/13 08:19 AM

Quote:

Limiting the rifle price to $1000 seems stupid though.




Ripp




Ripp, I have to say that whether a rifle costs 1 or 10 grand shouldn't be a factor ..if the hunter is a competent person,good hunting skills are far more important than the worth of a firearm imo.I see blokes with the "best you can get" out in the field that are hopeless with the actual hunting/shooting side of trophy chasing.
Now my 30+ year old Mod 70 7mm RM imo would be "just the gun" for me on such a hunt.I paid $320 for it and its worth about that still ha ha.

--------------------
Get off the chair away from the desk and get out in the bush and enjoy life.


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bonanza
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Re: The ideal sheep rifle --per Guy Eastman [Re: gryphon]
      #227602 - 27/03/13 09:02 AM

Gryph,

I doubt the "Ideal Sheep Gun", is going to cost less than $1000.00; maybe the cheapest. My ideal sheep gun is a break action Merkel K3 Stutzen 7x64R with a nice Swarovski scope ~ $5000.00

Most likely most $350 RemChester 30-06 with a tasco will do.

But, like you, most of us own at least one premium rifle and it's fun to dream big.

--------------------


"Speak Precisely" G. Gordon Liddy.

"Life is absurd, chaotic and we must define its purpose with our actions" Abert Camus

"I''m the dude playing a dude disguised as another dude."

"Yo! Mr. White"


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gryphon
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Re: The ideal sheep rifle --per Guy Eastman [Re: bonanza]
      #227603 - 27/03/13 09:51 AM

If the string boys can take them with a bow I`m willing to bet that a good sheep hunter would take them with a Mod 94 30/30.

I do see the points however of having the super Macmillan rifle in hand rather than an old clunker,just saying though it aint necessarily needed.

I think when I have the super funds to go Argali Hunting I will take my old Mod 70.

--------------------
Get off the chair away from the desk and get out in the bush and enjoy life.


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DarylS
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Re: The ideal sheep rifle --per Guy Eastman [Re: gryphon]
      #227604 - 27/03/13 10:45 AM

I hear you gryphon - I'd think an accurate (good chance) .308 or '06 would be hard to beat for all-round hunting. 150gr. or 165gr. TSX - running 2,950fps to 3,050fps - long range, close range - with the scopes today, take proper aim and take your shot.

Of course, that said, borrow my Daughter's .260 with 120gr. TSX running 3,000fps - any game, any range likely to be taken by me. I'd have to leave the 9.3 or .375 at home, though.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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gryphon
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Re: The ideal sheep rifle --per Guy Eastman [Re: DarylS]
      #227614 - 27/03/13 11:43 AM

Or maybe I should buy the 338-378 Roy on Used guns!

--------------------
Get off the chair away from the desk and get out in the bush and enjoy life.


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SharpsNitro
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Re: The ideal sheep rifle --per Guy Eastman [Re: gryphon]
      #227615 - 27/03/13 12:13 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Limiting the rifle price to $1000 seems stupid though.




Ripp




Ripp, I have to say that whether a rifle costs 1 or 10 grand shouldn't be a factor ..if the hunter is a competent person,good hunting skills are far more important than the worth of a firearm imo.I see blokes with the "best you can get" out in the field that are hopeless with the actual hunting/shooting side of trophy chasing.
Now my 30+ year old Mod 70 7mm RM imo would be "just the gun" for me on such a hunt.I paid $320 for it and its worth about that still ha ha.



Since the comment was mine I will elaborate. I don't see the point in limiting the rifle budget, especially since the author is shooting for light weight. As with many things that goal costs money. Yes you can shoot a sheep with most anything but if you want to keep the weight down as you pack into the mountains you will have to pay for the privilege.


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gryphon
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Re: The ideal sheep rifle --per Guy Eastman [Re: SharpsNitro]
      #227621 - 27/03/13 01:54 PM

Apologies to Ripp.I seem to have confused myself SharpsNitro!.

With the weight factor it can come down to the keenness and fitness of the hunter. I did a couple of very tough walk in Tahr hunts in NZ,both with standard weight rifles and I can say that if I had of saved a pound or a pound and a half it wouldn't be noticed,not in those mountains.
I would carry a target rifle if it meant a chance at another Tahr.A reasonable rifle with a fairly high budget scope is a better outfit imo if one is fund short...but then that old Tasco will do the job too...good hunters get closer!

I didnt actually say one should limit the rifle budget,I meant to convey that one doesn't have too.

--------------------
Get off the chair away from the desk and get out in the bush and enjoy life.


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Ripp
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Re: The ideal sheep rifle --per Guy Eastman [Re: gryphon]
      #227622 - 27/03/13 02:04 PM

Quote:

Apologies to Ripp.I seem to have confused myself SharpsNitro!.

With the weight factor it can come down to the keenness and fitness of the hunter. I did a couple of very tough walk in Tahr hunts in NZ,both with standard weight rifles and I can say that if I had of saved a pound or a pound and a half it wouldn't be noticed,not in those mountains.
I would carry a target rifle if it meant a chance at another Tahr.A reasonable rifle with a fairly high budget scope is a better outfit imo if one is fund short...but then that old Tasco will do the job too...good hunters get closer!

I didnt actually say one should limit the rifle budget,I meant to convey that one doesn't have too.




No apologies needed...Interesting discussion...I should say I also have plenty of regular guns laying around..heck, my first centerfire was an old army model mauser in 303 British with open sites...shot lots of whitetail with that gun and still take it out once in a while for fun..
also have a dozen or so remingtons laying around..only kept the really accurate ones..

Guess my point of agreement was as stated..when going on a big dollar hunt, I try to keep as much as I can in my favor and control..just think good equipment is prudent..not all things in life but generally in firearms and glass..you get what you pay for...especially glass..or boots..

Ripp

--------------------
ALL MEN DIE, BUT FEW MEN TRULY LIVE..


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SharpsNitro
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Re: The ideal sheep rifle --per Guy Eastman [Re: Ripp]
      #227625 - 27/03/13 02:37 PM

gryphon,

I don't think we are in disagreement, I just thought it odd for the author to place that restriction. Gear selection for a trip like that is tough, what do you take vs. what do you leave behind? How much is it worth to minimize the weight of what you do take? How hard do you train physically for the trip? The downside is that after a long slog it all feels too heavy anyway.


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Ripp
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Reged: 19/02/07
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Re: The ideal sheep rifle --per Guy Eastman [Re: SharpsNitro]
      #227641 - 28/03/13 12:25 AM

Quote:

gryphon,

I don't think we are in disagreement, I just thought it odd for the author to place that restriction. Gear selection for a trip like that is tough, what do you take vs. what do you leave behind? How much is it worth to minimize the weight of what you do take? How hard do you train physically for the trip? The downside is that after a long slog it all feels too heavy anyway.




Feel very similar..different story if you are using horses..but, if you are backpacking.every pound after a week of hiking makes a huge difference in the end..when we go backpacking I cut down every ounce I can ---amazing how much of a difference it makes ..pound here, pound there..all of a sudden your pack is 10 lbs less..big diff for a week of slugging around...so on day 6 you spot rams moving off a ridge..you have to move as quickly as you can for 300 yards to get a shot..it all comes into play...IMHO...

Ripp

--------------------
ALL MEN DIE, BUT FEW MEN TRULY LIVE..


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gryphon
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Re: The ideal sheep rifle --per Guy Eastman [Re: Ripp]
      #227664 - 28/03/13 07:05 AM

I agree Ripp m on the pounds and ounces etc but one thing to consider is that there are more than quite a few that have the latest,greatest and lightest mountain rifle out and in conjunction with their shooting ability and out of shape condition they go to the back of the class.

One only has to go way back to the old time and great Wapiti hunters in Fiordland and see their old (usually) 303 service rifles weighing in at a ton to see that determination,hunting skill and sharp shooting outweighs a minor weight consideration imo.
The same go`s for the old time alpine hunters in Europe of course.
The hunting world is littered with blokes and their toys that often have jack shite on their walls haha.

I suppose what I feel is that the right hunters will do it successfully no matter what comes into account.

PS I would love to have a Jarrett sheep rifle or the equiv for my Pakistan Ibex hunt but I doubt if I will ever own one so I will soldier on with the old toys I have.

--------------------
Get off the chair away from the desk and get out in the bush and enjoy life.


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Ripp
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Re: The ideal sheep rifle --per Guy Eastman [Re: gryphon]
      #227677 - 28/03/13 09:22 AM

Quote:

I agree Ripp m on the pounds and ounces etc but one thing to consider is that there are more than quite a few that have the latest,greatest and lightest mountain rifle out and in conjunction with their shooting ability and out of shape condition they go to the back of the class.

One only has to go way back to the old time and great Wapiti hunters in Fiordland and see their old (usually) 303 service rifles weighing in at a ton to see that determination,hunting skill and sharp shooting outweighs a minor weight consideration imo.
The same go`s for the old time alpine hunters in Europe of course.
The hunting world is littered with blokes and their toys that often have jack shite on their walls haha.

I suppose what I feel is that the right hunters will do it successfully no matter what comes into account.

PS I would love to have a Jarrett sheep rifle or the equiv for my Pakistan Ibex hunt but I doubt if I will ever own one so I will soldier on with the old toys I have.




Agree with you...and yes, many many hunters are out of shape...for one reason or another..but I do find that the mtns seem to get just a litte steeper each year..so I am looking for every advantage I can get/afford...

Yes, there isn't much that can substitute determination...

As far as accuracy. my little RIFLES INC will touch 3 at 100 yds..more than acceptable for the girls I date..

Take care
Ripp

--------------------
ALL MEN DIE, BUT FEW MEN TRULY LIVE..


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SharpsNitro
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Re: The ideal sheep rifle --per Guy Eastman [Re: Ripp]
      #227685 - 28/03/13 01:31 PM

Here is some fuel for the fire, Kifaru is back with an updated Rambling Rifle:

http://www.kifaruarms.com/index.php/rambling-rifle/

I'm guessing the base price is going to be slightly above the $1000 cap from the article.


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Ripp
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Reged: 19/02/07
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Loc: Montana, USA
Re: The ideal sheep rifle --per Guy Eastman [Re: SharpsNitro]
      #227725 - 29/03/13 12:22 PM

Kimber just come out in the last few months with an ultra-light mtn rifle with a stock coloration similar to Sitka gear..around 4 3/4 lbs--currenlty only available in 308 Win.

Ripp

--------------------
ALL MEN DIE, BUT FEW MEN TRULY LIVE..


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