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And you need the super big bores .500+ to generate 6000+ foot pounds of ME., ouch!!

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Bonanza,

But for the above to work, you have to actually hit the target! Which it appears a lot of Mark Sullivan clients aren't very good at...

Erik

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I have many friends who would agree that size matters.

~Ann

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Ann! You naughty girl!



Erik

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I have many friends who would agree that size matters.

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Oy, young impressionable kiddies might be reading this! They might be scared for life (as we all now the internet is otherwise devoid of anything not nice or shocking ).

The key here is whether the calibre size is important or driving a thinner projectile faster and harder in a longer case.

As always I argue that after a point, increasing calibre (and weight) at a respectable speed is more effective.

As to Erik's question , my personal untested view is once you go beyond .577 calibre, or .500 for that matter, the diminishing returns of recoil and slowness in possibly needed follow-up shots reduces their effectiveness. For the average shooter probably .450 or .a 400 is ideal.

A .375 (or larger bore) will kill small and medium game very quickly, but my belief is larger game simply takes longer to die unless the brain or spine (in the neck) is hit. Increasing the calibre increases the damage by a percentage and also possibly breaks more bones but the animal is just going to take a while to die and blasting away is just going to use up bullets at best and at worst get the animals adrenalin going. This certainly has been the case with ALL the large animals I have shot to date.


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John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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Is bigger really better?

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Hell yes, but as well as better it's more fun!

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Is bigger really better?

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Yes it is Erik if you hit the right spot.
Mark Sullivan is a great shot but where is he aiming

Cheers,

André

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Always always use enough ... GUN

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I've read that the best lion stopper is a 458 lott. Why? Because the shock that a 500 grain bullet imparts on the nervous system above 2500 fps is devistating.

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A 500 grain bullet doing above 2500 fps from a 458 lott would most likely be "devistating" for the shooter and also the rifle!

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Looks like this must be "Bag a PH Week"!

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Two comments only so far?

Re: the South African tyro PH tests. I would think the main time a PH is expected to shoot with a client is 1) physical danger, and maybe 2) when a animal is to escape.

On a pure plains game hunt maybe a PH will get away with carrying a medium calibre such as a .30-06 or .270. Probably this is only the case where there will be no dangerous game present during the hunt. Perhaps for a plains game hunt they shouldn't carry a rifle at all as the client should be responsible for dropping the odd antelope or them escaping if not.

My limited personal experience with PHs has seen a PH or guide carrying:
1. Nothing - a deer hunt;
2. Nothing - a plains game hunt;
3. a .338 Win Mag for a plains game hunt;
4. a .243 for a plains game hunt - where it was a mate hunting with me;
5. a .458 Win Mag for a plains/buffalo hunt where dangerous game was likely to be present inaddition to buffalo;
6. a .458 Win Mag for a buffalo hunt.

My point is for the South African tests is if in a real situation the PH will be using a bigger calibre for EXACTLY the situations they are testing for, why are they allowed to use medium calibres, just because it is EASIER to pass that way. In reality many of these guys may not own a larger bore yet. Another point which I will not go into (otherwise more claims of bagging PHs ).


As for the relevance to this thread. Using the medium sized calibres and not even smaller big bores, allows these students to shoot more accurately with more confidence and with faster follow-up shots.


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John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

Edited by NitroX (09/12/04 12:39 PM)

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A garret .458 520 grain hammerhead bullet with a huge metplat will create a lager wound channel than a .500 520 grain round nose.

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Wouldn't a Garrett hard lead hammerhead bullet driven at Lott speeds actually break-up?



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John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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In reality many of these guys may not own a larger bore yet. Another point which I will not go into (otherwise more claims of bagging PHs ).

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Hey come on now, no need to be shy!


Edited by NitroX (09/12/04 12:34 PM)

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A 500 grain bullet doing above 2500 fps from a 458 lott would most likely be "devistating" for the shooter and also the rifle!

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None,
When I made that comment I wasn't just thinking about the recoil but also the fact that 2500+ with 500 grainers from a 458 lott would surely be pushing pressures to frightening levels?

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A 500 grain bullet doing above 2500 fps from a 458 lott would most likely be "devistating" for the shooter and also the rifle!

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I'll try to remember not to buy a used rifle from the guy who loads his 458LOTT to 2500 fps, with a 500 gr bullet!

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..........Mac >>>===(x)===>
DUGABOY1, and MacD37 founding member of DRSS www.doublerifleshooterssociety.com
"If I die today, I have had a life well spent, for I've been to see the Elephant, and smelled the smoke of Africa!"

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