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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Double Rifles
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casper50
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Reged: 18/10/07
Posts: 1446
Loc: Alaska
Westley snap caps?
      #212243 - 08/07/12 12:43 AM

Anyone ever seen a set of .410 WR snap caps? I've been offered a set via email. They are stamped " Westley Richards & Co" but no guage/caliber. I'm thinking rifle caps.

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casper50
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Reged: 18/10/07
Posts: 1446
Loc: Alaska
Re: Westley snap caps? [Re: casper50]
      #212340 - 09/07/12 02:53 AM

OK, he's sent me the following measurments: Rim = .511 and base just in front of rim = .404. My measurements of a .410 shell = .526 & .471. I'm going through the Handloaders Manual of cartridge conversions page by page but no luck so far.

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AkMike
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Reged: 19/11/05
Posts: 2576
Loc: Anchorage, Alaska
Re: Westley snap caps? [Re: casper50]
      #212344 - 09/07/12 04:04 AM

1882 35-30 Maynard?

--------------------
"When you see that in order to produce, you need to obtain permission from men who produce nothing; when you see that money is flowing to those who deal not in goods, but in favors; you may know that your society is doomed." Ayn Rand

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500Nitro
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Reged: 06/01/03
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Re: Westley snap caps? [Re: AkMike]
      #212351 - 09/07/12 05:48 AM


Must be one of the NE cartridges.

What is close to it ?


400 / 360 ? (Which I know WR made guns for)

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casper50
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Reged: 18/10/07
Posts: 1446
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Re: Westley snap caps? [Re: 500Nitro]
      #212356 - 09/07/12 06:51 AM

I looked at all of the NE and BPE cartridges in the book and can't find anything close. I find the rim diameter but the head is always larger than the .404. I'm thinking the measurements are either incorrect or taken in the wrong place. There might be a language barrier as I speak American and he is from Turkey so a misunderstanding of where I've asked him to take the measurements is possible.

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500Nitro
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Re: Westley snap caps? [Re: casper50]
      #212357 - 09/07/12 07:28 AM


Casper

Re the language barrier.

Take a photo and use photoshop (or whatever) to draw arrows where you want the measurements to be taken.

As they say, a Picture is worth a thousand words !!!

Also, can he take a pic of them next to a case we all know like 308 or 375 ?


Re what cart, what about one of the smaller BP cartridges ?
(I don't have access to my books ATM so it makes it hard to help).

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AkMike
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Reged: 19/11/05
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Re: Westley snap caps? [Re: 500Nitro]
      #212361 - 09/07/12 09:05 AM

Or take pictures with a ruler beside it so you can scale it.

--------------------
"When you see that in order to produce, you need to obtain permission from men who produce nothing; when you see that money is flowing to those who deal not in goods, but in favors; you may know that your society is doomed." Ayn Rand

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500Nitro
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Reged: 06/01/03
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Re: Westley snap caps? [Re: AkMike]
      #212362 - 09/07/12 09:08 AM


Agree, nothing to scale it against in the original photos.

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JTOMLINSON
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Reged: 16/02/05
Posts: 188
Loc: York, England
Re: Westley snap caps? [Re: casper50]
      #212379 - 09/07/12 05:32 PM

Casper

Many of the English made snap caps for the .410 bore do not have the calibre on. Some makers do not even head stamp the .410 size due to the small diameter. I have seen Westley Richards .410 snap caps without any calibre engraving so it is indeed possible they are .410.

It is however equally posisble that they are rifle snap caps also, (as many of these do not have calibre on either) and that they have the same as or near identical dimensions to a .410 cap

The only way to tell for sure is to try them out If they are for a rifle they will have a taper to reflect the NE case they correspond with, if they are largely parallel then the bet is they are .410.

Jonathan

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casper50
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Reged: 18/10/07
Posts: 1446
Loc: Alaska
Re: Westley snap caps? [Re: JTOMLINSON]
      #212393 - 09/07/12 08:32 PM

I was able to send him photos of where I needed the measurements and he came back with a new head diameter.

Rim = .511
head = .452

When I get home from work i'll go through my books again.

Jonathan did you see the measurements that I took of a .410 case? These caps are smaller than a .410.

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JTOMLINSON
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Reged: 16/02/05
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Re: Westley snap caps? [Re: casper50]
      #212445 - 10/07/12 05:37 PM

Casper

The sizes you give do seem different to a usual .410 but do remember that as snap caps are hand made or at least run off in limited production numbers and are not subject to the same dimensional tolerancing as loaded ammunition, then sizes between different makers may vary and the caps will always be smaller than chamber size for obvious reasons.

That said if there appears lots of taper on the side walls then I would venture to suggest some form of rifle snap cap as has been said already. Most shotgun snap caps are parallel give or take a few thousands of an inch of taper. I do not have any case sizes before me at present to suggest what other chamber(s) they may fit.

If you wish for genuine W-R snap caps whith named headstamp you may wish to try Westley Richards in Birmingham, although they don't show them on their website they may well have a set in stock or have some run up for you. If you do have some made ask if they can be made by Mike Marsh. They know who Mike is as he makes most of their best quality case tools as indeed he does for Purdey, Boss and H&H and a number of thye other famous names still in business.

Mike makes snap caps from a variety of materials including Nickel Silver, brass/ebony; brass/buffalo horn; and has also used ivory. The cost will be higher than run of the mill snap caps but then again the quality will be higher. If they are to go alongside your gun in a best quality oak and leather French fitted case then it would be worth the investment.



Jonathan

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casper50
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Reged: 18/10/07
Posts: 1446
Loc: Alaska
Re: Westley snap caps? [Re: JTOMLINSON]
      #212454 - 10/07/12 07:07 PM

Jonathan they look as if they have taper to me.

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