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NitroXAdministrator
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India: Corbett: "Wild & Beautiful"
      #20897 - 15/11/04 01:44 AM

I was looking through a search on hunting in India and found this review of the book "Wild & Beautiful".

What do you think of the comments?



Part of the review by S. THEODORE BASKARAN

In reply to:

The book basically consists of nine chapters on varied topics such as the dhole, the tiger, the elephant, the lion, the tahr, the goral and the mahseer. ...........




In reply to:

WHAT pulls down the book are the pages devoted to Jim Corbett. And the title. The title serves as a window to what a book contains and many a good book has been discounted by its title. Why On Jim Corbett's Trail? What is the relevance? The author has devoted two chapters to Corbett and both make tedious reading.

Jim Corbett glamorised and popularised tiger hunting by accompanying dignitaries in their tiger pursuit. During the British Raj, tiger hunts became a bizarre ritual - often with Corbett as the chief priest - in which the predator became the prey. Long before big game hunters set foot in Africa, these nimrods were shooting tigers by the thousands in India. Not just the tiger but anything that showed up in the jungle, from the giant squirrel to the elephant, was shot. Johnsingh himself recounts an incident in which Corbett shot three gorals one after another. There were detailed how-to-do-it manuals on hunting. Brown sahibs followed their white sahibs and hunting acquired a snob value, quite like golf. After Independence, Corbett moved over to Africa and continued his profession there.




In reply to:

SHIKAR literature came out at a time when there was very little awareness about wildlife and forests. Now the situation has changed dramatically and we know that there was much yarn in this literature. Even when these books were published there were sceptical voices. Shikar literature may still sell, rather like Ian Fleming's novels. We have wildlife biologists now so why invoke the names of the Jim Corbetts and Kenneth Andersons? For those who still have the Corbett fixation, I recommend the chapter `Slouching from Kumaon' in the book Forster and Further (Orient Longman, 1993) by Sujit Mukherjee. It is unfortunate that while Corbett's contemporary W.H. Champion, a professional forester who formulated working plans, popularised wildlife photography and preached conservation, and Hugo Wood, who saved the Anamalai forests (Indira Gandhi National Park), have been forgotten, a national park has been named after Corbett.




In reply to:

Surprisingly, or not surprisingly, Johnsingh himself supports hunting and cites the United States, South Africa and Zimbabwe where it has been used for conservation. "India, however, has neglected this aspect of wildlife management," he says. It would be a matter of deep concern if a wildlife biologist believes that hunting could help conservation. Has not that myth been exploded long back? We now know that hunting accounted for 25 per cent of extinctions.

In the history of conservation not a single species has been saved by hunting. On the other hand, the list of species shot out of existence is long. The gaur was wiped out of the Javadhi hills (Tamil Nadu) mainly by trophy hunters. In India, hunters have pushed many creatures, such as the lion, the tahr and the grey jungle fowl to the brink of extinction. Which species is in such abundance as to be subjected to hunting?

In post-Independence India, a new brand of hunter appeared, who, unfamiliar with wildlife, could not tell a stag from a doe. Indifferent to seasons, he shot anything that moved in the forest. Large-scale carnage followed until we almost lost the tiger, along with other animals such as the tahr. Shooting by the armed forces in remote areas added to the decline of endangered species. Salim Ali once found the feathers of the Great Indian Bustard in an army mess in Kutch and protested against it.







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John aka NitroX

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ovis
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Re: India: Corbett: "Wild & Beautiful" [Re: NitroX]
      #20905 - 15/11/04 06:31 AM

NitroX,

These comments are sad and the writer is just disregarding historical facts to further a personal agenda. The comment about the three ghorals taken by Corbett, I'm sure, refers to a part of the tale of the "Champawat Maneater". Corbett, as I recall, was trying to win the confidence of the local villagers, who were terrified by the tiger......Corbett told them he would shoot them some meat if some of the villagers would accompany him; basically to show him the lay of the land.........as I recall, he shot two ghoral for the villagers and one for his men. Comments downing famous hunters, as well as hunters in general, seems to be the rule rather than the exception now-a-days. On a lighter note John, if you haven't already., try to find a copy of "Trysts with Tigers" by Sher Jung. Published in New Dehli, it's a pretty good read.

Joe

--------------------
"Where there's a hobble, there's hope."


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Marrakai
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Re: India: Corbett: "Wild & Beautiful" [Re: NitroX]
      #20921 - 15/11/04 07:34 PM

What a load of rubbish! Not worth posting over, really.

"In the history of conservation not a single species has been saved by hunting."

...obviously never been to Africa or the US!

Probably never been anywhere, really, with his head that far up his arse!

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Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
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ALAN_MCKENZIE
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Re: India: Corbett: "Wild & Beautiful" [Re: Marrakai]
      #20923 - 15/11/04 10:17 PM

Well said Tony.
I agree completely with your comments..
Al

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Sir Seretse Khama.25th June 1949


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Taos
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Re: India: Corbett: "Wild & Beautiful" [Re: ALAN_MCKENZIE]
      #20925 - 16/11/04 02:36 AM

What a crock of shit!! As I recall from Corbett's writings he took only maneaters. I guess lives saved count for nothing. India has such a plethora of wildlife these days compared to a hundred years ago!!

Think of what a well funded wildlife division could have done over the last 40 years or so. Funded by well managed sport hunting we India may have been what southern Africa is today to hunters all over the world.

But no we are seeing the sunset of most big game in India and have to see drivel like the above in print. What crap!!


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AussieMike
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Re: India: Corbett: "Wild & Beautiful" [Re: Marrakai]
      #20930 - 16/11/04 08:06 AM

Marrakai,

While my first inclination is to agree with you I wonder whether we houldn't be doing something to counter the reviewer's comments.

Where was the review published; is there a letters to the editor section; should we write to the editor anyway. If no-one refutes this crap it will become seen as "fact". It probably will be anyway but we should probably try to counter it.

"If you don't fight, you lose" (Redgum, 1970's).

mike


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Jase
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Re: India: Corbett: "Wild & Beautiful" [Re: Taos]
      #20936 - 16/11/04 11:03 AM

In reply to:

As I recall from Corbett's writings he took only maneaters.




Unfortunately not true.....read the chapter on the Bachelor of Powlgarh from "Maneater of Kumaon"....Corbett freely admits to hunting this one purely for the sport and becuase it was a magnificent specimen highly sought after by visiting hunters....regardless we shouldnt judge a man like Corbett using today's values......he lived in the first half of the 20th century and values and beliefs were very different to now......he had a genuine love and admiration for the animals he hunted and even talks in depth about how his greatest challenge was his "hunt" to put tigers in the wild on movie film for the first time ever......a gentleman who lived a life to be envied i believe.......



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cheers
Jase


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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: India: Corbett: "Wild & Beautiful" [Re: Jase]
      #20938 - 16/11/04 01:20 PM

In reply to:

regardless we shouldnt judge a man like Corbett using today's values






"Today's values" also say we should be able to hunt tiger. If tiger is not in sufficient numbers in any location they should be managed to be able to be hunted therefore providing a future benefit of the conservation programme.

The same sort of 'conservation' (ie to use wisely) that brought the white rhino back from the brink and hopefully also the black rhino. In countries this ignorant reviewer derides because they allow hunting.

I wonder how the Indian rhino conservation efforts are going in comparison to those in Southern Africa.

It really irks me that this 'holy-than-thou' reviewer did not mention Corbett's killing of maneaters. Obviously he holds the lives of his fellow Indians less highly than animals and more likely his philosophies.


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John aka NitroX

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"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
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Jase
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Re: India: Corbett: "Wild & Beautiful" [Re: NitroX]
      #20939 - 16/11/04 01:35 PM

I agree...what i meant but didnt make clear was that the reviewer shouldnt judge Corbett using their own "modern values"......sustainable hunting was in his mind as much as ours today....

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Jase


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AussieMike
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Re: India: Corbett: "Wild & Beautiful" [Re: Jase]
      #20959 - 17/11/04 11:19 AM

It is interesting, though, to read books from the 1880's where writers decry the lack of game compared to 20 years earlier - a decrease they attribute to hunting pressure (eg Hunting in Ceylon).

mike


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SteveM
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Re: India: Corbett: "Wild & Beautiful" [Re: NitroX]
      #21478 - 30/11/04 07:37 AM


"In reply to:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

... It is unfortunate that while Corbett's contemporary W.H. Champion, a professional forester who formulated working plans, popularised wildlife photography and preached conservation, and Hugo Wood, who saved the Anamalai forests (Indira Gandhi National Park), have been forgotten, a national park has been named after Corbett. "


If I remember correctly he was also instrumental in getting the park that is named for him set up in the first place and helped the government of the day to begin conservation programs. However once the 'national' government took over many of the programs went away.

Seems to me from his books he very much cared for the wildlife in his home country especially the tiger which he believed was often misrepresented as a 'cruel and evil' animal.

But then what do you expect from reviewers who have probably never seen 'wild' animals outside the zoo and believe animal populations can never be large enough even though there is no longer the habitat to support unlimited populations.

SteveM


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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: India: Corbett: "Wild & Beautiful" [Re: SteveM]
      #26602 - 21/02/05 12:13 PM

BTT

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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mehulkamdar
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Re: India: Corbett: "Wild & Beautiful" [Re: NitroX]
      #26641 - 22/02/05 08:19 AM

Corbett shot maneaters and tigers for sport when there were many animals in India and they were cared for in wildlife preserves. The tiger hunt was usually a social affair with hunters going out on elephants to shoot driven tigers in something that resembled a driven pheasant shoot. In 1947 when India became independent thre were tens of thousands of tigers in the country, India also had leopards, the Asiatic cheetah etc. By 1956 the Asiatic cheetah was extinct, the tiger is probably well on the road to extinction now and so is a lot of other game.

It takes a second rate conservationist to make a name for himself by attacking someone with a big reputation because the press loves this kind of thing and that, perhaps, would have helped sell Johnsingh's book. Other than that, I doubt the book is really worth the paper that it is printed on.

Good hunting!

--------------------
The Ark was made by amateurs. Experts built the Titanic.

Mehul Kamdar


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Mpofu
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Re: India: Corbett: "Wild & Beautiful" [Re: NitroX]
      #27022 - 01/03/05 03:18 AM

John,
The author of the book is someone who has chosen to ignore some pretty well known historical facts.
Almost all the Tiger reserves and sanctuaries in India are the old hunting grounds of the Maharajas, ie.. Ranthambore , Kaziranga, Kanha and Bandhavgarh... the list goes on.
Is it not strange that wildlife,in particular Tigers, flourished in these areas till they were nationalised by the Governmment, and turned into wildlife sanctuaries.From thenon it all went tits up. This fact is not just a coincidence.
Corbett was a sportsman, who was priveliged to enjoy sport that was in some considerable abundance. The fact that the mela(fair) at Rudraprayag, held in honour of the killing of the maneating leopard is still held today, validates the reputation of the man. Corbett is a hunting legend, and the hill folks almost worshipped him.When he saw the threat, he turned conservationist, in fact in some of his later speeches and writings he almost sounds like an anti.
He moved to Africa, not to hunt, but simply because he felt it was time to do so, given the political climate.
I am afraid India is now full of the 'home grown experts' whose knowledge comes out of reference books in the local library.In fact, a senior range officer I was chatting with a few weeks ago referred to the 'fat twat' Val Thapar, the so called Tiger expert, who claimed a tiger is much quicker than a leopard in it's initial burst, when attacking prey...the mind boggles.
I shall get off my soap box now, and stop attempting to preach to the converted !!!
M.


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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: India: Corbett: "Wild & Beautiful" [Re: Mpofu]
      #27033 - 01/03/05 09:35 AM

Mehul and Mpofu

Don't get off your soapboxes. What you write is interesting to read. Of course not many people agree with the writer above but most of us do not have the first hand knowledge of local conditions today. For example it is interesting to read of the "mela" you refer to.

Thanks and keep it up.


--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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