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Hunting >> Hunting in the Americas
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gryphon
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Reged: 01/01/03
Posts: 5487
Loc: Sambar ground/Victoria/Austral...
End of the pen? Wall St Journal,top read
      #169903 - 20/10/10 05:48 AM

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704518104575546253717892686.html

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bonanza
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Reged: 17/05/04
Posts: 2335
Loc: South Carolina
Re: End of the pen? Wall St Journal,top read [Re: gryphon]
      #169904 - 20/10/10 06:18 AM

I don't see a problem with farm raised game. If you have ever lived in a crappy hunting area, or spent $$$$ to hunt public land and never see a single four legged animal in 5 days, then spending $5000 for a once-in-a-lifetime elk is money well spent.

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"Speak Precisely" G. Gordon Liddy.

"Life is absurd, chaotic and we must define its purpose with our actions" Abert Camus

"I''m the dude playing a dude disguised as another dude."

"Yo! Mr. White"

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crkennedy1
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Reged: 05/12/08
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Re: End of the pen? Wall St Journal,top read [Re: bonanza]
      #169908 - 20/10/10 07:17 AM

There seems to be strong arguments for both sides of this issue. On the one hand, I can see somebody wanting to get a nice animal when they've spent half their life trying to get one in the wild and all they run into is a bunch of other hunters doing the same thing - it can be frustrating! On the other hand, pen/farm raised animals have potential to carry all sorts of nasty diseases that could potentially decimate wild populations (like cronic waisting disease). I think that the solution is that if private hunting is to be allowed, there must be enough room to still make it "fair chase". From what I understand, it seems to work in Texas.

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DOUBLE or NOTHING

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gryphon
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Reged: 01/01/03
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Re: End of the pen? Wall St Journal,top read [Re: crkennedy1]
      #169911 - 20/10/10 08:14 AM

My post wasnt an either way view it was a heads up on what is liable to happen..they did it here in NSW with Avalon Park "Safaris"

And the greens will be in there hiding their faces but voting also.

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crkennedy1
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Reged: 05/12/08
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Re: End of the pen? Wall St Journal,top read [Re: gryphon]
      #169912 - 20/10/10 08:23 AM

I think we need to help the non-hunters see that in some cases, "private" hunting is a good thing, but it must not be abused. We can look to South Africa as a good example of this. In many ways, animals have been saved beacuse of of it (the rhino comes to mind).

--------------------
DOUBLE or NOTHING

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bonanza
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Reged: 17/05/04
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Re: End of the pen? Wall St Journal,top read [Re: crkennedy1]
      #169919 - 20/10/10 10:16 AM

I've been to Colorado twice Elk hunting only to have paid thousands of dollars to be placed in an overly hunted area and see nothing. The article said there were 40 elk in 2000 acres, 2000/40 = 50 acres per Elk. That's a lot of land for the Elk to run.

If the hunter feels he worked his butt off, then SO WHAT if the animal was bred.

--------------------


"Speak Precisely" G. Gordon Liddy.

"Life is absurd, chaotic and we must define its purpose with our actions" Abert Camus

"I''m the dude playing a dude disguised as another dude."

"Yo! Mr. White"

Edited by bonanza (20/10/10 10:17 AM)

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Ripp
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Reged: 19/02/07
Posts: 16072
Loc: Montana, USA
Re: End of the pen? Wall St Journal,top read [Re: bonanza]
      #169951 - 20/10/10 11:40 PM

Quote:

I've been to Colorado twice Elk hunting only to have paid thousands of dollars to be placed in an overly hunted area and see nothing.



Just MHO, but if that is the case you went with a shitty outfitter...I know many outfitters in Montana--and the way they conduct their business would never allow for that type of hunt to occur..perfect example , I have one outfitter who leases 60,000 acres from a rancher--he limits the total number of bulls shot per year to 8 to 10 depending on the quality he is seeing...which prevents what you are describing above from happening...having said that, hunting is hunting..you are never guaranteed to harvest an animal ever in the wild...Living here in Montana--there are MANY times I go out and don't shoot or get a shot at anything...which is fine as just hiking in the woods most times is "lucky enough".. and I am just lucky enough to live here so I can try and try --and we have a very long season...

another issue is you need to check out the outfitter prior to plopping down you hard earned $$...check references, ask specific questions, etc....had a friend just in the last few weeks, drove to BC to hunt grizzly and moose--after 6 days he packed up his equipment and left--what the guy had advertised as a horseback hunt ended up being a hunt from the truck driving roads and glassing...again, IMHO, that is NOT hunting...

as to private (high fenced) or public...each to their own, really have no dog in this fight...whatever floats your boat...personally however, most of the big animals I have ever shot has been on public land..no fees, no guides, just getting out there, and if you are willing to hike more than 2 or 3 miles from the main road, 99% of the time you will be by yourself as most are too lazy to put more effort into it than that...again, just my opinion..

Ripp

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ALL MEN DIE, BUT FEW MEN TRULY LIVE..

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9.3x57
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Reged: 22/04/07
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Re: End of the pen? Wall St Journal,top read [Re: bonanza]
      #169966 - 21/10/10 12:31 PM

Quote:

50 acres per Elk. That's a lot of land for the Elk to run.

If the hunter feels he worked his butt off, then SO WHAT if the animal was bred.



1} I don't care if a guy kills elk, deer, rhino, buffalo, rabbits, sheep, chickens or starlings on a fenced chunk of ground. So what. Let the market decide what the farmer can raise and let the guy with the gun harvest it.

2} 50 ACRES IS A LOT OF GROUND FOR ELK TO RUN? 50 acres isn't a lot of land for a rabbit. 50 acres?

Blair, I own 540 acres here in Idaho. That ground currently supports 5 resident deer. 5. And they roam on and off the place. Elk? They cover thousands of acres.

Elk kept on 50 acres/elk are gaoled elk.

OK by me to kill them in the cage. I've killed rabbits in a cage before when we raised them for hasenpfeffer so I have no problem with killing gaoled elk. But they are still behind bars.

Kinda like shivving your sleeping cell mate with a sharpened spoon.

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What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?

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AspenHill
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Reged: 08/01/03
Posts: 1528
Loc: Vermont, USA
Re: End of the pen? Wall St Journal,top read [Re: 9.3x57]
      #170088 - 24/10/10 12:47 AM

I'm off to a pen next weekend to shoot a red stag for the freezer. I can't afford a large stag, it's a cull and really, for the meat and to shoot my nice .375 H&H at something other than paper. It will be fun to see what the big trophy stags look like. It's not a native animal here and by no means do I consider this a hunt. I'll still have fun anyway, I have a hunt buddy attending with me for the same reason, meat.

In November I will go off to hunt whitetails in western New York state. Them be wild deer for sure!

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~Ann

Everyday spent outdoors is the best day of my life.

Aspen Hill Adventures

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9.3x57
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Reged: 22/04/07
Posts: 5521
Loc: United States
Re: End of the pen? Wall St Journal,top read [Re: AspenHill]
      #170092 - 24/10/10 03:17 AM

That's the spirit, Ann. Nothing wrong with filling the freezer, and your attitude about it is the right one to have all the way as opposed to those who hang the rack up and glory in their prowess.

Enjoy those steaks!

Oh, and if you get a decent 4 point in the Adirondacks you have every right to glory in your prowess!

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What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?

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tinker
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Reged: 12/03/05
Posts: 4835
Loc: Nevada
Re: End of the pen? Wall St Journal,top read [Re: 9.3x57]
      #170093 - 24/10/10 03:20 AM

I'll second my 9.3mm friend on that meat agenda.
No better way to get fresh organic meat in the freezer than to kill it yourself.

I'd definitely raid the pen to feed the wife and kids!

On 50 acres per elk, my 40 barely contains my 3yr old boy!


Cheers
Tinker

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...

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