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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Paradox and Bore Guns

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elvas
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Reged: 18/04/06
Posts: 65
Loc: Thessaloniki, GREECE
US-S Slug
      #142183 - 17/09/09 06:08 PM

Gentlemen,
Our site is up and running.
We would really like your opinion.
Thank you.

Lefteris.
http://www.europeancartridgeunlimited.com/


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peter
removed


Reged: 11/04/07
Posts: 1493
Loc: denmark
Re: US-S Slug [Re: elvas]
      #142194 - 17/09/09 10:46 PM

looks interesting, what DG have you tested your slugs on ?

best

peter


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DarylS
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Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26992
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: US-S Slug [Re: peter]
      #142205 - 18/09/09 12:35 AM

Interesting design - should work OK for thsoe used to shooting sub-calibre sabots in 12 bore, but I'm not happy with it's small .629" size, slightly larger than 20 bore and smaller than 18.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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9.3x57
.450 member


Reged: 22/04/07
Posts: 5521
Loc: United States
Re: US-S Slug [Re: DarylS]
      #142211 - 18/09/09 01:11 AM

I have an accuracy question:

I believe it is common knowledge that sabot-type slug accuracy can be affected by the departing sabots, and any bullet that has petal-like centering wads would, I think, potentially at least be deflected somewhat by uneven peeling back or detachment of petals {lopsided drag} in flight.

Many sabot-type slugs now have the problems licked, but this one has me wondering?

Possibly the maker has done some accuracy testing results that could be shared?

Also, that heavyweight is one L--O--N--G bullet. What twist rate does it require or does the attached rear wad portion sufficient "badminton birdie" drag to stabilize it?

--------------------
What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?


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mehulkamdar
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Reged: 09/01/04
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Re: US-S Slug [Re: elvas]
      #142246 - 18/09/09 10:47 AM

Lefteris,

Do you have a plan for US sales?

Thanks for your post. I am interested.

--------------------
The Ark was made by amateurs. Experts built the Titanic.

Mehul Kamdar


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DarylS
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Re: US-S Slug [Re: mehulkamdar]
      #142311 - 19/09/09 03:12 AM

Rod - most rifled shotguns run 35" or thereabouts. This will stabilize fairly long projectiles of bore size, and with this bullet's lightweight plastic base wad, perhaps the length is imaterial? The petals breaking off evenly and not disrupting flight is a good question.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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500Nitro
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Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: US-S Slug [Re: DarylS]
      #142315 - 19/09/09 04:46 AM


Looks interesting.

Marrakai will be pleased after all the failures he has had with the slugs he has tried that are currently on the market.


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elvas
.275 member


Reged: 18/04/06
Posts: 65
Loc: Thessaloniki, GREECE
Re: US-S Slug [Re: 500Nitro]
      #142350 - 19/09/09 07:34 PM

Gentlemen,

Thank you for your intersting.

No tests on DG as of now. We will try it in some wild boars in the next weeks although I don't consider them as DG.
In the penetration tests we made the US-S slug has outpenetrated every lead slug that we could find in the market, here. Some of them has been rumored to kill Cape Buffalo.

We all know that the use of brass as a raw material for making solid shotgun slugs necessitate the use of a sabot for obvious reasons. We made a lot of tests to find the sabot dimensions so that all four petals break at the same time. Actually we find them (in a calm day) at about 7-8m in front of the muzzle, all four of them at the same place.

Using a Benelli Nova 12ga., 3.5", smoothbore barrel shotgun with cylinder choke tube, accuracy was one hole for 5 shots at 25m and 5cm for 5 shots at 50m from the bench.
We will make some accuracy tests from a pressure gun next week and I'll report the results.

The stabizing wad is long enough to stabilize even the US-S 970 slug. No keyholes or other such problems when we tested them. The design of the slug does not make the use of a fully rifled barrel necessary. We used some rifled choke tubes with not much accuracy improvement.

We are discussing with a company importation of the slugs in the U.S.A. market.
We are also looking for importers in other countries as well.

If anyone is going to hunt big or dangerous game and will have a 12ga. with him, we will be glad to send some slugs for testing and load data with components available in E.U. countries.

Lefteris
www.europeancartridgeunlimited.com


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500Nitro
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Reged: 06/01/03
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Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: US-S Slug [Re: elvas]
      #142352 - 19/09/09 07:55 PM


The lead slugs will kill Buffalo in Aust no problems (in the right spot) and I am sure these will as well.

If you want some pumped into DG (Buffalo),
this can be arranged.

I have sent you a PM.


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Rodders1
.224 member


Reged: 26/09/09
Posts: 18
Loc: Richmond, South Africa
Re: US-S Slug [Re: 500Nitro]
      #143139 - 05/10/09 06:25 AM

Wonder if these would work in the .72 Kodiak Express? Might be the answer for those wanting to take on dangerous game, but who are worried about the penetrating power of lead conicals!

--------------------
Make mine a double please!


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DarylS
.700 member


Reged: 10/08/05
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Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: US-S Slug [Re: Rodders1]
      #143191 - 06/10/09 01:21 AM

Trouble with any sort of wadded slug, is the plastic will melt onto the bore, just as it does in modern guns, but with a vengence. BP flame is much more intense or more of it and melts plastic badly. Putting a couple 1/8" card wds down first will limit the amount of plastic melted off the wads.

The ring and base wad are proably much larger than the bore on the .72 Pedersoli as they are designed to be a tight fit inside a shotshell. Only one way to find out about either of the potential problems.

A third is lubrication/fouling softener to allow loading the next one without having to clean the rifle.

Paper ctgs. are the very fastest, easiest and most accurate way to have follow up shots by reloading. With practice, I wad able to load and fire an aimed shot in 8 seconds using my 14 bore rifle and the tapered paper ctgs. I made. They had no lubricant, on them, so after 10 shots with them, I had to load a very wet, spit patched 3 dram load with pure lead ball, to 'clean' the bore. With 2 wraps of 20 pound printing paper around the ball, the rifling pressed hard into the ball when loading, so they there a very snug fit. Accuracy was identical to patched round ball - get this right- 1.2" to 1.5" at 100 meters for 5 shots - express sigths. The ctg. balls shoot right into the same group and with the same accuracy as carefully patched round balls, and also allow any alloy be used, which is why I developed them in the manner I did.

I initially bored an old mould to make an adjustable weight hollow based slug for the rifle, for a fast second shot after my light 484gr. ball. After firing a few of the 650gr. slugs, I decided I didn't like the arched trajectory, nor the increased recoil, nor the different point of impact. Thus, I developed the 1800's world-wide military paper ctg. into a hunting ctg. giving the same accuracy as patched balls. They work well, giving the best killing power of any ML projectile, load faster than a slug with premeasured, capsuled powder charges, are easy to make & can be carried in a pocket all hunting season or in a modified ctg. container on the belt, as such.
I use white glue for holding the paper ctgs. sides together. 2 wraps around the tapered dowel, glue, and let dry. Fold over the bottom point and glue. fill with powder charge, drop in a ball and fold the paper over the ball, gluing with white glue - done. Tear off the point with your teeth, shove ointed end into the bore, and the powder drains into the breech while you're pulling out the rod. Choke up on the rod to start the tight , now, paper patched ball, and then shove the entrie deal down the bore. The apper wads up between powder and the ball and helps form a seal. None of my paper ctgs. have ever caught fire nor even smoldered. This shows a perfect seal and no gas blowby. At the shot, there is a blast of confette-like paper bits in the air along with the smoke. I've never tried them with modern BP replacement propellents.
Soon, Bruce S. will be writing a book or article on this very subject. Fellows I've know have had excellent resutls form their .73's, .69's like mine, 16 bores, a .58 and one fellow with a .54 Pedersoli double rifle. all have received excellent accuracy.




Edited by CptCurl (16/07/11 10:32 PM)


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Rigby62
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Reged: 06/10/09
Posts: 12
Loc: Quakertown, PA
Re: US-S Slug [Re: DarylS]
      #143309 - 08/10/09 02:46 AM

I do like the look of those. They remind me of the Belt Mountain Punch bullet except they are hollowed and filled with lead to get the weight up. Would really like to give them a try.

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elvas
.275 member


Reged: 18/04/06
Posts: 65
Loc: Thessaloniki, GREECE
Re: US-S Slug [Re: Rigby62]
      #143594 - 13/10/09 06:53 PM

So far, two one shot kills with the US-S 570 slug, here in Greece. One head shot the other a body shot. Instant kills, no running. Slugs did not recovered.

Lefteris
www.europeancartridgeunlimited.com


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elvas
.275 member


Reged: 18/04/06
Posts: 65
Loc: Thessaloniki, GREECE
Re: US-S Slug [Re: elvas]
      #160948 - 24/05/10 06:24 PM

Ballistic gelatin US-S 570 slug test.
http://www.diyballistics.com/USS%20Slugs.html

Lefteris
http://www.europeancartridgeunlimited.com


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elvas
.275 member


Reged: 18/04/06
Posts: 65
Loc: Thessaloniki, GREECE
Re: US-S Slug [Re: elvas]
      #161663 - 08/06/10 06:15 AM

The US-S 570 slug, loaded in a 3" hull, at 1700f/s, was lately used in Africa taking Eland, Kudu and Wildbeest. Its use on Cape Buffalo was not permitted due to law restrictions.

Lefteris
http://europeancartridgeunlimited.com


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elvas
.275 member


Reged: 18/04/06
Posts: 65
Loc: Thessaloniki, GREECE
Re: US-S Slug [Re: elvas]
      #185878 - 15/07/11 04:36 PM

This is the Swift 12, a 320 grain, 12 gauge slug designed to be used in 3" chambers at high velocity.
So far we reached 2126f/s from 24" barrel and we continue testing in 3.5" hulls hoping to reach about 2500f/s at standard CIP pressures.



Lefteris
http://europeancartridgeunlimited.com

Edited by CptCurl (16/07/11 10:33 PM)


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elvas
.275 member


Reged: 18/04/06
Posts: 65
Loc: Thessaloniki, GREECE
Re: US-S Slug [Re: elvas]
      #192712 - 28/10/11 06:40 PM

The Lightning 12 is the lattest slug we make for 12ga shotguns. It is made of aluminum alloy and the weight is 198grains. Initial testings show a muzzle velocity of 2700f/s at very low pressure. We hope to reach 3000f/s in 3" hulls, maybe more in 3.5".
Some recovered Lightning 12 slugs.





Lefteris
http://www.europeancartridgeunlimited.com

Edited by CptCurl (25/11/11 11:35 PM)


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NitroXAdministrator
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Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39877
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...
Re: US-S Slug [Re: DarylS]
      #192774 - 30/10/11 12:48 AM

Quote:

Trouble with any sort of wadded slug, is the plastic will melt onto the bore, just as it does in modern guns, but with a vengence. BP flame is much more intense or more of it and melts plastic badly. Putting a couple 1/8" card wds down first will limit the amount of plastic melted off the wads.

The ring and base wad are proably much larger than the bore on the .72 Pedersoli as they are designed to be a tight fit inside a shotshell. Only one way to find out about either of the potential problems.

A third is lubrication/fouling softener to allow loading the next one without having to clean the rifle.

Paper ctgs. are the very fastest, easiest and most accurate way to have follow up shots by reloading. With practice, I wad able to load and fire an aimed shot in 8 seconds using my 14 bore rifle and the tapered paper ctgs. I made. They had no lubricant, on them, so after 10 shots with them, I had to load a very wet, spit patched 3 dram load with pure lead ball, to 'clean' the bore. With 2 wraps of 20 pound printing paper around the ball, the rifling pressed hard into the ball when loading, so they there a very snug fit. Accuracy was identical to patched round ball - get this right- 1.2" to 1.5" at 100 meters for 5 shots - express sigths. The ctg. balls shoot right into the same group and with the same accuracy as carefully patched round balls, and also allow any alloy be used, which is why I developed them in the manner I did.

I initially bored an old mould to make an adjustable weight hollow based slug for the rifle, for a fast second shot after my light 484gr. ball. After firing a few of the 650gr. slugs, I decided I didn't like the arched trajectory, nor the increased recoil, nor the different point of impact. Thus, I developed the 1800's world-wide military paper ctg. into a hunting ctg. giving the same accuracy as patched balls. They work well, giving the best killing power of any ML projectile, load faster than a slug with premeasured, capsuled powder charges, are easy to make & can be carried in a pocket all hunting season or in a modified ctg. container on the belt, as such.
I use white glue for holding the paper ctgs. sides together. 2 wraps around the tapered dowel, glue, and let dry. Fold over the bottom point and glue. fill with powder charge, drop in a ball and fold the paper over the ball, gluing with white glue - done. Tear off the point with your teeth, shove ointed end into the bore, and the powder drains into the breech while you're pulling out the rod. Choke up on the rod to start the tight , now, paper patched ball, and then shove the entrie deal down the bore. The apper wads up between powder and the ball and helps form a seal. None of my paper ctgs. have ever caught fire nor even smoldered. This shows a perfect seal and no gas blowby. At the shot, there is a blast of confette-like paper bits in the air along with the smoke. I've never tried them with modern BP replacement propellents.
Soon, Bruce S. will be writing a book or article on this very subject. Fellows I've know have had excellent resutls form their .73's, .69's like mine, 16 bores, a .58 and one fellow with a .54 Pedersoli double rifle. all have received excellent accuracy.








Excellent information.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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