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Hunting >> Hunting in Africa & hunting dangerous game

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9.3x57
.450 member


Reged: 22/04/07
Posts: 5520
Loc: United States
Re: More on lions in the pen [Re: shakari]
      #115867 - 30/09/08 02:03 AM

Interesting thread.

It highlights the different opinions held by many, and the difficulty in nailing down even within the hunting world what is acceptable and what is even "hunting" at all.

MANY forms of "hunting" are condemned by other hunters and others in the non-hunting population. And views change. Years ago, many in the hunting world took a dim view of hunting on enclosed South African game farms and called it unsporting. Early on, many saw such activity as a joke but now it is a highly developed industry and accepted practice. Things change. My son thinks that anybody that shoots deer from a box {on the ground or in a tree} is a joke. Many Americans laugh at German-style hunts involving bait and Hochsitze and night-time shooting. One gander at the sleeping-bag-style coats and heaters in the Frankonia Jagd catalogue sends Americans into howls of moral indignation. Put-and-take pheasant shooting is now well-established, but was considered highly unethical by many. Hound hunting is condemned by many hunters as unethical. Bowhunting is criticized by rifle hunters. Muzzle-loaders condemn rifle shooters. Lots of folks hate trapping, and falconers think shotgunners lack skill and honor. Many condemn the leaving of animal carcasses in the bush as in much Aussie hunting, some trapping in the states and in the past the leaving of bear here in Idaho. Many consider any killing of game over bait to be completely unsporting, indecent and shameful.

I really do not have a strong opinion on canned lion hunts, because much of African hunting is so "industrialized" that it is hard for me to condemn one form without including many others and I do not want to condemn other forms. A difference in degree is really the only difference. Peter's tongue-in-cheek was hilarious and really makes the point!! But if he decides he wants to knock that harty down with a ball-peen hammer and put the steaks in the freezer, well, so be it.

But seriously, I do not see many hunting methods or practices as "right" or "wrong", but rather as needing to evolve out of the conditions and traditions of the local area. AND IF PRESENTED HONESTLY, any method is fine by me though I may laugh at some and I reserve the right to poke fun at certain expressions of hairy-chested bravado when I know it is bunk.

The biggest problem with the canned-lion thing is just that: where someone shoots a pinned, bolted and screwed together lion in a pen and then proclaims to the rest of us that his accomplishment rivals King David's slaying of the bear with a club.

--------------------
What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?


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450_366
.400 member


Reged: 17/01/07
Posts: 1068
Loc: Sweden, west-coast.
Re: More on lions in the pen [Re: 9.3x57]
      #115887 - 30/09/08 06:47 AM

But if the canned lion now is habitated and only sees human as deliverers of food, and perhaps a bit pissed that he needs to get the food by himself. It could actually be quite sporting if you are in a close fenced area and nowing for sure his out there, couldnt it?

--------------------
Andreas

"Yeas it kicks like a mule he said, but always remember that its much worse standing on the other end"


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peter
removed


Reged: 11/04/07
Posts: 1493
Loc: denmark
Re: More on lions in the pen [Re: 450_366]
      #115889 - 30/09/08 07:26 AM

did'nt the romans have a sporting event involving lions and christians, i think it was pretty close quarter and a bit canned.

chasing animals up a tree and then shoot them sounds completly non-sporting to people who havent tried it(i will try it eventually)

or shoting a moose as it is bayed by ONE dog, it dont seem fair do it(did this and it is a work of art )

i dont have any answers and i just go by my gut feeling, you know if you are not doing it right.

best regards

peter


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Ripp
.577 member


Reged: 19/02/07
Posts: 16072
Loc: Montana, USA
Re: More on lions in the pen [Re: 450_366]
      #115910 - 30/09/08 11:59 AM

Quote:

But if the canned lion now is habitated and only sees human as deliverers of food, and perhaps a bit pissed that he needs to get the food by himself. It could actually be quite sporting if you are in a close fenced area and nowing for sure his out there, couldnt it?





++++++++++++


In most of the conversations I have had with PH's or clients that do hunt the "canned" variety..a high percentage do end up with a charge as they do relate humans with food and come straight at them when in close proximity...have never been on one and probably never will..just what I have heard...

Per an article I read recently on the deaths in Africa by game, in particular lions..it would appear the non-canned lions relate humans with food as well..

Ripp

--------------------
ALL MEN DIE, BUT FEW MEN TRULY LIVE..


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NitroXAdministrator
.700 member


Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39828
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...
Re: More on lions in the pen [Re: Ripp]
      #115949 - 30/09/08 08:27 PM

Quote:

Per an article I read recently on the deaths in Africa by game, in particular lions..it would appear the non-canned lions relate humans with food as well..




Have lost their fear of man.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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Ripp
.577 member


Reged: 19/02/07
Posts: 16072
Loc: Montana, USA
Re: More on lions in the pen [Re: NitroX]
      #115967 - 30/09/08 10:38 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Per an article I read recently on the deaths in Africa by game, in particular lions..it would appear the non-canned lions relate humans with food as well..




Have lost their fear of man.




Exactely my point...we have a similar situation here in Montana in that grizzly's have not been hunted for over 2 decades...they no longer fear man and the incidence of attacks has increased greatly..while deaths are rare...the maulings are not--especially among bow hunters during the elk rut cycle in Sept/Oct period...

Ripp

--------------------
ALL MEN DIE, BUT FEW MEN TRULY LIVE..


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450_366
.400 member


Reged: 17/01/07
Posts: 1068
Loc: Sweden, west-coast.
Re: More on lions in the pen [Re: Ripp]
      #116052 - 01/10/08 09:19 PM

Arent there a problem with habitated wolfs in canada to? Here in sweden they are becomming more and more cheeky and getting closer then ever to humans. A result of not hunting them probably.

--------------------
Andreas

"Yeas it kicks like a mule he said, but always remember that its much worse standing on the other end"


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