Home | Ezine | Forums | Links | Contact
NitroExpress.com: SHOW ME!! Brit Singles???

View recent messages : 24 hours | 48 hours | 7 days | 14 days | 30 days | 60 days | More Smilies


*** Enjoy NitroExpress.com? Participate and join in. ***
You are not logged in. [Login] Main Index · Search · Active Topics
New user · Who's Online · FAQ · Calendar

Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Single Shots & Combination Guns
Previous topic Previous   View all topics Index   Next topic Next   Threaded Mode Threaded  

Pages: 1
9.3x57
.450 member


Reged: 22/04/07
Posts: 5521
Loc: United States
SHOW ME!! Brit Singles???
      #106052 - 26/05/08 12:38 AM

OK, help me out here. I have never owned one, but am fascinated by British big bore cartridge singles.

During their heyday, what was the driving force for their existence?

Cheaper than Doubles Cost?

Lack of Magazine Rifles in Heavy Calibers?

My take is that the dropping block English gun was a hangover from when singles really meant something...in the 1870's-1880's, just before the advent of the magazine rifle, and they just sort-of staggered along like a gutshot stray dog, looking for a place to lay down for good...

Yup, that last statement was meant to dig you Singles Nuts out of the woodwork.

Pic's?

Thoughts?

--------------------
What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
gatsby
.375 member


Reged: 05/09/05
Posts: 862
Loc: inland valley CA USA
Re: SHOW ME!! Brit Singles??? [Re: 9.3x57]
      #106076 - 26/05/08 06:15 AM

Singles were cheaper and handier because of weight than a double. Many sportsmen and writers in the day recommended singles as part of an African/Indian battery. Clive Wolley wrote in his book Big Game Shooting "If,however, I were to recommend a first rate battery for East Africa, I should say:
A single four bore
A double eight bore
A double five hundred express
A single four fifty express
A double twenty bore paradox

--------------------
"Recoil is insignificant when there is a tiger on the head of your elephant" The Maharaja of Cooch Behar



Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
9.3x57
.450 member


Reged: 22/04/07
Posts: 5521
Loc: United States
Re: SHOW ME!! Brit Singles??? [Re: gatsby]
      #106083 - 26/05/08 08:56 AM

Thanks!

So there was a perceived advantage that went beyond cost.

That was what I was wondering.

How about after magazine rifles were well intrenched?

I do not remember reading much on this topic, but can anyone reference "debates" as to the benefits of a single over a magazine rifle during, say, the 1900-1925 period, or did singles merely hang on because oldtimers were used to them or magazine rifle actions were unavilable to the Brit makers during war, etc.?

Rifle nuts argue many points today that outsiders must look at as esoteric in the extreme, and I am wondering if such debates existed in the early 1900's, too, between magazine aficionados and the fans of the single shot.

--------------------
What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
dnovo
.333 member


Reged: 21/02/05
Posts: 490
Loc: Chicago & SE Wisconsin
Re: SHOW ME!! Brit Singles??? [Re: 9.3x57]
      #106084 - 26/05/08 09:33 AM

Okay, Big Brit Single Shots of the pre-1898 NE era:

Jack Puglisi and I did some horse trading recently and part of his payment to me for several items from my collection were a pair of Alex Henry Single Shots of the 1878-90 era. Both were 'best guns' as in fully engraved, beautiful wood and great condition. Both are now locked up here, but I am doing some loads now to shoot. They were a 450 in a take down (it is easy to tell in an Alex Henry as the forend on the fixed bbl models uses the wedge and the take downs use a lever forend) and a 577 BP, a much larger, heavier brother -- in its engraving style, etc -- to the 450. Since Jack's photos are outstanding, here are a couple of them. The rest can be found at his site for a while longer until he does an update next week.

Here are a few shots of the 577, which is a much heavier rifle to carry than its 450, more 'dual purpose' half brother. However, I am sure the extra weight of the 577 will be appreciated as soon as I get the loads ready and take them our to the range. Enjoy.

BTW I also have a few WRs and Gibbs, from this era as well as the NE era. I will post some shots of those later next month. Dave





















--------------------
Time Wounds All Heels

Edited by CptCurl (26/11/12 11:06 PM)

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
9.3x57
.450 member


Reged: 22/04/07
Posts: 5521
Loc: United States
Re: SHOW ME!! Brit Singles??? [Re: dnovo]
      #106085 - 26/05/08 09:52 AM

W...O...W...

Keep 'em coming!

This ought to be fun.

BTW: Do you have any idea how many falling block singles of whatever type were made by {any of} the companies?

--------------------
What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
dnovo
.333 member


Reged: 21/02/05
Posts: 490
Loc: Chicago & SE Wisconsin
Re: SHOW ME!! Brit Singles??? [Re: 9.3x57]
      #106095 - 26/05/08 12:01 PM

I think the production figures are listed in the "The British Falling Block Breechloading Rifle from 1865" by Jonathan G. Kirton as well as in the multi-volume work on individual mfgs, in the first volume of the five now out, "British Single Shot Rifles, Vol. 1; Alexander Henry" By the way, in the list shown in this first volume, you will see that Alex Henry made more than all other mfgs. After he died right at the beginning of the NE era, the company was absorbed by others and the single shot focus seemed to shift to Gibbs and others. Still, if you look through the various catalogs all through the first two decades of the Twentieth Century, Westley Richards, H&H, and a few others always had single shots listed for sale, including more than a few in the 500, 577 and 600 NE class. A very British, and very long-lived creature. They are survived today by the Ruger No. 1, the Hagn, the Dakota 10 (offered in some fairly stout loadings) etc but no longer built in Britain. Strange, but the Single Shot tradition is as the American (or, considering Hagn, Canadian via Rolf and Martin's German training)as Apple Pie and has strong roots on the Continent as well. Dave

--------------------
Time Wounds All Heels

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
9.3x57
.450 member


Reged: 22/04/07
Posts: 5521
Loc: United States
Re: SHOW ME!! Brit Singles??? [Re: dnovo]
      #106097 - 26/05/08 12:10 PM

Thanks for the sources. Will look them up.

--------------------
What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
dnovo
.333 member


Reged: 21/02/05
Posts: 490
Loc: Chicago & SE Wisconsin
Re: SHOW ME!! Brit Singles??? [Re: 9.3x57]
      #106098 - 26/05/08 12:17 PM

Sorry, caught me in mid-edit. The corrected note has the proper titles. The books, all of them including the multi volume work, are very, very detailed. A bit specialized, but if you want some great photos and detailed data, they are unique. Serial number information where the ledgers survive is included. I was able to trace several of my Alex Henry, WR and Gibbs through these books. Dave

--------------------
Time Wounds All Heels

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Nakihunter
.375 member


Reged: 13/10/07
Posts: 588
Loc: New Zealand
Re: SHOW ME!! Brit Singles??? [Re: dnovo]
      #106117 - 26/05/08 04:26 PM

Wow, awesome, incredibly beautiful.....!!! Heart pounding!

Dave, what about Daniel Frazer? Was he more NE erea. I understand that he was also a master of the single shots.

I look forward to more on this thread.

--------------------
Always shoot through the target & not just at it.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
gatsby
.375 member


Reged: 05/09/05
Posts: 862
Loc: inland valley CA USA
Re: SHOW ME!! Brit Singles??? [Re: 9.3x57]
      #106120 - 26/05/08 04:53 PM

Holland 4 bore. Unengraved simple brute force.









--------------------
"Recoil is insignificant when there is a tiger on the head of your elephant" The Maharaja of Cooch Behar



Edited by CptCurl (26/11/12 11:06 PM)

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Nakihunter
.375 member


Reged: 13/10/07
Posts: 588
Loc: New Zealand
Re: SHOW ME!! Brit Singles??? [Re: gatsby]
      #106121 - 26/05/08 05:39 PM

Gatsby, great rifle!

What leather is that? My guess would be Ostrich as it looks like feather roots.

--------------------
Always shoot through the target & not just at it.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
gatsby
.375 member


Reged: 05/09/05
Posts: 862
Loc: inland valley CA USA
Re: SHOW ME!! Brit Singles??? [Re: Nakihunter]
      #106123 - 26/05/08 06:04 PM

Thank you It is ostrich.

--------------------
"Recoil is insignificant when there is a tiger on the head of your elephant" The Maharaja of Cooch Behar



Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
dnovo
.333 member


Reged: 21/02/05
Posts: 490
Loc: Chicago & SE Wisconsin
Re: SHOW ME!! Brit Singles??? [Re: Nakihunter]
      #106140 - 26/05/08 11:52 PM

You REALLY should buy those books I mentioned. If you are a fan of single shots, these will keep you drooling for months. I have a Frazier side lever in a 450-400, nitro proofed. Also a nice rifle. I'll try to post some pics soon. Dave

--------------------
Time Wounds All Heels

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
dnovo
.333 member


Reged: 21/02/05
Posts: 490
Loc: Chicago & SE Wisconsin
Re: SHOW ME!! Brit Singles??? [Re: dnovo]
      #106141 - 26/05/08 11:53 PM

Gatsby: Outstanding!!!! Dave

--------------------
Time Wounds All Heels

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
bouldersmith
.375 member


Reged: 23/03/06
Posts: 627
Loc: Boulder Colorado
Re: SHOW ME!! Brit Singles??? [Re: dnovo]
      #106143 - 27/05/08 12:08 AM







A couple of pictures....I need to tak some full length photos of these two. The Westley is in .256 and the Holland is a .30 super, niether big bores but both fun guns.
Steve

--------------------
New website http://www.bertramandco.com

Edited by CptCurl (26/11/12 11:07 PM)

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
dnovo
.333 member


Reged: 21/02/05
Posts: 490
Loc: Chicago & SE Wisconsin
Re: SHOW ME!! Brit Singles??? [Re: bouldersmith]
      #106153 - 27/05/08 05:07 AM

Sweet! Dave

--------------------
Time Wounds All Heels

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
1980E26
.300 member


Reged: 03/05/05
Posts: 195
Loc: USA
Re: SHOW ME!! Brit Singles??? [Re: dnovo]
      #106167 - 27/05/08 12:37 PM



Here is one that is not too often encountered.








Corbin

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Anonymous
Unregistered




Re: SHOW ME!! Brit Singles??? [Re: 9.3x57]
      #106169 - 27/05/08 12:59 PM

very nice.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
DoubleD
.400 member


Reged: 23/11/03
Posts: 2437
Loc: Retired in Oklahoma
Re: SHOW ME!! Brit Singles??? [Re: 1980E26]
      #106170 - 27/05/08 01:09 PM

You want the pretty ones?


I Hollis .218 Mashburn Bee


I. Hollis 450 Musket 2

Or the plain janes


Westley Richard 1871 Patent 1 1/2 Carbine


.577 Snider Jeffery's


Swinburn Carbine

Don't have any pictures yet of the 577 2 3/4 NE Greener

Edited by CptCurl (26/11/12 11:09 PM)

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Glenn_Fewless
.300 member


Reged: 08/05/08
Posts: 103
Loc: Wisconsin, USA
Re: SHOW ME!! Brit Singles??? [Re: DoubleD]
      #106173 - 27/05/08 01:56 PM

Gentlemens:

Good stuff. More that one of those provoked me into impure thoughts. The Frasers are fabulous! The Soper is the nicest one I have seen. Mr. Bouldersmith's W.R. will do as well. I even like the W.R. Improved Martini, although I really covet a model of '69.

Here are a couple pictures of a recently acquired Gibbs Farquharson. Curiously, while someone restocked and rebarreled it into a target rifle, the action appears to be untouched with original finish and all. It will be a sporting rifle again some day. I have the action and the stock blank. All I need is time...

Glenn









Edited by CptCurl (26/11/12 11:10 PM)

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Mike_Bailey
.400 member


Reged: 26/02/07
Posts: 2289
Loc: GB
Re: SHOW ME!! Brit Singles??? [Re: dnovo]
      #106188 - 27/05/08 10:59 PM

Dnovo, keep watching, I have it on very good authority you may be able to buy a NEW Holland and Holland single shot within 2 years best, Mike

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
dnovo
.333 member


Reged: 21/02/05
Posts: 490
Loc: Chicago & SE Wisconsin
Re: SHOW ME!! Brit Singles??? [Re: Mike_Bailey]
      #106197 - 28/05/08 01:33 AM

I recall that they did some on commercial actions about ten years ago (was it a Ruger No.1?) In any event, that should be interesting, although given the level that Martini Hagn and others are currently functioning and the level of fit, finish, and engraving on a M&H in 25-06 I own, H&H will have its work cut out for them. Be interesting to see price in comparison to the current builders as well. Dave

--------------------
Time Wounds All Heels

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Anonymous
Unregistered




Re: SHOW ME!! Brit Singles??? [Re: Mike_Bailey]
      #106198 - 28/05/08 02:32 AM

I hear (H&H) is going to be using the Hagn action this time around as well. 17,000 pounds sterling is what I hear starting will be.. The 2 M&H that Caswell had came from me via there last owner I was second in line , neat guns but they took me almost a year to move them. There take downs are a much better investment for the money.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
dnovo
.333 member


Reged: 21/02/05
Posts: 490
Loc: Chicago & SE Wisconsin
Re: SHOW ME!! Brit Singles??? [Re: ]
      #106208 - 28/05/08 04:51 AM

I have two takedowns, one in a 300H&H and one in 470. At roughly twice the price of a Canadian Hagn, and about twice what some of the better custom makers charge for a bespoke gun on a Hagn action, H&H is going to have to produce something really spectacular for that price. Dave

--------------------
Time Wounds All Heels

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
HuviusModerator
.416 member


Reged: 04/11/07
Posts: 3556
Loc: Colorado
Re: SHOW ME!! Brit Singles??? [Re: Glenn_Fewless]
      #106223 - 28/05/08 03:22 PM

Here's my '69 WR. My most recent, sort of, single shot.





And a WW Greener .310 takedown I recently picked up from Champlins.
Both really neat guns for not a lot of money.





--------------------
He who lives in the past is doomed to enjoy it.

Edited by CptCurl (26/11/12 11:11 PM)

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Pages: 1


Previous topic Previous   View all topics Index   Next topic Next   Threaded Mode Threaded  

Extra information
0 registered and 141 anonymous users are browsing this forum.

Moderator:  Huvius 

Print Topic

Forum Permissions
      You cannot start new topics
      You cannot reply to topics
      HTML is disabled
      UBBCode is enabled

Rating:
Topic views: 11930

Rate this topic

Jump to

Contact Us NitroExpress.com

Powered by UBB.threads™ 6.5.5


Home | Ezine | Forums | Links | Contact


Copyright 2003 to 2011 - all rights reserved