Forums.NitroExpress.com

Home | Ezine | Forums | Links | Contact NitroExpress.com: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899

*** Enjoy NitroExpress.com? Participate and join in. ***

You are not logged in. [Login]

Main Index · Search · Active Topics
New user · Who's Online · FAQ · Calendar

Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Single Shots & Combination Guns

Pages: 1 | 2 | >> (show all)

NitroX
.700 member

Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39245
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...

Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899
#374491 - 26/02/23 04:03 AM

Former rifle of Frederick Selous. This is a Manlicher .256 falling block built by Holland & Holland in 1899. The rifle sold at auction in London for 32,400 GB Stirling.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

Edited by NitroX (03/03/23 01:32 AM)

Post Extras:

lancaster
.470 member

Reged: 06/05/08
Posts: 8727
Loc: There's a lighthouse in the mi...

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: NitroX]
#374618 - 28/02/23 10:25 PM

thats impressive for a single shot rifle but if the provenance is given I can understand it

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians

Post Extras:

NitroX
.700 member

Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39245
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: NitroX]
#374682 - 03/03/23 01:32 AM

Quote:

Former rifle of Frederick Selous. This is a Manlicher .256 falling block built by Holland & Holland in 1899. The rifle sold at auction in London for 32,400 GB Stirling.

Done.

Anyone know of or have more photos, catalogue description?

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

Post Extras:

degoins
.333 member

Reged: 28/02/06
Posts: 427
Loc: SC, USA

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: NitroX]
#374692 - 03/03/23 05:56 AM

What a beauty!!

Post Extras:

93x64mm
.416 member

Reged: 07/12/11
Posts: 3987
Loc: Nth QLD Australia

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: degoins]
#374694 - 03/03/23 07:02 AM

Marvellous engraving as well!

Post Extras:

kuduae
.400 member

Reged: 13/01/10
Posts: 1775
Loc: middle of Germany

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: 93x64mm]
#374704 - 03/03/23 08:24 AM

Possibly the rifle shown in this picture?

Post Extras:

DarylS
.700 member

Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26510
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: kuduae]
#374712 - 03/03/23 10:18 AM

Yes- possible, but this barrel in the picture looks heavier. But - maybe not.

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

Post Extras:

prairie_ghost
.300 member

Reged: 19/07/08
Posts: 129
Loc: casper, wy

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: DarylS]
#374713 - 03/03/23 11:09 AM

Rifle in the picture has a different rear sight base, forend length and looks to be missing a piece of wood behind the forend tip. The other is a lovely rifle.

Post Extras:

Marrakai
.416 member

Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 3482
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: prairie_ghost]
#374714 - 03/03/23 11:15 AM

IIRC the rifle leaning against the wagon wheel is usually labelled as a Gibbs Farquharson when that picture is reproduced.

Doesn't mean it was one though!

Regardless, Selous obviously had good taste in Farquharsons!
Nice to see the H&H example well-photographed.

--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

Post Extras:

DarylS
.700 member

Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26510
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: prairie_ghost]
#374716 - 03/03/23 11:45 AM

Quote:

Rifle in the picture has a different rear sight base, forend length and looks to be missing a piece of wood behind the forend tip. The other is a lovely rifle.

Spot-on! The barrel is also quite shiny in the Selous picture and may or may not have a rib longer than the sight base.

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

Post Extras:

Waidmannsheil
.400 member

Reged: 19/04/13
Posts: 2377
Loc: Melbourne Australia

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: DarylS]
#374722 - 03/03/23 01:52 PM

The H&H model also seems to have a full length Rib.

Matt.

--------------------
There is nothing wrong with vegetarian food, so long as there is meat with it.

Post Extras:

NitroX
.700 member

Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39245
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: Waidmannsheil]
#374740 - 03/03/23 08:33 PM

I went back to the source posting of the image. It was shared again recently. The original post was eight years ago. No other images.

If someone paid GBP32,000 for it, I assume the providence was established?

I too had a good look at the rifle in the Selous picture. It does look a bit different.

If it was a Gibbs, was it reported as a .256 or a larger cartridge?

The other possibility is, is the rifle a photograph actually an H&H?

I trust less and less on the internet nowadays.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

Post Extras:

NitroX
.700 member

Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39245
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: NitroX]
#374749 - 03/03/23 10:08 PM

From the same source, original source unknown:

Quote:

Frederick Selous was born in England in the year of 1851, his father was the Chairman of the London Stock Exchange. At the age of 19 he left England for Africa in the hope of being a professional big game hunter. Selous took with him 400 GB Sterling and by the age of 25 was regarded as one of the finest ever ivory hunters. Selous was famed for using 4 bore black powder muzzleloaders, between 1874 and 1876 he shot 78 elephant with his 4 bore, he eventually gave up on his rifle after a double discharge !!!, this was caused by a miss fire and then another bullet and primer being placed over a non fired off charge. Selous complained of the problematic recoil under normal firing. Selous preferred just two calibres in time, and after field testing many Best gun makers "gifts" he declared that the .256 was most favoured for smaller game and the .450 for larger and dangerous game, his most favoured makers were Gibbs of Bristol and Holland & Holland of London. Selous was a personal friend of President Teddy Roosevelt, both Selous and Roosevelt went on safari to East Africa in the
year of 1909 -1910. Selous went into battle during the First World War, he was an avid collector and documenter who carried a butterfly net during battle, it was in the year of 1917 and the 4th of January when on patrol in Tanzania along the banks of the Rufiji River he was shot and killed by a German sniper, the following year his son was also killed in action. Selous left a colossal legacy of his hunting and conservation exploits around the globe, he visited three continents to include America and Canada. From these exploits came 524 mammals to include 19 lions and over 5,000 other plant and animal specimens. These specimens are housed in the Natural History Museum in London, England. As a tribute to this great man the Museum unveiled a bronze statue for his efforts, this statue greets visitors in the main entrance hall as you enter. Selous is pictured here with a Holland & Holland (Woodward patented) .256 falling block rifle. Compiled by Adam J. Lane.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

Post Extras:

kuduae
.400 member

Reged: 13/01/10
Posts: 1775
Loc: middle of Germany

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: NitroX]
#374750 - 03/03/23 10:22 PM

If you look at the action shape of the rifle in the old Selous photo, it is not a Gibbs – Farquharson as often mistaken for. In fact it is a Holland & Holland 1894 Holland – Woodward patent action. Truesdell lists Selous with three such single shot H&H rifles, a .256, a .303 and a .375 NE.

Post Extras:

Huvius
.416 member

Reged: 04/11/07
Posts: 3524
Loc: Colorado

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: kuduae]
#374782 - 04/03/23 11:16 AM

The rifle against the ox cart is 100% a Holland Woodward.

I'd bet it is one that he sent back to H&H to get rebarreled. I think he had two of them rebarreled.

--------------------
He who lives in the past is doomed to enjoy it.

Post Extras:

jvw
.300 member

Reged: 15/05/08
Posts: 100
Loc: Australia

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: Huvius]
#374874 - 06/03/23 01:05 PM

The rifle leaning against the oxcart is a Holland Woodward in .303. It was one of only two made before H&H had to make changes to the action to avoid infringing on the Gibbs-Farquharson patents. It is also the one FC Selous rifle that hasn't surfaced, and nobody seems to know its current owner or whereabouts.

A good friend of mine owns the other so-called first pattern (by me, for lack of a proper description) Holland Woodward. It is also a .303 and was ordered for a prominent ZAR Boer general as a gift by a wealthy Jewish businessman in 1895.

The .256 that is the subject of this post is now in the Bill Jones collection.

Post Extras:

Rockdoc
.400 member

Reged: 07/12/06
Posts: 1212
Loc: NSW, Australia

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: jvw]
#374919 - 07/03/23 07:27 PM

jvw thank you. I had forgotten Bills name.

I bid on that rifle I think, 2011, I was in the bush in Tanz. I put a bid in through Holts Spanish Agent, a member here, but the winning bid far exceeded the estimate. Same with one of Elmer Keith’s doubles IIRC. Oh and an old Royal 500/465 with fold up peep sight.

I didn’t have a satellite phone in those days. Not until after the auction did I find out. I only bid on a few things and they all sold far above reserve and what I thought was a fair price, given on costs. But that sweet little Holland single might have tempted me at the time!

Post Extras:

jvw
.300 member

Reged: 15/05/08
Posts: 100
Loc: Australia

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: Rockdoc]
#374943 - 08/03/23 10:51 AM

Quote:

jvw thank you. I had forgotten Bills name.

I bid on that rifle I think, 2011, I was in the bush in Tanz. I put a bid in through Holts Spanish Agent, a member here, but the winning bid far exceeded the estimate. Same with one of Elmer Keith’s doubles IIRC. Oh and an old Royal 500/465 with fold up peep sight.

I didn’t have a satellite phone in those days. Not until after the auction did I find out. I only bid on a few things and they all sold far above reserve and what I thought was a fair price, given on costs. But that sweet little Holland single might have tempted me at the time!

Yes, it's hard to bid against someone with the means to just keep going! If the Elmer Keith double was his Boswell .500, that ended up in the Jones collection as well! I saw it a few years ago and I'm afraid to say that Elmer had a few "alterations" made to the rifle that would make me not want to own it. It had started out life as a PHV Webley, but...

After-market buckhorn sights on a British double is just not fresh, as is chopped barrels and a white plastic spacer between the recoil pad and the stock.

If I remember correctly, the Holland .256 was one of the last rifles they made for Selous. He certainly didn't use it much, judging from the condition.

Post Extras:

rglenz
.300 member

Reged: 14/03/08
Posts: 134
Loc: w. Minn

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: jvw]
#374944 - 08/03/23 12:41 PM

With this discussion on Holland/Woodward single rifles here's one that went back to Africa this past fall

Post Extras:

DarylS
.700 member

Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26510
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: rglenz]
#374947 - 08/03/23 02:18 PM

Cool! Is that a Blesbuck, rglenz ?

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

Post Extras:

jvw
.300 member

Reged: 15/05/08
Posts: 100
Loc: Australia

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: rglenz]
#374951 - 08/03/23 02:48 PM

Quote:

With this discussion on Holland/Woodward single rifles here's one that went back to Africa this past fall

Nice impala and nice rifle!

Post Extras:

NitroX
.700 member

Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39245
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: jvw]
#374952 - 08/03/23 04:37 PM

Perfect rifle for an impala. You look cocky!

But no roukhee chair!

Nice photo.

I like to shoot an impala on each safari.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

Post Extras:

Waidmannsheil
.400 member

Reged: 19/04/13
Posts: 2377
Loc: Melbourne Australia

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: rglenz]
#374954 - 08/03/23 05:23 PM

Great looking rifle and very nice animal. What cartridge is it chambered for.

Matt.

--------------------
There is nothing wrong with vegetarian food, so long as there is meat with it.

Post Extras:

rglenz
.300 member

Reged: 14/03/08
Posts: 134
Loc: w. Minn

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: Waidmannsheil]
#374963 - 08/03/23 11:02 PM

Matt, it's a .375 flanged mag.

Post Extras:

DarylS
.700 member

Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26510
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: rglenz]
#374970 - 09/03/23 03:35 AM

Hmmm - I thought Impala were lighter in colour.
Yeah- should have googled it - horn shape is similar, but white face and larger/heavier build.

--------------------
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V

Post Extras:

NitroX
.700 member

Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39245
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: rglenz]
#374971 - 09/03/23 04:39 AM

Quote:

Matt, it's a .375 flanged mag.

I thought it was a .256 but a .375 will work!

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

Post Extras:

Waidmannsheil
.400 member

Reged: 19/04/13
Posts: 2377
Loc: Melbourne Australia

Re: Selous H&,H Falling block .256 1899 [Re: rglenz]
#374981 - 09/03/23 08:36 AM

Fantastic choice. Is it original or was it re-chambered to that. Do you have any more pics of the rifle.

Matt.

--------------------
There is nothing wrong with vegetarian food, so long as there is meat with it.

Edited by Waidmannsheil (09/03/23 01:38 PM)

Post Extras:

Pages: 1 | 2 | >> (show all)

Extra information

0 registered and 21 anonymous users are browsing this forum.

Moderator: Huvius

Print Topic

Forum Permissions
      You cannot start new topics
      You cannot reply to topics
      HTML is disabled
      UBBCode is enabled

Rating:
Topic views: 2881

Jump to

NitroExpress.com

Home | Ezine | Forums | Links | Contact