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new_guy
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www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED
      #53802 - 02/04/06 01:42 AM

As some of you have already seen from the new website, HEYM USA has a new model double available.

In addition to the well-known 88B "Safari" model, here is the first of the new 88B "PH" models.

It's the exact same gun as the 88B "Safari" - without the engraving.

Over and over again, I’ve heard requests for a true "working gun" with emphasis placed on fit, finish and function above the aesthetics.


Well, here it is.






To generate more interest in this new model, we're offering introductory pricing. (Sorry, but I can't "advertise" the price here). I CAN say that this model lists for about $2K less than 88B Safari model.

So, if you're in the market, send me a P.M. for pricing.

The annual factory price increase is set to go into effect May 1... so orders for new HEYMs will need to placed a week or so before that date to get them at this "introductory price."

The new website is still "under construction" but you can visit it here... www.heymusa.com

Available calibers for the 88B "Safari" & "PH" models include:

375 H&H Belted Mag
375 H&H Flanged Mag
416 Rigby
500/416 N.E.
458 Win Mag.
450 3&1/4" NE
470 NE
500 NE

Standard features for both models include:
>>>Articulated (Hinged) front trigger
>>>Intercepting sears
>>>And auto-ejectors

NitroX has OK'd the posting of this offer here.

--------------------
www.heymUSA.com

Edited by new_guy (12/04/06 06:13 AM)


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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: new_guy]
      #53805 - 02/04/06 02:40 AM

A damned nice looking clean usuable double rifle.

I myself would love one in .500/.416 setup for a QD scope. Would make a dandy dangerous game and heavy plains game rifle.





--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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EricD
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricing [Re: new_guy]
      #53817 - 02/04/06 02:58 AM

It's great that Heym are now making a "tool" without the engravings, but I must admit I would have hoped they had knocked off a bit more than US$2000 in price reduction. Which it sounds like will be going up in a months time anyway!

Erik


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500grains
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: EricD]
      #53820 - 02/04/06 03:11 AM

How much are they?

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gryphon
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: 500grains]
      #53840 - 02/04/06 08:07 AM

I clicked on their "bolt rifles" heading on their website but couldnt get a reponse...is it me or an all over problem with their site?

--------------------
Get off the chair away from the desk and get out in the bush and enjoy life.


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new_guy
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: gryphon]
      #53845 - 02/04/06 08:38 AM

"The new website is still "under construction" but you can visit it here... www.heymusa.com"



Sorry, parts of the website are still under construction...you guys are getting a sneak-peek at the site.

--------------------
www.heymUSA.com


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Grizzly
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: new_guy]
      #53863 - 02/04/06 11:31 AM

New Guy,

I take it that your offer on AR also extends to NE? A few of us on NE are not registered on AR. And we all have our own reasons.

Will the folks on NE get the same deal?

--------------------
SCI Life Member
DSC Life Member
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mikeh416Rigby
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricing [Re: new_guy]
      #53874 - 02/04/06 12:10 PM

IMHO that is a fine looking, no nonsense, working gun. Wish I had the bucks.

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new_guy
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: Grizzly]
      #53880 - 02/04/06 02:19 PM

In reply to:

New Guy,

I take it that your offer on AR also extends to NE? A few of us on NE are not registered on AR. And we all have our own reasons.

Will the folks on NE get the same deal?




Yes, the offers are the same.

--------------------
www.heymUSA.com


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AzGuy
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: new_guy]
      #53881 - 02/04/06 02:57 PM

Sorry, I don't know what "AR" is... so what is the price?

--------------------
Hike the Grand Canyon, you will never be the same!


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gryphon
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: new_guy]
      #53956 - 03/04/06 11:23 AM

"The new website is still "under construction" but you can visit it here... www.heymusa.com"


Same site that i checked ..same problem,bolt rifles wont open...bugger!

--------------------
Get off the chair away from the desk and get out in the bush and enjoy life.


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mehulkamdar
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricing [Re: new_guy]
      #53993 - 03/04/06 05:14 PM

New Guy,

Will you be selling the Heym kipplaufs, drillings and bolt rifles as well or are you only going to sell their double rifles? Very nice site and fine rifles.

Thanks for posting.

--------------------
The Ark was made by amateurs. Experts built the Titanic.

Mehul Kamdar


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500grains
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricing [Re: mehulkamdar]
      #54027 - 04/04/06 02:18 AM

There was a Heym Express Rifle in 500 A2 on Cabelas website, but someone bought it before I found out the price. Did any of you guys notice the price on that rifle?

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k80
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricing [Re: 500grains]
      #54072 - 04/04/06 12:46 PM

Does anyone know if this is factory
funded venture or an individual importing
some rifles? Just curious as to levels
of support, local factory service,parts
etc..
It is a very handsome rifle.

--------------------
Ken
San Antonio

Welcome to South Texas


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rgp
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: Grizzly]
      #54082 - 04/04/06 03:56 PM

In reply to:

I take it that your offer on AR also extends to NE? A few of us on NE are not registered on AR. And we all have our own reasons.

Will the folks on NE get the same deal?




I am registered on AR however I no longer post there nor do I even look at the site.

The owner of AR is someone who obviously does not like Americans (ME!), Australians (I'm not Aussie but I've lived there!), or any other non-Islamic Middle Eastern type. Read his opinions in the political forum there if you think I am mistaken.

That is why I no longer post there and no longer browse the AR site.

I apologize for using the thread to voice a complaint.

Richard.


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Northman
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: rgp]
      #54346 - 07/04/06 10:27 AM

I belive saeed whent to school in america, he has american friends, and when clinton was in office he used to bash him as well.. thats what I have read.




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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: Northman]
      #54361 - 07/04/06 03:46 PM

Hey who cares what Saeed Al-Maktoum has done or not or what his politics are. Leave the AR crap over there please. That IS one of the rules here.

A lot of members here have come here to get away from that sort of thing.

Lets talk about Double Rifles, and on this thread Heym doubles instead.



--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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DoubleD
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: NitroX]
      #54387 - 08/04/06 04:25 AM

Okay you gurus who think I know nothing because I don't study doubles, educate me about Doubles!.

Tell me what this rifle is and all about chopper lumps and in your face or off your face and front locks and back locks and dolls head and stuff like

Tell what this gun is?



--------------------
DD, Ret.


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400NitroExpress
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: DoubleD]
      #54398 - 08/04/06 08:20 AM

Geeze. Post Toasties a little soggy this morning?
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

--------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."


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Peterb
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: DoubleD]
      #54408 - 08/04/06 10:36 AM

Okay you gurus who think I know nothing because I don't study doubles, educate me about Doubles!.

Tell me what this rifle is and all about chopper lumps and in your face or off your face and front locks and back locks and dolls head and stuff like

Tell what this gun is?

First of all, it is a boxlock as opposed to a sidelock which has the action attached to the side locks. It is also does not have Ornamental Strengthening Plates which is a boxlock which looks like a sidelock. Next, it does not have the useless side clips which may theoretically give side strength, but winde up being excellent little knives for cutting fingers when reloading. It does not have a dolls head but does have a Greener crossbolt which slides though holes in the upper tang coming off the rear of the barrels. I imagine it is an Anson & Deeley system but haven't seen a Heym in some time and forget. I imagine it has two other locking lugs, probably a Purdey double underbolt system. It is also a "clam shell" gun meaning there is extra steel on the side of the action to give added strength. It is like the Searcy PH model in this. The Heym (maybe or maybe not this model) has ejectors which can be turned off if preferred.

Any other questions?


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tinker
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: Peterb]
      #54411 - 08/04/06 11:07 AM

It's not a clamshell action.
It's a reinforced action.

You drinking?


--Tinker

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...


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DoubleD
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: Peterb]
      #54415 - 08/04/06 12:27 PM

Now we are learning something

In reply to:

First of all, it is a boxlock as opposed to a sidelock which has the action attached to the side locks. It is also does not have Ornamental Strengthening Plates which is a boxlock which looks like a sidelock.


Got that one figured out

In reply to:

Next, it does not have the useless side clips which may theoretically give side strength, but winde up being excellent little knives for cutting fingers when reloading.


I don't understand this one. Where are these side clips and what do they look like?

In reply to:

It does not have a dolls head but does have a Greener crossbolt which slides though holes in the upper tang coming off the rear of the barrels.


This part I understand. The upper tang is straight sided where it comes down into the action body. The cross bolt must be the oval shape on the upper section of the action behind the breech face.

In reply to:

I imagine it is an Anson & Deeley system but haven't seen a Heym in some time and forget.


You will have to explain this one.

In reply to:

I imagine it has two other locking lugs, probably a Purdey double underbolt system.


I can visualize this and might recognize it if I saw it.

In reply to:

It is also a "clam shell" gun meaning there is extra steel on the side of the action to give added strength. It is like the Searcy PH model in this.


Extra steel where on the sides?

In reply to:

The Heym (maybe or maybe not this model) has ejectors which can be turned off if preferred.


This is pretty straight forward.


--------------------
DD, Ret.


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Peterb
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: DoubleD]
      #54423 - 08/04/06 02:56 PM

Clamshell is a description of the added metal to the exterior side of the action body just where it comes into contact with the barrels. On some (mainly German) guns, these are in the shape of a clamshell, hence, the name. This one, like the Searcy, is a skinny clamshell (lets call it a razor clam). The added metal strengthenes that area.

Side clips: In Brit terminology, these are attached at the "canons", or "detonators". Aussies often call these "boobs" for obvious reasons. These are the rounded areas on the upper frame which face into the rearwardmost part of the barrels. The butt part of the shell case presses against them. Am I getting too personal here? I hear the Aussies are shy. In any event, instead of being flat at this point, some guns have "clips" which fit into the sides of the barrels. Theoretically, this provides a bit of strengthening reinforcement for the eccentric loads of a SxS. In truth, they are merely for cutting the fingers of the serfs who quickly load our brace of doubles. Musn't let them think they are too adept at these things.

As for Anson and Dealy, it is the basic locking/design system of most doubles since about 1880 or thereabouts. This excepts the French who are too weird to copy (vid. Darne system). Repeat after me, "The French copy no one, and no one copies the French."


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banzaibird
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: DoubleD]
      #54424 - 08/04/06 03:01 PM

Well I looked around and found a couple of pics of a Sauer on my computer. I added some basic test to show you exactly what the people are trying to describe.



Bill


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banzaibird
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: DoubleD]
      #54425 - 08/04/06 03:12 PM

I'm wrong alot so take this next part with a grain of salt as there seems to be some contention growing.

I beleive most people refer this as a "clamshell" . Then this would be "reinforced" . Now as I said I've been wrong plenty of times but that seems to be the general accepted distinction between clamshell and reinforced.

Bill


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DoubleD
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: banzaibird]
      #54430 - 08/04/06 07:31 PM

I'm not sure I have the clam shelll concept down. Is it the round moulding that is below the watertable line on the outside of the action or is ith the long skinny part on the bottom of the barrel that rest on the water table?

The clips look to me to not only be little knives to cut and slash but great directionals to vent gas from a ruptured cartridge or primer in directions to cause pain and injury.

Now what about lumps and monoblocks.

Monoblock would seem to me to be a block into which the barrels were fitted, Can't recall seeing a mono block being used in a Double.

--------------------
DD, Ret.


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banzaibird
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: DoubleD]
      #54434 - 08/04/06 10:05 PM

Ok if you look at the link of the clamshell action that I included you will see that they have an extra web of metal that goes from the water table to the standing breech/actionface and wraps up around the barrels. The reinforced action simply has extra metal that goes from the sides of the water table to the standing breech. Thus it refers to extra metal on the side of the action and not to the barrels. The Heym above has a reinfoced action.

Clips were orginally designed to help with the rotational force of firing a sxs. Personally I like the look of them but I agree on the sharp part and wouldn't care for them on a DG gun that I might have to be forced to reload very quickly. Of course i wouldn't want a huge rib extension like you need for a greener crossbolt on a DG gun either. Now in all fairness I've never hunted anything more dangerous than bears so most of this could be totally wrong opion, but it is my opinion.

In the pic I had labeled earlier. The lumps would be the 2 large protrusions from the bottom of the barrels in which the bites/underbites are in.

You have monoblock correct. However there are many guns made with monoblocks. A lot of them are cheaper guns because it is easier to use monoblocks during manufactureing but there are better guns with them as well.

Bill


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Chasseur
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: banzaibird]
      #54435 - 08/04/06 10:16 PM

Banzaibird,

Thanks for the great post with the pictures!

--------------------
In regards to action he should devote himself to hunting...
-Machiavelli



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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: banzaibird]
      #54437 - 08/04/06 10:44 PM

banzaibird

Thanks for the illustrative photos and also the links to the double rifles as examples.

Sending you a PM.



--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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Marrakai
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: banzaibird]
      #54449 - 09/04/06 12:31 AM

Good pics of the clamshell action, BB. The Brits prefer to call reinforced actions 'bolstered' actions.

Bit late, but here's a pic of a big Holland with reinforced action, they managed to make the bolsters look elegant, whereas those of Searcy and Heym look a bit brutal to my eye.



--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au


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400NitroExpress
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: Marrakai]
      #54456 - 09/04/06 02:03 AM

The only action properly called a clamshell is the one in Bill's link. The Germans called it a somethingorother verschluss. As stated, a reinforced action is properly called a bolstered action.

Bolsters are very popular with gunmakers today, but are purely cosmetic and thoroughly useless. In the old days, bolstered boxlocks, like the Lancaster in Bill's link, were in the minority. The most ubiquitous of the pre-war trade built boxlocks (those from Webley, Leonard and Wilkes) never had them and, in use, those rifles were nothing if not robust. Bolsters were simply not needed. Unless the popular current argument about the relative differences in the steels is a red herring (P T Barnum never knew just how right he really was), bolsters sure as hell aren't needed on new DRs today. Just an excuse to uglify an action.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

--------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."


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new_guy
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: Marrakai]
      #54457 - 09/04/06 02:07 AM

Marrakai - you know it's not fair to compare the bolsters of a <15K rifle to a 115K rifle.

For a company to build a rifle and make a profit, they have to build it to a certain price point, i.e.: only x-# of man hours can be put into the gun.

You can get the moustache shaped bolsters on a HEYM... even in a pinless sidelock, but it obviously takes more man hours and costs more than the "PH" model.



--------------------
www.heymUSA.com


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DoubleD
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: new_guy]
      #54462 - 09/04/06 02:44 AM

I missed the links that showed the calmshell and bolster. Found them an now have that aspect figured out.

Now tell me about articulated triggers.

--------------------
DD, Ret.

Edited by DoubleD (09/04/06 02:45 AM)


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hoppdoc
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: DoubleD]
      #54467 - 09/04/06 03:32 AM

GREAT THREAD!!!!

My ignorance on double terminology is lessening somewhat!!

Thanks much to all for the time, patience, and education offered to others!

--------------------
An armed man is a citizen of his country, an unarmed man just a subject.


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400NitroExpress
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: hoppdoc]
      #54468 - 09/04/06 05:11 AM

An articulated (front) trigger has a spring loaded split spoon that swings forward in the event that the index finger strikes it during recoil of the left barrel, preventing injury to the finger. They have their place on double gameguns with straight-hand stocks, as the stock can slip through the shooting hand under recoil, allowing the finger to strike the front trigger.

They really have no place on double rifles which are almost always pistol-hand stocked. With a properly gripped and mounted double rifle, the fingers don't strike the front trigger or guard bow, regardless of caliber. However, some double rifles are provided with them, for the double trigger challenged.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

--------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."


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DoubleD
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: 400NitroExpress]
      #54469 - 09/04/06 05:20 AM

How are double rifle stocks attached, Tang screw or stock bolt or both?

--------------------
DD, Ret.


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k80
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: DoubleD]
      #54471 - 09/04/06 05:35 AM

When will we have a price ?

--------------------
Ken
San Antonio

Welcome to South Texas


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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: k80]
      #54475 - 09/04/06 05:42 AM

K80

I think "new_guy" has already said you can get the price by PMing or emailing him. Pretty simple.


--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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Marrakai
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: new_guy]
      #54489 - 09/04/06 09:46 AM

new_guy:
In reply to:

You can get the moustache shaped bolsters on a HEYM



Ooo yeah, that's much better!
Point taken about price.
BTW, never heard them called 'moustaches' before! Is that official Heym terminology?

--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
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DoubleD
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: Marrakai]
      #54500 - 09/04/06 07:31 PM

Are the bolsters decorative or functional?

How are buttstocks fastened to action on doubles?



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hoppdoc
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: NitroX]
      #54506 - 09/04/06 10:30 PM

The new PH Heym model was just placed on
GunsAmerica.com for $12,500.00.

See the bottom of the page on

http://www.gunsamerica.com/1410/1410-random-2.htm

Wish I had the their deluxe model in 500 NE--
maybe someday!


--------------------
An armed man is a citizen of his country, an unarmed man just a subject.


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banzaibird
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: DoubleD]
      #54508 - 09/04/06 10:54 PM

The bolsters were/are supposed to be a reinforcment to add strength. They are located around the root(gusset) where the standing breech meets the water table(action flat). Basically they were trying to make it stonger by adding more metal. Whether or not they do anything is again an object of some debate. As an example read 400nitroexpress's post above.

As far as throughbolt or not a lot of it depends on who the maker is and when it was made. Some use/used them however I beleive most were not.

Bill


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new_guy
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED [Re: banzaibird]
      #54616 - 12/04/06 06:15 AM

MORE PICS ADDED of the new "PH"








--------------------
www.heymUSA.com


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Grizzly
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED [Re: new_guy]
      #54622 - 12/04/06 08:01 AM

Hopdoc - the Gunsamerica listing is for Mr Newguy's competition, Eurogun imports.

Newguy - what kind of lumps are those? Can't tell from the pic.

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smicha6551
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED [Re: Grizzly]
      #54651 - 12/04/06 10:23 PM

Any thoughts on the Heym vs. Kreighoff, Merkel, or Chapuis. I know some people here don't like the Kreighoff safety/decocker, but other than that I'd like to know people's thoughts on the relative merits.

Also, thank you for providing so much info - some of the terms get thrown around and having it explaned in detail and shown with pictures really makes it clear.

Edited by smicha6551 (12/04/06 10:28 PM)


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clark7781
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED [Re: smicha6551]
      #54653 - 12/04/06 11:28 PM

There has been a lot of discussion about this in the past. Here is one link:

Merkel v. Chapuis

--------------------
Clark

Double Rifle Shooters Society
.500 NE and .577 NE


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smicha6551
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED [Re: clark7781]
      #54661 - 13/04/06 01:02 AM

Not much on the Heym in that thread (which I've read before) - I've got a decent idea on the guns other than the Heym but I'm looking for any advantage the Heym offers over the other makers, since it's a bit more expensive.

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Chasseur
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED [Re: smicha6551]
      #54664 - 13/04/06 01:35 AM

Since I've not shot one or owed one my remarks are pretty limited to the 5-7 or so I've held, looked at, etc.

Now we can all quible over asthetiques and such, but I'm not going to talk about that since that's a matter of taste. I'd say the quality of the Heym really is on another level than Chapuis or Merkel. The level of finish, wood to metal fit, etc has been better on the Heyms I've seen in general. There are exceptions, like the "hand finished" Chapuis that you can special order are much better than the "factory finish one" (of course they cost as much as a Heym so...), but in general Heyms look much better finished. I'm not an expert so I can't get into specifics, sorry. I've also been repeatedly told that they are very well regulated, but that's all second hand info.

Sorry I can't be more help

--------------------
In regards to action he should devote himself to hunting...
-Machiavelli



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new_guy
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED [Re: smicha6551]
      #54666 - 13/04/06 02:33 AM

In reply to:

Not much on the Heym in that thread (which I've read before) - I've got a decent idea on the guns other than the Heym but I'm looking for any advantage the Heym offers over the other makers, since it's a bit more expensive.




There is nothing absolute here, but certainly there is logic and reason behind the price points of new guns. Here’s an attempt at my explanation of such.

I think what's important to remember is that all of these guns are made to be sold for a profit. Therefore all have to be built to a certain price-point, i.e.: only X-number of man-hours and cost can go into each one for them to be profitable for the company.

The misconception about the price of new guns is that some makers charge more than competitors for the same quality… or that vast quality differences exist between comparably priced products… it’s just not so. The marketplace ensures that doesn't happen.

If one maker charged more for less quality than a competitor - then they wouldn’t be in business long, as buyer’s demand would weed them out with lack of sales for an inferior product that was over-priced.

So in terms of quality, the old adage stands true. You get what you pay for. The HEYM is no doubt better fit and finished than the less-expensive makes/models. They simply put more hours into building them, and –in turn- they cost more.

You’ll also see the price difference in the balance and handling characteristics of the HEYM. The guns are built with the weight “between the hands.” You’ll find this characteristic on all “Best” guns, but not on all guns.

Compared to the HEYM, neither the Chapuis nor the Merkel are built with 50% of the guns weight concentrated in the middle of the gun, i.e.: “between the hands.” They will usually balance on the hinge pin, but you’ll find the weight distributed about 50/50 for the two ends of the gun (the barrels and the butt). Merkel accomplishes this by adding a weight to the stock. Chapuis are barrel heavy and need a recoil reducer to balance them on the hinge-pin.

That’s not to take anything away from the Chapuis or the Merkel. It just goes back to profitability of the gun. Yes, they could build one with proper weight distribution, and yes they could fit and finish one as well as they HEYM, but in the end they would cost as much as the HEYM and that would move their position in the market (based on price point) to one other than the niche they’ve chosen.

Again, they’ve all decided to build a gun to a certain price point, and serve different buyers by meeting different price-points in the market.

So, is an H&H Royal a “better” gun than the HEYM?
Yes, it has more man-hours in it and in-turn, it costs more.

Could HEYM build as good a gun as H&H?
Yes, but it would cost the same as the H&H.

Is a HEYM a better gun than the Chapuis?
Yes, it has more man-hours in it and in-turn, it costs more.

Etc…
Etc…

Beyond the economics of serving a niche of the market profitably, you also have to look at the features.

The HEYM has 1) ejectors 2) hinged front trigger 3) intercepting sears

The Merkel has extractors
The Chapuis has ejectors
Neither of the latter two has intercepting sears or hinged front trigger.

The more options or features you add, the more they cost.

So how does the HEYM stack up against the Merkel and the Chapuis?
It’s different… it has more features and better balance along with better fit and finish. And because of those, it costs more. But at the same time, they are targeting a different segment of the market... HEYM's target niche is not the same as Merkel or Chapuis.

Again, each serves to fill a niche in the market place, and would not be albe to do that profitably by building in too much for too little cost.

Hope that helps put the differences in perspective.


--------------------
www.heymUSA.com


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500Nitro
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED [Re: new_guy]
      #54681 - 13/04/06 08:21 AM


new guy


Well put - that's as good an explanation as I've seen.

It's a pity alot of people put the emphasis on price but
don't look at the features.

500 Nitro


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CptCurlAdministrator
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED [Re: new_guy]
      #54697 - 13/04/06 11:30 AM

New_guy,

That Heym is certainly a clean and sharp looking rifle. Maybe I'll try one some day!

Curl


--------------------
RoscoeStephenson.com

YOUR DOUBLE RIFLE IS YOUR BEST FRIEND.



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hoppdoc
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED [Re: new_guy]
      #54698 - 13/04/06 11:39 AM

It is amazing that 95% of US hunters have probably never shot or handled a double rifle.

But once attained--
Then the Double rifle bug is a yearning,a longing and an addiction that is expensive to feed and justify.Hold it, balance it, carry it, shoulder it, then shoot it-- ENJOY IT!! How sweet it is!!

This market is very competitive and as 500 Nitro has said it is the features that obviously seperate the players and the $$ spent.

I was saving for a new car or to redo a bathroom but I guess now the only solution here is to scheme to BUY MORE DOUBLES and HUNT MORE!!

--------------------
An armed man is a citizen of his country, an unarmed man just a subject.


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CptCurlAdministrator
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED [Re: hoppdoc]
      #54699 - 13/04/06 11:47 AM

Attaboy, Hopdoc!

You have your values in good order. Who needs a car or a remodel job on a bathroom? Not me! Go for the DR!

Curl

--------------------
RoscoeStephenson.com

YOUR DOUBLE RIFLE IS YOUR BEST FRIEND.



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tinker
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED [Re: CptCurl]
      #54703 - 13/04/06 12:16 PM

No kidding-

I'll take a '72 pinto and some exposed lath and plaster around the old clawfoot tub alongside a new double rifle over fresh tile and a new wagon *without the new rifle* any old time.



--Tinker



--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...


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warden
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: 500grains]
      #54706 - 13/04/06 01:20 PM

I sent them an email, and they told me around 12.5k, intro.
Seems a bit much for a plain-jane, but a nice rifle though.


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DoubleD
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: warden]
      #54712 - 13/04/06 02:29 PM

12K and they didn't even blue it!

--------------------
DD, Ret.


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hoppdoc
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED [Re: CptCurl]
      #54719 - 13/04/06 04:50 PM

CPTCurl--

My sentiments entirely!!

Gotta keep pressing cause if I meet my maker and the wife ever gets in the gunsafe-whoa--- boy is she gonna be p*ssed!!!

She suspects though-

She is always asking--
Why do you men need nore than one rifle/handgun?!!

I perk up and I tell her-
Just like you women have so many shoes but can only wear one pair of shoes at a time--

I need more than one type/caliber of rifle!!!

Yup,You gotta fight for the right or else!!

--------------------
An armed man is a citizen of his country, an unarmed man just a subject.

Edited by hoppdoc (13/04/06 04:59 PM)


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EricD
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED [Re: smicha6551]
      #54721 - 13/04/06 05:44 PM

In reply to:

Any thoughts on the Heym vs. Kreighoff, Merkel, or Chapuis.




From the guns I've handled at a few gunshows, I'd say the Heyms had noticably better fit/finish than the Chapuis, Merkel and Kreighoff. It basically seemed like a higher quality product.

Erik


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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED [Re: EricD]
      #54726 - 13/04/06 08:34 PM

The Heym PH to me looks like a standard "plain jane" users rifle but reportedly well made (I haven't seen a PH model yet in the 'flesh') for the price point. Probably why they named it a "PH" model. Most PHs are not well 'heeled' and if they can afford an entry model, would prefer something well made and balanced, but engraving doesn't kill angy buffalos.

It isn't "blued" well the action anyway and little engraving. This can all be had with excellent engraving, the buyer just needs to pay (a lot) more. My own preference in a new modern made double rifle is minimal engraving, rather than poorly executed engraving which to my eye detracts incredibly from what otherwise might be a reasonable double rifle.

If I had the dollars to spend of course I would love fantastic engraved scenes but would rather hunt with a double than not one at all.



--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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EricD
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED [Re: NitroX]
      #54729 - 13/04/06 08:40 PM

Another thing I like about the Heym 88-B PH is that it's available in 450NE as standard. From what I have understood from the other compairable makers, this would cost a couple of thousand dollars more as an option.

Erik


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500Nitro
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED [Re: NitroX]
      #54731 - 13/04/06 09:04 PM


What's all this discussion about "blued" actions ?

What other actions are "blued ?

They aren't blued, they're hardened, either Colour Case Hardened
or hardened by a different method (I can't remember the name of it)
and left as nickel/silver finish.

Merkel do the same thing, so does Searcy so why all the crap about
the action not being "blued".

As to fit and finish, it's often reffered to as "build quality"
and those that look at the price only just dont get it and buy
the gun based on the price and don't know about it until
they try to sell the gun and buyers notice the difference.

500 Nitro


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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED [Re: 500Nitro]
      #54813 - 14/04/06 03:02 PM

500Nitro

I agree completely with your comments about so called "blued" actions, therefore the reason I put the word "blued" into quotation marks in my post above.

I think the original poster who mentioned "not being blued" may have made the comment in jest.



--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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500Nitro
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED [Re: NitroX]
      #54814 - 14/04/06 03:05 PM


NitroX,

My post was directed at others as I noticed your post
had the words "..." and even if they were in jest, I was
more commenting on getting the terminology right
and that for some, it doesn't matter what the $ are, it
is still too high !!!

500 Nitro


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smicha6551
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED [Re: 500Nitro]
      #54819 - 14/04/06 03:35 PM

I'm guessing the post was directed at me. I'll let the snippy comments pass. I've decided to go with a Searcy rifle, for a number of reasons.

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500Nitro
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED [Re: smicha6551]
      #54820 - 14/04/06 03:45 PM


smicha6551

Not only you.

Re "I've decided to go with a Searcy rifle, for a number of reasons."

I just looked at Searcy's web site and they aren't blued either !!!

500 Nitro


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tinker
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED [Re: 500Nitro]
      #54822 - 14/04/06 03:47 PM

500N-

I bet if you asked Butch Purdy Please you could get him to blue one of his rifles for you...



--Tinker

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...


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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED [Re: smicha6551]
      #54824 - 14/04/06 03:56 PM

In reply to:

I'm guessing the post was directed at me. I'll let the snippy comments pass. I've decided to go with a Searcy rifle, for a number of reasons.




No.

Good luck with your Searcy. It is good to have variety and many members also own rifles in the Searcy brand. Start a new Searcy thread if you wish to ask them about their rifles.

In reply to:

Poster: DoubleD
Subject: Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin

... and they didn't even blue it!




I think DoubleD made the comment in jest, and quite funny but not necessarily true.



--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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500Nitro
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED [Re: smicha6551]
      #54829 - 14/04/06 06:21 PM


smicha6551

I'd like to echo NitroX's comments - good choice.

By the way, can you ask butch if he'd "blue" the action !!!

500 Nitro


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DoubleD
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: DoubleD]
      #54838 - 14/04/06 11:23 PM

In reply to:

12K and they didn't even blue it!




Jimney crickets guys it was joke for crimney sakes...

--------------------
DD, Ret.


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Grizzly
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: DoubleD]
      #54849 - 15/04/06 01:00 AM

Hey, I thought it was funny!

The blued action with the glow in the dark sights. Pimp my double.

--------------------
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tinker
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: Grizzly]
      #54850 - 15/04/06 01:28 AM

I think the 'Pimp My Double' package includes vertical gold-line pinstriping on the barrel regulation wedge and gold inlaid rims around the muzzles.
Gotta have a grille on that thing!!

That and the super-lux niterjob gltra-gleam barrel blacking job.

Oh-
And instead of a single bead front sight, there's a mercedes three-point reticle in the sight-hood!

That'd be perfect out here in Downtown Oakland.
We have imapalas, jaguars, cougars...


--Tinker


--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...


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Chasseur
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: tinker]
      #54864 - 15/04/06 04:02 AM

But Tinker no hydraulics ?

--------------------
In regards to action he should devote himself to hunting...
-Machiavelli



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Grizzly
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: Chasseur]
      #54866 - 15/04/06 05:04 AM

Damn Tinker - - that's the perfect double for a drive by.....

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Peterb
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: Grizzly]
      #54872 - 15/04/06 06:00 AM

If you are going to pimp out a double, just copy the world's butt ugliest double, the Winch Mod 21 (which handles like a sow superglued to a snow shovel). Had to be a French design.

Edited by Peterb (15/04/06 06:02 AM)


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DoubleD
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: Peterb]
      #54913 - 15/04/06 03:38 PM

Are you guys describing Pimp Guns or Yuppee guns?

--------------------
DD, Ret.


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new_guy
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - introductory pricin [Re: DoubleD]
      #55503 - 23/04/06 12:04 AM

For those that were asking about the bolt guns, the "Express" is now online.

HEYM EXPRESS





--------------------
www.heymUSA.com


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new_guy
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Re: www.HEYMUSA.com new "PH" - MORE PICS ADDED [Re: new_guy]
      #56571 - 07/05/06 09:28 AM

btt

--------------------
www.heymUSA.com


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