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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Double Rifles
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LTK
.224 member


Reged: 27/02/24
Posts: 23
Loc: Alberta Canada
Iron sight dilemma.
      #383000 - 01/03/24 05:31 AM

Tried to work up some loads for a "new to me" Alex Henry .500BPE double. Found a load that is worth further investigation but have a problem. While it LOOKS like the sights may be original to the gun, as it is, it shoots 8-9" high at 50 yards. I can't even find the paper at 100 yards. I took some measurements and from what I can gather, the rear sight (100 yard leaf) is .120" higher than bore centreline than the front. That, (if my calculation are correct) would be about a 20 minutes of angle sight profile. Clearly the front sight has to be replaced or built up but I don't understand how the sights could be this far out of whack. I suspect that the front sight may have been replaced by someone with one that is too short but before I do anything, I want to be certain that I am not overlooking anything. I would prefer to replace the front sight rather than modify the one I have if anyone has one for sale. My sight installs parallel to the bore and is .177 wide (top dovetail) and .832 long. Any help or suggestion welcome. Thanks

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grandveneur
.400 member


Reged: 21/09/08
Posts: 1297
Loc: France / Germany
Re: Iron sight dilemma. [Re: LTK]
      #383001 - 01/03/24 08:07 AM

I don't know what one can recommend more than adjusting your sights so that they allow an accurate shooting with your load. It's not easy to duplicate an old BP load, but if your current load provides sufficient accuracy, no matter where now high or low, a correction of the sights, front or rear, is justified.

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3DogMike
.400 member


Reged: 29/01/15
Posts: 1414
Loc: Western Slope, Colorado USA
Re: Iron sight dilemma. [Re: grandveneur]
      #383004 - 01/03/24 10:16 AM

The load that you have decided is promising, is it BP or smokeless? Close to original velocities? That will have a measurable effect on bullet impact.

You can "file in" the rear sight (lower) if there is enough sight leaf to do so. Much better than bodgering a possibly original front sight to my mind

- Mike

--------------------
"Here's to killing people you don't like with people you do"

"Will Rogers never met a fighter pilot"
- Anon

“Always carry a flask of whiskey in case of snakebite, and furthermore always carry a small snake."
-- W. C. Fields

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Marrakai
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Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 3482
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia
Re: Iron sight dilemma. [Re: 3DogMike]
      #383006 - 01/03/24 11:11 AM

LTK:
Are you able to post good clear pics of the front and rear sights? You will need to upload them to a photo hosting site then post the link here.
I ask because there may be enough experience amongst the forum members here to suggest which of the sights (if any) may be a replacement, and how best to go about modification.
Many of us own vintage Alex Henry double rifles with which to compare your example.

I will add that shooting high with modern regulating loads is not uncommon amongst express rifles, but usually it is the bullet striking in line with the top of the bead, rather than under the center of the bead, perhaps 4 to 5 inches high at 50 yds, but yours sounds like its much higher.

Personally I prefer fitting a taller replacement caterpillar front sight rather than filing anything, but wouldn't hesitate to file-in a rear sight if it could be done in a way that retained the original lines.
Nothing worse than the top half of the "100 yds" engraving filed away...

--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

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LTK
.224 member


Reged: 27/02/24
Posts: 23
Loc: Alberta Canada
Re: Iron sight dilemma. [Re: Marrakai]
      #383007 - 01/03/24 12:51 PM

Not interested in filing or modifying the rear sight in any way so that leaves me with the front. IF one has been changed I would think it is the front as the rear looks pretty typical. This is what I have for sights.

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eagle27
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Reged: 24/01/09
Posts: 1124
Loc: Nelson, New Zealand
Re: Iron sight dilemma. [Re: LTK]
      #383008 - 01/03/24 01:56 PM

Wouldn't be hard to make another front sight to dovetail in. Doesn't take much extra height to bring POI down, had to do this on my Mauser 404 which shot 8" high at 50m after converting to 404 from 10.75x68. Built higher blade and filed down, not much higher than original blade.

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Marrakai
.416 member


Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 3482
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia
Re: Iron sight dilemma. [Re: eagle27]
      #383009 - 01/03/24 02:28 PM

What eagle27 said.
That front sight is very low so a slightly taller one should still look appropriate.
Caterpillar sights are a bit more time-consuming than blades but still fairly straight-forward to file up.

To my eye, both sights on that AH have the appearance of possible replacements, but front sights are probably easier to deal with than standing+folding leaves.

Coincidentally, I just yesterday received a Recknagel 11mm-tall front sight blade from Graeme S__ for my Type B Mauser. I had previously filed a commercial-type bead into the top of the tallest Mauser sight-blade I owned, and it was still shooting about 6-inches high with the heavier bullets I prefer.

Have fun at the vise!

--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

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LTK
.224 member


Reged: 27/02/24
Posts: 23
Loc: Alberta Canada
Re: Iron sight dilemma. [Re: Marrakai]
      #383010 - 01/03/24 02:37 PM

By my calculations I will need to raise the front sight by about .085" to put it "on" at 50 yards. Making one would probably be the simplest. Just need to get the current one off. Will need to make a tool that engages the slot in front if the blade to drive it out. I have made a LOT more intricate parts than a front sight before so this shouldn't be too difficult, was just hoping to score an original replacement

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MiBruce
.224 member


Reged: 01/02/14
Posts: 12
Loc: Michigan, USA
Re: Iron sight dilemma. [Re: LTK]
      #383021 - 02/03/24 12:05 AM

I have found many original English sights are very low and hard to see. I can see where someone might have changed them to see better. Unfortunately they didn’t get the right ones. New England Custom Guns has replacement sights like this for sale. You can get different heights and beads. That is much easier than making new ones.
Bruce

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3DogMike
.400 member


Reged: 29/01/15
Posts: 1414
Loc: Western Slope, Colorado USA
Re: Iron sight dilemma. [Re: MiBruce]
      #383031 - 02/03/24 08:43 AM

I have several antique Alexander Henry Double Rifles.
My personal opinion from looking at your pictures is that the front sight is either original or a vintage replacement.
The rear sight does not appear to be original, and not even a period correct replacement.

Just my 2˘ worth.
- Mike

--------------------
"Here's to killing people you don't like with people you do"

"Will Rogers never met a fighter pilot"
- Anon

“Always carry a flask of whiskey in case of snakebite, and furthermore always carry a small snake."
-- W. C. Fields

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LTK
.224 member


Reged: 27/02/24
Posts: 23
Loc: Alberta Canada
Re: Iron sight dilemma. [Re: 3DogMike]
      #383064 - 04/03/24 12:09 AM

Quote:

I have several antique Alexander Henry Double Rifles.
My personal opinion from looking at your pictures is that the front sight is either original or a vintage replacement.
The rear sight does not appear to be original, and not even a period correct replacement.

Just my 2˘ worth.
- Mike


Good to know. This being the only gun like this that I have ever owned, it is a bit of a learning curve. I did find an example online of the exact same front sight on a Henry SXS but it was mounted on a ramped rib (another thing that I had not seen before). Without the ramp, it is way too low to be useful. The rear sight looks much like several that I have seen online on similar guns so that had me thinking that it was perhaps original to the gun. I would love to see what your guns have for sights so I can get a feel for what should be on this one.

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85lc
.375 member


Reged: 19/01/18
Posts: 917
Loc: Georgia, USA
Re: Iron sight dilemma. [Re: LTK]
      #383081 - 05/03/24 03:52 AM

I agree with Mike. The front sught looks correct. The rear sight looks (to me) to be a replacement.

I don't like altering an original gun but I think it would be fair to modify yiur rear sight.

--------------------
RB

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